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Printableminneapolisgenius said: EllisDee said: LaVisHh said: :
What's up with that??? 
I mean, seriously. Why do you think this happens? Not every couple suddenly becomes too busy for it, but somehow those marriage papers get signed and the sex goes down the drain. I think this is the cause of most affairs outside the marriage, and the person holding off sex from their partner is left wondering why... 
Any theories? in my scenerio, there is no one person holding out from the other... it's just a case of work schedules and everything else not matching up... i generally work from 6:30Am-5pm 5 days a week... this does not include the times that i have to come back in the evening to make sure that nothing has been destroyed or burned down... when i come home, i'm exhausted and ususally have more work waiting on me... i do most of the bill writing, checkbook balancing, cooking, etc... then i have a ton of grad school application shit that i have to wade through each day... she teaches 5 days a week and spends all of her evening time grading papers or making lesson plans... she also spends a good portion of her time sick from all of the illnesses that are passed around from those snotty nosed middle school kids... furthermore, the times that we most want it seem to be off... i'm all about it at night and (if i have the day off), first thing in the morning... i hate middle of the day sex... middle of the day sex is her favorite, but (if she has the day off) she can go for some first thing in the morning action... but she hates it last thing at night... which means, that we generally only go at it as much as our days off will allow... so, if we both have the day off (and don't have a ton of other shit to do) we'll go at it like wild animals... but that doesn't happen all too often... this didn't become a problem with marriage... we got married in june and it had been a problem for about a year so before that... in the beginning when we were both in school, we would just go at it all the time, because we had the spare time to do it... that time just doesn't exist much anymore... there's no animosity on either side... we both get frustrated at times (me moreso than her, because my sex drive is a lot higher), but we understand that there's not a lot that either of us can do about it... that's just the way shit is sometimes...  frustrated edit...
[This message was edited Thu Mar 13 6:33:51 PST 2003 by EllisDee] hehehe  Now I know what the angry face is for. ...
:LOL:...  Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo 
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langebleu said: LaVisHh said: I have enough married couples who share intimate details with me at work, to see that. They will openly share their wants and needs with me, but not their partners. ROFL - that's a bit cheeky expecting them to share their partners too. (I know that's not what you meant).
Good observation.  | |
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Cloudbuster said:   drugs are bad for me. | |
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teller said: LaVisHh said: teller said: Not asking for what we want is another common problem.
Very true. I have enough married couples who share intimate details with me at work, to see that. They will openly share their wants and needs with me, but not their partners. I think it may have to do with not wanting to be judged harshly for being open. Assertiveness is a key pillar of self-esteem and healthy living. Unfortunately, most of us were taught as children to be ashamed of sexual things...and god forbid you should like it and want it... See, that's the point right there. How can marriage be a lifetime commitment, if both people aren't fulfilling the needs of the other - again, I'm not talking outside normal needs. Does one then settle for sexual frustration for the rest of their lives? I think both have a responsibility in maintaining every aspect of the relationship. | |
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LaVisHh said: But what if you only got sex, and it was just that? Everytime you want your spouse, they made up an excuse? This goes on and on... you've talked about your sexual needs as their partner, and they say things are going to change, but never do?
What were the reasons for the relationship in the first place. probably not just sex. It sounds as if the person here is saying that all of the other things they wanted originally in the relationship are no longer of any value to them in this relationship, but they haven't articulated it fairly.
It's the spouses who only allow sex once a month or less... when they used to put out far more often prior marriage Their spouse literally tells them over the course of years what they need, and they aren't looking for anything more than making love. Then what?  The diminishing amount of copulation in the relationship could be down to all sorts of reasons which need to be checked out. If the partner says the sex will increase in due course (but it doesn't) then you have to ask 1. How they know it will return? and 2) Why it has reduced and what is suddenly going to make it return? ALT+PLS+RTN: Pure as a pane of ice. It's a gift. |
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langebleu said: LaVisHh said: But what if you only got sex, and it was just that? Everytime you want your spouse, they made up an excuse? This goes on and on... you've talked about your sexual needs as their partner, and they say things are going to change, but never do?
What were the reasons for the relationship in the first place. probably not just sex. It sounds as if the person here is saying that all of the other things they wanted originally in the relationship are no longer of any value to them in this relationship, but they haven't articulated it fairly.
It's the spouses who only allow sex once a month or less... when they used to put out far more often prior marriage Their spouse literally tells them over the course of years what they need, and they aren't looking for anything more than making love. Then what? The diminishing amount of copulation in the relationship could be down to all sorts of reasons which need to be checked out. If the partner says the sex will increase in due course (but it doesn't) then you have to ask 1. How they know it will return? and 2) Why it has reduced and what is suddenly going to make it return? You make some very good points here.
Surely couples marry for more than just sex. But to have it limited to 6 times a year or less? Maybe it's just wrong to assume sex is a required part of the relationship. I just think claiming its return is a way of putting off saying something like, "I don't like having sex with you", or "I hate sex"...or something to the likes of that. It really baffles me why one would refuse sex repeatedly, and later on, wonder why their spouse ends up cheating on them. | |
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I'll go ahead and admit that I was guilty of not putting out in my first marriage, always avoiding her. But sex wasn't the root of the problem--it was the relationship, and sexual dysfunction was only the result. Fear is the mind-killer. | |
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LaVisHh said: What's up with that???
I mean, seriously. Why do you think this happens? Not every couple suddenly becomes too busy for it, but somehow those marriage papers get signed and the sex goes down the drain. I think this is the cause of most affairs outside the marriage, and the person holding off sex from their partner is left wondering why... Any theories?What are you basing this on?  Some couples do just fine. It depends on the individuals. Every man and woman and husband and wife are different and live in different circumstances. 
Single people have similar choices. If they are in a sexual relationship with their girlfriends or boyfriends. | |
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july said: LaVisHh said: What's up with that???
I mean, seriously. Why do you think this happens? Not every couple suddenly becomes too busy for it, but somehow those marriage papers get signed and the sex goes down the drain. I think this is the cause of most affairs outside the marriage, and the person holding off sex from their partner is left wondering why... Any theories?What are you basing this on? Some couples do just fine. It depends on the individuals. Every man and woman and husband and wife are different and live in different circumstances.
Single people have similar choices. If they are in a sexual relationship with their girlfriends or boyfriends. I totally agree. I'm basing this off of conversations with clients who tell me of their hardships. | |
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LaVisHh said: july said: LaVisHh said: What's up with that???
I mean, seriously. Why do you think this happens? Not every couple suddenly becomes too busy for it, but somehow those marriage papers get signed and the sex goes down the drain. I think this is the cause of most affairs outside the marriage, and the person holding off sex from their partner is left wondering why... Any theories?What are you basing this on? Some couples do just fine. It depends on the individuals. Every man and woman and husband and wife are different and live in different circumstances.
Single people have similar choices. If they are in a sexual relationship with their girlfriends or boyfriends. I totally agree. I'm basing this off of conversations with clients who tell me of their hardships. Great!  lol! smile... 8) | |
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... [This message was edited Thu Mar 13 7:40:41 PST 2003 by AmethystAngelMN] | |
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Sex has never been the force that controls my thinking. Even as a teenager, I tried not to get involved in relationships that were purely sexual. Because of this, being deprived sexually has a different meaning. It is not merely a matter of going a certain amount of time without sex. For me, to be deprived sexually would mean the absence of romance. This void would make me search for situations that provide romance or the possibility of romance. It is the anticipation of something sexual that is the most provocative.
If a woman constantly has excuses for not having sex, romance her. | |
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AmethystAngelMN said: [...]What is the consensus then if, in a marriage or exclusive longtime relationship, one of the partners becomes unable to provide sex due to illness?[...]Would it be considered justifiable for the healthy partner, who becomes sexually frustrated, to seek outside satisfaction, or to finally call the relationship or marriage quits because they are not having their sexual needs met and satisfied? By the same token, is it unfair of the ill person to stay with the well person, knowing that they are causing their loved one sexual frustration and not knowing if and when they will be able to provide sex again?
Is a relationship or marriage considered dead in the water if one of the parties involved can't provide sex?[...] I see this as a totally different scenario. Illness or the inability to have sex that comes about after marriage is just that. It's not someone making up excuses because they don't want to have sex. I don't think it's an automatic reason for separation, but it definatley needs to be discussed in depth. Both parties involved have to express their true feelings on the matter and come to a compromise. As others have said earlier, sex isn't the main reason for marriage, but as in all other parts of it, there needs to be a balance. | |
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 Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo
Candy Dulfer is my boo... | |
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jbchavez said: [...]If a woman constantly has excuses for not having sex, romance her.
What if this only leads to a dead end when sex is proposed, repeatedly? | |
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LaVisHh said: jbchavez said: [...]If a woman constantly has excuses for not having sex, romance her.
What if this only leads to a dead end when sex is proposed, repeatedly?  damn... that's cold... ... Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo
Candy Dulfer is my boo... | |
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EllisDee said: LaVisHh said: jbchavez said: [...]If a woman constantly has excuses for not having sex, romance her.
What if this only leads to a dead end when sex is proposed, repeatedly? damn... that's cold... ...This is how serious this type of deprivation is. It's very easy to say it's no big deal, but if you are in this type of situation - it's a heavy strain on the relationship. In fact, it ends up spreading itself onto other areas of it as well. | |
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LaVisHh said: EllisDee said: LaVisHh said: jbchavez said: [...]If a woman constantly has excuses for not having sex, romance her.
What if this only leads to a dead end when sex is proposed, repeatedly? damn... that's cold... ...This is how serious this type of deprivation is. It's very easy to say it's no big deal, but if you are in this type of situation - it's a heavy strain on the relationship. In fact, it ends up spreading itself onto other areas of it as well. have you been a victim of this..? is your man not putting out like he's supposed to..? ... Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo
Candy Dulfer is my boo... | |
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DORA said: the mind is complex
throw the mechanics sex into the muddle then add a tad bit of sexual dysfunction and WHAM... you have not tonight i have a head ache SCORE 10 :LOL: | |
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LaVisHh said
What if this only leads to a dead end when sex is proposed, repeatedly?[/quote] First, there would have to be reasons why there is no sex. If the reason is that she no longer feels an attraction or loves that person, romance will not work. At this point, it is probably best to end the relationship. If it is a physical or mental reason, work together to solve the issue. If there is no communication and the relationship continues to exist without romance or sex, then the search for romance and sex will begin. For example, if I felt like I was missing something in a relationship, I would start to search for what I was missing. Eventually, that could cause a separation. | |
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LaVisHh said: AmethystAngelMN said: [...]What is the consensus then if, in a marriage or exclusive longtime relationship, one of the partners becomes unable to provide sex due to illness?[...]Would it be considered justifiable for the healthy partner, who becomes sexually frustrated, to seek outside satisfaction, or to finally call the relationship or marriage quits because they are not having their sexual needs met and satisfied? By the same token, is it unfair of the ill person to stay with the well person, knowing that they are causing their loved one sexual frustration and not knowing if and when they will be able to provide sex again?
Is a relationship or marriage considered dead in the water if one of the parties involved can't provide sex?[...] I see this as a totally different scenario. Illness or the inability to have sex that comes about after marriage is just that. It's not someone making up excuses because they don't want to have sex. I don't think it's an automatic reason for separation, but it definatley needs to be discussed in depth. Both parties involved have to express their true feelings on the matter and come to a compromise. As others have said earlier, sex isn't the main reason for marriage, but as in all other parts of it, there needs to be a balance. I understand what you mean, about illness or inability to have sex being different than merely making up excuses to avoid sex. What made me think about what I had asked was what you said in an earlier post, about one partner having to settle for a liftime of sexual frustration, and how a marriage can be a lifetime commitment if both partners aren't fulfilling each other's needs. I've heard some people say flat out that it's WRONG and selfish of a person who, due to either inability or illness or whatever reason beyond their control, cannot provide sex to their partner and to therefore be keeping that other person stuck in a sexless relationship. And I have talked with women who have suffered a particular illness which caused lack of sex and sexual desire for many, many years, whose husbands and boyfriends or fiances left them, telling them that they loved them, but that a life of little to no sex was an impossibility for them to handle...and I've heard both men and women agree with that declaration, and say it's only understandable for those men to have left, and that it was wrong of the women to expect the men to stay in a marriage or relationship where sex might only rarely occur. I realize purposely withholding sex and not being able to provide sex are very different, but in the end a sexless marriage is a sexless marriage, and the damage that situation can wreak on a relationship is similiar in both cases, I feel. I was just curious about what people might do if they found themselves in such a situation, as either partner..the ill one, or the healthy one. Facing a lifetime of little to no sex, even if it's due to circumstances beyond a partner's control, can be a major strain on the best relationship and can cause feelings of anger and resentment, just like a relationship where someone is withholding purposely. | |
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EllisDee said: have you been a victim of this..? is your man not putting out like he's supposed to..?
...I'm not married anymore, but this wasn't the reason for the divorce, no - it was a drug addiction. Oh, no... we had sex all the time, everywhere... | |
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LaVisHh said: EllisDee said: have you been a victim of this..? is your man not putting out like he's supposed to..?
...I'm not married anymore, but this wasn't the reason for the divorce, no - it was a drug addiction. Oh, no... we had sex all the time, everywhere... everywhere..? ...
 ...
...
 ...[This message was edited Thu Mar 13 8:03:12 PST 2003 by EllisDee] Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo
Candy Dulfer is my boo... | |
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AmethystAngelMN said: LaVisHh said: AmethystAngelMN said: [...]What is the consensus then if, in a marriage or exclusive longtime relationship, one of the partners becomes unable to provide sex due to illness?[...]Would it be considered justifiable for the healthy partner, who becomes sexually frustrated, to seek outside satisfaction, or to finally call the relationship or marriage quits because they are not having their sexual needs met and satisfied? By the same token, is it unfair of the ill person to stay with the well person, knowing that they are causing their loved one sexual frustration and not knowing if and when they will be able to provide sex again?
Is a relationship or marriage considered dead in the water if one of the parties involved can't provide sex?[...] I see this as a totally different scenario. Illness or the inability to have sex that comes about after marriage is just that. It's not someone making up excuses because they don't want to have sex. I don't think it's an automatic reason for separation, but it definatley needs to be discussed in depth. Both parties involved have to express their true feelings on the matter and come to a compromise. As others have said earlier, sex isn't the main reason for marriage, but as in all other parts of it, there needs to be a balance. I understand what you mean, about illness or inability to have sex being different than merely making up excuses to avoid sex. What made me think about what I had asked was what you said in an earlier post, about one partner having to settle for a liftime of sexual frustration, and how a marriage can be a lifetime commitment if both partners aren't fulfilling each other's needs. I've heard some people say flat out that it's WRONG and selfish of a person who, due to either inability or illness or whatever reason beyond their control, cannot provide sex to their partner and to therefore be keeping that other person stuck in a sexless relationship. And I have talked with women who have suffered a particular illness which caused lack of sex and sexual desire for many, many years, whose husbands and boyfriends or fiances left them, telling them that they loved them, but that a life of little to no sex was an impossibility for them to handle...and I've heard both men and women agree with that declaration, and say it's only understandable for those men to have left, and that it was wrong of the women to expect the men to stay in a marriage or relationship where sex might only rarely occur. I realize purposely withholding sex and not being able to provide sex are very different, but in the end a sexless marriage is a sexless marriage, and the damage that situation can wreak on a relationship is similiar in both cases, I feel. I was just curious about what people might do if they found themselves in such a situation, as either partner..the ill one, or the healthy one. Facing a lifetime of little to no sex, even if it's due to circumstances beyond a partner's control, can be a major strain on the best relationship and can cause feelings of anger and resentment, just like a relationship where someone is withholding purposely. I'm glad you brought this up.  It's sad indeed. 
I can see that happening, and it's tragic. It's also very important for people to be true to themselves and their spouse - with telling them what they can and cannot handle. Personally, even though it would break my heart, I would prefer a man to leave me the honest way, than to have an affair behind my back - which I would eventually find out anyways. | |
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AmethystAngelMN said: LaVisHh said: AmethystAngelMN said: [...]What is the consensus then if, in a marriage or exclusive longtime relationship, one of the partners becomes unable to provide sex due to illness?[...]Would it be considered justifiable for the healthy partner, who becomes sexually frustrated, to seek outside satisfaction, or to finally call the relationship or marriage quits because they are not having their sexual needs met and satisfied? By the same token, is it unfair of the ill person to stay with the well person, knowing that they are causing their loved one sexual frustration and not knowing if and when they will be able to provide sex again?
Is a relationship or marriage considered dead in the water if one of the parties involved can't provide sex?[...] I see this as a totally different scenario. Illness or the inability to have sex that comes about after marriage is just that. It's not someone making up excuses because they don't want to have sex. I don't think it's an automatic reason for separation, but it definatley needs to be discussed in depth. Both parties involved have to express their true feelings on the matter and come to a compromise. As others have said earlier, sex isn't the main reason for marriage, but as in all other parts of it, there needs to be a balance. I understand what you mean, about illness or inability to have sex being different than merely making up excuses to avoid sex. What made me think about what I had asked was what you said in an earlier post, about one partner having to settle for a liftime of sexual frustration, and how a marriage can be a lifetime commitment if both partners aren't fulfilling each other's needs. I've heard some people say flat out that it's WRONG and selfish of a person who, due to either inability or illness or whatever reason beyond their control, cannot provide sex to their partner and to therefore be keeping that other person stuck in a sexless relationship. And I have talked with women who have suffered a particular illness which caused lack of sex and sexual desire for many, many years, whose husbands and boyfriends or fiances left them, telling them that they loved them, but that a life of little to no sex was an impossibility for them to handle...and I've heard both men and women agree with that declaration, and say it's only understandable for those men to have left, and that it was wrong of the women to expect the men to stay in a marriage or relationship where sex might only rarely occur. I realize purposely withholding sex and not being able to provide sex are very different, but in the end a sexless marriage is a sexless marriage, and the damage that situation can wreak on a relationship is similiar in both cases, I feel. I was just curious about what people might do if they found themselves in such a situation, as either partner..the ill one, or the healthy one. Facing a lifetime of little to no sex, even if it's due to circumstances beyond a partner's control, can be a major strain on the best relationship and can cause feelings of anger and resentment, just like a relationship where someone is withholding purposely.
that would suck... i'm sorry... i'm really uncapable of anything deeper than that right now... Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo
Candy Dulfer is my boo... | |
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jbchavez said: LaVisHh said: What if this only leads to a dead end when sex is proposed, repeatedly? First, there would have to be reasons why there is no sex. If the reason is that she no longer feels an attraction or loves that person, romance will not work. At this point, it is probably best to end the relationship. If it is a physical or mental reason, work together to solve the issue. If there is no communication and the relationship continues to exist without romance or sex, then the search for romance and sex will begin. For example, if I felt like I was missing something in a relationship, I would start to search for what I was missing. Eventually, that could cause a separation. Usually it appears that the person totally feels loved, but the sex is practically non-existant. I agree, and that is why I don't understand why the obvious stuff cannot be fixed. Having sex isn't an unusual or strange desire. | |
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EllisDee said: LaVisHh said: EllisDee said: have you been a victim of this..? is your man not putting out like he's supposed to..?
...I'm not married anymore, but this wasn't the reason for the divorce, no - it was a drug addiction. Oh, no... we had sex all the time, everywhere... everywhere..? ...
...
...
...
[This message was edited Thu Mar 13 8:03:12 PST 2003 by EllisDee] 
Everywhere meaning location, not body parts. | |
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LaVisHh said: Surely couples marry for more than just sex. But to have it limited to 6 times a year or less? Maybe it's just wrong to assume sex is a required part of the relationship. You've reminded me of that joke about the sex therapist who is speaking to a group of people.
The therapist asks the assembled mass of depressed attendees, 'How many people here have sex at least once a night?' No-one raises a hand. 'How about once a week?' asks the therapist, and several sad looking individuals raise their hands. 'And what about once a month?' Nearly all the room responds, hands held aloft sheepishly , and each with a glum face. 'And once a year? the therapist continues, eyes roving around the room. One individual raises his hand instantly, with a huge smile on his face, 'Me. Me. I'm once a year,' he celebrates Then why are you so cheerful?' the therapists asks. 'Tonight's the night', beams the man in the corner. ALT+PLS+RTN: Pure as a pane of ice. It's a gift. |
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AmethystAngelMN said: LaVisHh said: AmethystAngelMN said: [...]What is the consensus then if, in a marriage or exclusive longtime relationship, one of the partners becomes unable to provide sex due to illness?[...]Would it be considered justifiable for the healthy partner, who becomes sexually frustrated, to seek outside satisfaction, or to finally call the relationship or marriage quits because they are not having their sexual needs met and satisfied? By the same token, is it unfair of the ill person to stay with the well person, knowing that they are causing their loved one sexual frustration and not knowing if and when they will be able to provide sex again?
Is a relationship or marriage considered dead in the water if one of the parties involved can't provide sex?[...] I see this as a totally different scenario. Illness or the inability to have sex that comes about after marriage is just that. It's not someone making up excuses because they don't want to have sex. I don't think it's an automatic reason for separation, but it definatley needs to be discussed in depth. Both parties involved have to express their true feelings on the matter and come to a compromise. As others have said earlier, sex isn't the main reason for marriage, but as in all other parts of it, there needs to be a balance. I understand what you mean, about illness or inability to have sex being different than merely making up excuses to avoid sex. What made me think about what I had asked was what you said in an earlier post, about one partner having to settle for a liftime of sexual frustration, and how a marriage can be a lifetime commitment if both partners aren't fulfilling each other's needs. I've heard some people say flat out that it's WRONG and selfish of a person who, due to either inability or illness or whatever reason beyond their control, cannot provide sex to their partner and to therefore be keeping that other person stuck in a sexless relationship. And I have talked with women who have suffered a particular illness which caused lack of sex and sexual desire for many, many years, whose husbands and boyfriends or fiances left them, telling them that they loved them, but that a life of little to no sex was an impossibility for them to handle...and I've heard both men and women agree with that declaration, and say it's only understandable for those men to have left, and that it was wrong of the women to expect the men to stay in a marriage or relationship where sex might only rarely occur. I realize purposely withholding sex and not being able to provide sex are very different, but in the end a sexless marriage is a sexless marriage, and the damage that situation can wreak on a relationship is similiar in both cases, I feel. I was just curious about what people might do if they found themselves in such a situation, as either partner..the ill one, or the healthy one. Facing a lifetime of little to no sex, even if it's due to circumstances beyond a partner's control, can be a major strain on the best relationship and can cause feelings of anger and resentment, just like a relationship where someone is withholding purposely. Many great points. This is an unbearably tough one. There are no simple or pat answers. Human nature must be dealt with. Much would depend on the drive of the individuals. (Not only that the ill one (as you referenced) may make the situation rough as well. You would not only be dealing with sex and sexual expression but as well all the mental and self esteem issues involved. | |
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LaVisHh said: EllisDee said: LaVisHh said: EllisDee said: have you been a victim of this..? is your man not putting out like he's supposed to..?
...I'm not married anymore, but this wasn't the reason for the divorce, no - it was a drug addiction. Oh, no... we had sex all the time, everywhere... everywhere..? ...
...
...
...
[This message was edited Thu Mar 13 8:03:12 PST 2003 by EllisDee]
Everywhere meaning location, not body parts. sure it does... ... i never doubted that it did... ... Mr. Ellis Dee-licious, the Official NPGigolo
Candy Dulfer is my boo... | |
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