missfee said:

The Seahawks hands down.

Keep em' down

phunkdaddy said:

My first reaction was WTF are they doing when I saw Russell line up in the shotgun on the 1 yard line. Now Darrell Bevell is trying to deflect blame to the receiver Lockette. Pete Carroll should not have allowed this to happen. Now the talk is could Tom Brady be the best qb ever. Any thoughts?

I swear, I want some heads to roll over that bs call....hell, I wasn't this upset when my Steelers lost a few years back because it wasn't such an absurd situation. I cannot wrap my brain around that call.

Brady the best ever? Not even close. There's Staubach, Montana, Bradshaw, Stabler, Tarkenton, Namath, etc.....

Graycap23 said:

Graycap23 said:

Seattle repeats and beat the Patriots by 3.

31-28

I was 20 seconds from my prediction when Seattle tried 2 get "cute".

What a boneheaded play call.

Way to call it Gray! I'm still in disbelief over that ridiculous throw.

Graycap23 said:

Seattle repeats and beat the Patriots by 3.

31-28

2 yards away from earning full Oracle status.

babynoz said:

phunkdaddy said:

My first reaction was WTF are they doing when I saw Russell line up in the shotgun on the 1 yard line. Now Darrell Bevell is trying to deflect blame to the receiver Lockette. Pete Carroll should not have allowed this to happen. Now the talk is could Tom Brady be the best qb ever. Any thoughts?

I swear, I want some heads to roll over that bs call....hell, I wasn't this upset when my Steelers lost a few years back because it wasn't such an absurd situation. I cannot wrap my brain around that call.

Brady the best ever? Not even close. There's Staubach, Montana, Bradshaw, Stabler, Tarkenton, Namath, etc.....

Didn't he beat Montana's record???? Or a couple of them anyway?

"Not even close" I think, is not fair. He is up there with the greats....and his career is not finished yet. Just give the damn guy some credit already.

Graycap23 said:

uPtoWnNY said:

Unitas, Montana, then pick 'em. Like Jim Brown set the standard for RBs, Johnny U did the same for QBs.

Unitas...............before my time.

I think Unitas, Graham, and Starr are always in the conversation of greatest ever.

But in my lifetime, it's Joe, and everyone else.

One thing I'll say for Brady is that his competition in the Super Bowl was probably stronger than Joe's. Brady beat the Rams and Seahawks when both were in their title windows and had won SBs. He also beat good, but not great, teams in Carolina and Philly. Those teams collectively are stronger than the teams Joe beat (2 good Bengals teams, and 2 one-trick-pony teams in Miami and Denver).

I still take Joe, though. He was undefeated in Super Bowls, was more mobile and better outside the pocket than Brady, and is the prototype for West Coast QBs. His 80's Niners were the best of a loaded conference that included title-winners in the 'Skins, Giants, Bears and other talented teams such as the Cowboys, Eagles and Vikings.

[img:$uid]http://images20.fotki.com/v193/photos/2/215922/13588296/Screenshot20150202at1_36_16PM-vi.png[/img:$uid]

CarrieCee said:

babynoz said:

I swear, I want some heads to roll over that bs call....hell, I wasn't this upset when my Steelers lost a few years back because it wasn't such an absurd situation. I cannot wrap my brain around that call.

Brady the best ever? Not even close. There's Staubach, Montana, Bradshaw, Stabler, Tarkenton, Namath, etc.....

Didn't he beat Montana's record???? Or a couple of them anyway?

"Not even close" I think, is not fair. He is up there with the greats....and his career is not finished yet. Just give the damn guy some credit already.

Any time a G.O.A.T. discussion comes up I don't talk only stats. I'm speaking all-around best. Anybody who knows the game realizes that there have been some outstanding QBs who don't even have a Super Bowl ring....Marino would be an example.

Brady is up there with the greats, sure....but that is not the same as best ever, which is the question that was asked.

Brady gets plenty of credit from me... don't get overly defensive just because I don't think he's "dreamy". I can't even take somebody seriously who would bring up girly talk like that in a football discussion....I tried to make a joke about it before but you did it again.

Don't get butt hurt and confuse an objective discussion as a diss towards Brady.

namepeace said:

Graycap23 said:

Unitas...............before my time.

I think Unitas, Graham, and Starr are always in the conversation of greatest ever.

But in my lifetime, it's Joe, and everyone else.

One thing I'll say for Brady is that his competition in the Super Bowl was probably stronger than Joe's. Brady beat the Rams and Seahawks when both were in their title windows and had won SBs. He also beat good, but not great, teams in Carolina and Philly. Those teams collectively are stronger than the teams Joe beat (2 good Bengals teams, and 2 one-trick-pony teams in Miami and Denver).

I still take Joe, though. He was undefeated in Super Bowls, was more mobile and better outside the pocket than Brady, and is the prototype for West Coast QBs. His 80's Niners were the best of a loaded conference that included title-winners in the 'Skins, Giants, Bears and other talented teams such as the Cowboys, Eagles and Vikings.

^^This....

Excellent analysis.

babynoz said:

CarrieCee said:

Didn't he beat Montana's record???? Or a couple of them anyway?

"Not even close" I think, is not fair. He is up there with the greats....and his career is not finished yet. Just give the damn guy some credit already.

Any time a G.O.A.T. discussion comes up I don't talk only stats. I'm speaking all-around best. Anybody who knows the game realizes that there have been some outstanding QBs who don't even have a Super Bowl ring....Marino would be an example.

Brady is up there with the greats, sure....but that is not the same as best ever, which is the question that was asked.

Brady gets plenty of credit from me... don't get overly defensive just because I don't think he's "dreamy". I can't even take somebody seriously who would bring up girly talk like that in a football discussion....I tried to make a joke about it before but you did it again.

Don't get butt hurt and confuse an objective discussion as a diss towards Brady.

The "dreamy" talk is a joke and to butthurt the haters. It worked!

CarrieCee said:

babynoz said:

Any time a G.O.A.T. discussion comes up I don't talk only stats. I'm speaking all-around best. Anybody who knows the game realizes that there have been some outstanding QBs who don't even have a Super Bowl ring....Marino would be an example.

Brady is up there with the greats, sure....but that is not the same as best ever, which is the question that was asked.

Brady gets plenty of credit from me... don't get overly defensive just because I don't think he's "dreamy". I can't even take somebody seriously who would bring up girly talk like that in a football discussion....I tried to make a joke about it before but you did it again.

Don't get butt hurt and confuse an objective discussion as a diss towards Brady.

The "dreamy" talk is a joke and to butthurt the haters. It worked!

That's cute....the rest of us are talking football though.

uPtoWnNY said:

Graycap23 said:

Tom is good.............but no.

Montana, Staubach, Elway, then Brady.

The 4 SB's he won 3 by a FG and one by this boneheaded play.

Unitas, Montana, then pick 'em. Like Jim Brown set the standard for RBs, Johnny U did the same for QBs.

I can't remember a playoffs with so many heartbreaking losses - Lions/Cowboys, Cowboys/Packers, Packers/Seahawks and now this.

babynoz said:

CarrieCee said:

The "dreamy" talk is a joke and to butthurt the haters. It worked!

That's cute....the rest of us are talking football though.

Lighten up, buttercup.

The CONSPIRACY of that last play:

The theory goes something like this. Russell Wilson is your young clean-cut God-fearing media-perfect quarterback. If one was creating a superstar face to market for the twenty-first century, chances are they would look, sound and basically be Russell Wilson. He’s Derek Jeter with a Bible, your “biracial angel” of our times. Marshawn Lynch is… Marshawn Lynch, and if you haven’t figured out what that means after the past two weeks, then you haven’t been paying attention.

The theory goes that there were major financial, public relations and football reasons for Russell Wilson and not Lynch to be the one who ends the game in glory. If he throws that touchdown for the victory, Wilson is almost certainly the Super Bowl MVP. He gets the commercial. He gets to stand with the commissioner. And oh, by the way, he also gets his new contract, one that will fasten his prime, at only 26 years old, to the Seattle franchise. Marshawn Lynch is also due a new contract. Marshawn Lynch, had he punched that ball over the goal line, would get to be the one handed the MVP trophy. Marshawn Lynch maybe gets on the mic to say Lord knows what.

CarrieCee said:

babynoz said:

That's cute....the rest of us are talking football though.

Lighten up, buttercup.

Whatsaamatter? You wanna talk makeup and shoes too?

Graycap23 said:

The CONSPIRACY of that last play:

The theory goes something like this. Russell Wilson is your young clean-cut God-fearing media-perfect quarterback. If one was creating a superstar face to market for the twenty-first century, chances are they would look, sound and basically be Russell Wilson. He’s Derek Jeter with a Bible, your “biracial angel” of our times. Marshawn Lynch is… Marshawn Lynch, and if you haven’t figured out what that means after the past two weeks, then you haven’t been paying attention.

The theory goes that there were major financial, public relations and football reasons for Russell Wilson and not Lynch to be the one who ends the game in glory. If he throws that touchdown for the victory, Wilson is almost certainly the Super Bowl MVP. He gets the commercial. He gets to stand with the commissioner. And oh, by the way, he also gets his new contract, one that will fasten his prime, at only 26 years old, to the Seattle franchise. Marshawn Lynch is also due a new contract. Marshawn Lynch, had he punched that ball over the goal line, would get to be the one handed the MVP trophy. Marshawn Lynch maybe gets on the mic to say Lord knows what.

I don't get it....

babynoz said:

Graycap23 said:

The CONSPIRACY of that last play:

The theory goes something like this. Russell Wilson is your young clean-cut God-fearing media-perfect quarterback. If one was creating a superstar face to market for the twenty-first century, chances are they would look, sound and basically be Russell Wilson. He’s Derek Jeter with a Bible, your “biracial angel” of our times. Marshawn Lynch is… Marshawn Lynch, and if you haven’t figured out what that means after the past two weeks, then you haven’t been paying attention.

The theory goes that there were major financial, public relations and football reasons for Russell Wilson and not Lynch to be the one who ends the game in glory. If he throws that touchdown for the victory, Wilson is almost certainly the Super Bowl MVP. He gets the commercial. He gets to stand with the commissioner. And oh, by the way, he also gets his new contract, one that will fasten his prime, at only 26 years old, to the Seattle franchise. Marshawn Lynch is also due a new contract. Marshawn Lynch, had he punched that ball over the goal line, would get to be the one handed the MVP trophy. Marshawn Lynch maybe gets on the mic to say Lord knows what.

I don't get it....

It sounds about right............

This article makes some good points although I wouldn't necessarily list Qbs in the exact same order as the writer.

http://wallstcheatsheet.c...?a=viewall

babynoz said:

This article makes some good points although I wouldn't necessarily list Qbs in the exact same order as the writer.

http://wallstcheatsheet.c...?a=viewall

There are so many factors into who u pick.

There have been great QB's like Tarkington who never won but was great on all accounts but his team wasn't strong enough.

babynoz said:

CarrieCee said:

Lighten up, buttercup.

Whatsaamatter? You wanna talk makeup and shoes too?

Sure. Let's start a new thread though. This one is about football.

Graycap23 said:

babynoz said:

This article makes some good points although I wouldn't necessarily list Qbs in the exact same order as the writer.

http://wallstcheatsheet.c...?a=viewall

There are so many factors into who u pick.

There have been great QB's like Tarkington who never won but was great on all accounts but his team wasn't strong enough.

Exactly!

There are many factors that go into what makes a QB great.

CarrieCee said:

babynoz said:

Whatsaamatter? You wanna talk makeup and shoes too?

Sure. Let's start a new thread though. This one is about football.

Nope, I actually posted an article about football...be sure to read it.

Graycap23 said:

babynoz said:

This article makes some good points although I wouldn't necessarily list Qbs in the exact same order as the writer.

http://wallstcheatsheet.c...?a=viewall

There are so many factors into who u pick.

There have been great QB's like Tarkington who never won but was great on all accounts but his team wasn't strong enough.

When it comes to the art of QBing, I'd take Young in my top tier. He was a true master.

Started a new thread on the G-QB-O-A-T topic . . .

namepeace said:

Graycap23 said:

There are so many factors into who u pick.

There have been great QB's like Tarkington who never won but was great on all accounts but his team wasn't strong enough.

When it comes to the art of QBing, I'd take Young in my top tier. He was a true master.

No doubt.

Graycap23 said:

namepeace said:

When it comes to the art of QBing, I'd take Young in my top tier. He was a true master.

No doubt.

It took a vicious Leonard Marshall hit on Montana in the 1991 NFC title game for Young to replace him on the depth chart. But when I think of the fact that Young was riding the bench in his prime behind Montana, I can't help but consider how many rings Young could have won. The timing was awful, he got the gig just as the Cowboys were on the rise.

namepeace said:

Graycap23 said:

No doubt.

It took a vicious Leonard Marshall hit on Montana in the 1991 NFC title game for Young to replace him on the depth chart. But when I think of the fact that Young was riding the bench in his prime behind Montana, I can't help but consider how many rings Young could have won. The timing was awful, he got the gig just as the Cowboys were on the rise.

He rode the bench behind Deberg in Tampa as well. (if my memory is correct)

namepeace said:

Graycap23 said:

No doubt.

It took a vicious Leonard Marshall hit on Montana in the 1991 NFC title game for Young to replace him on the depth chart. But when I think of the fact that Young was riding the bench in his prime behind Montana, I can't help but consider how many rings Young could have won. The timing was awful, he got the gig just as the Cowboys were on the rise.

That hit on Joe Cool was perfectly legal, and one of the greatest moments in Big Blue history.

uPtoWnNY said:

namepeace said:

It took a vicious Leonard Marshall hit on Montana in the 1991 NFC title game for Young to replace him on the depth chart. But when I think of the fact that Young was riding the bench in his prime behind Montana, I can't help but consider how many rings Young could have won. The timing was awful, he got the gig just as the Cowboys were on the rise.

That hit on Joe Cool was perfectly legal, and one of the greatest moments in Big Blue history.

Now see there?

I never said it was illegal, nor did I say it wasn't a great play.

Anybody who's played defense at any level (including me) dreams of making such a big play.

But that hit takes your breath away, it was ferocious AND it effectively ended Montana's Niners career.

[Edited 2/2/15 13:31pm]