Seriously, though?

Thankfully, it was usually a "give and take" thing from both sides. I was usually the one making the calls when it comes to making decisions based on logic, as my strengths are that, even though I am a very sensitive person, I always keep a cool head and hardly ever make a bad decision or give bad advice.

However, I am seriously underachieving (which I openly admit) when it comes to personal relationships, small-talk and quality time communication and basically being "normal" and doing "normal things". That's when I tend to shut up and listen to my woman, because I can sometimes be a bit too cool and logical.

My past lovers usually say that they had the feeling I was the one "wearing the pants", but that I was still very caring and sensitive. I'm fine with that evaluation.

JustErin said:

Generally there is one person who is bossier, more aggressive, more outgoing, takes charge, etc and the other is more passive, quiet and laid back in a relationship.

I'm sure there might be relationships where it's equal but I've actually never, ever seen that.

I of course get what you are talking about, but, thinking about myself and my own relationship, I wouldn't necessarily agree with your choice of adjectives!

You see, right now, she is definitely more outgoing and louder than me, and I am clearly quiet and laid back, have never raised my voice and don't tell anyone what to do. But she knows that I am a very quick thinker and whenever she asks me for advice, she does what I say, because I've never been "wrong" so far.

If it comes to giving opinion and making decisions, I simply calmly give mine and give very good reasons for my opinion, without having to be "bossy" or "aggressive".

Dave1992 said:

My past lovers usually say that they had the feeling I was the one "wearing the pants", but that I was still very caring and sensitive. I'm fine with that evaluation.

ZombieKitten said:

Pokeno4Money said:

Define dominant.

I pretty much let my girlfriends have their way on most things because I don't sweat the small stuff, but if I really want something and I give good reasons why I should have my way then I damn well am going to get what I want. So is she the dominant one for getting her way most of the time, or am I the dominant one for always getting my way when I really want something?

Another example, sometimes I reluctantly agree to what she wants and then intentionally screw things up or pretend I don't know what I'm doing or just plain "forget". So is she the dominant one for getting me to let her have her way, or am I the dominant one for putting on my passive-aggressive hat and ultimately convincing her to voluntarily withdraw her request? (This was actually the theme of a "Everybody Loves Raymond" episode).

I suspect my partner does the same I have told him that's passive aggressive but he doesn't know what that means He agrees to everything but is a NOTORIOUS PLAN CHANGER I will make a suggestion and he will agree to it, I make preparations and arrangements and the he will say "oh, but I thought we could do XZY instead" and then either I get mad and make a scene or do what he has decided. The kids have also wised up to it and see it as promise-breaking. If any of us point this behavior out to him he starts with an interrogation about "when have I done that?" Then we need to back up our claims with examples because he won't accept "nearly every time!!!!"

That's pretty fucked up behaviour IMO

Fauxie said:

Dave1992 said:

My past lovers usually say that they had the feeling I was the one "wearing the pants", but that I was still very caring and sensitive. I'm fine with that evaluation.

When exactly, and where, did they say this? And more than one person too. I just can't imagine in what context those conversations were had, is all. Right, we're not together anymore. Let's analyze each others' performance and traits and just take some time to reflect. Feedback for the next one, if you will.

It doesn't happen that often that I don't talk to a person that used to be close to be anymore. Sure, we go our seperate ways and move on and all that, but there might come a time when you sit down together and just go through all the things that happened and clear things up. I find that very healthy and have found that it has helped healing old wounds in the past.

For instance, I would meet someone I was very close with in a bar and we'd just chat. Of course, we'd start talking about old times and what went wrong and how, and maybe we'd be more open about some of the fears we had back then. That's where I was told a couple of times that people started to rely on me making most of the major decisions and that they were content that way.

If you want a specific context, I can only remember one: I said something about me missing inspiration and that I had the feeling of having to handle two lives instead of just one. She answered that she simply felt secure knowing that I was the one "wearing the pants"...

edit: But I'm sure it's only a coincidence that more people have described me as being slightly more "dominant" when it comes to decision making. It depends on two I'm with. I'm certainly not the kind who has to be dominant for the sake of it, or who strongly identifies with that dominant male type, if you know what I mean.

.

[Edited 2/22/13 12:52pm]

Dave1992 said:

Fauxie said:

When exactly, and where, did they say this? And more than one person too. I just can't imagine in what context those conversations were had, is all. Right, we're not together anymore. Let's analyze each others' performance and traits and just take some time to reflect. Feedback for the next one, if you will.

It doesn't happen that often that I don't talk to a person that used to be close to be anymore. Sure, we go our seperate ways and move on and all that, but there might come a time when you sit down together and just go through all the things that happened and clear things up. I find that very healthy and have found that it has helped healing old wounds in the past.

For instance, I would meet someone I was very close with in a bar and we'd just chat. Of course, we'd start talking about old times and what went wrong and how, and maybe we'd be more open about some of the fears we had back then. That's where I was told a couple of times that people started to rely on me making most of the major decisions and that they were content that way.

If you want a specific context, I can only remember one: I said something about me missing inspiration and that I had the feeling of having to handle two lives instead of just one. She answered that she simply felt secure knowing that I was the one "wearing the pants"...

edit: But I'm sure it's only a coincidence that more people have described me as being slightly more "dominant" when it comes to decision making. It depends on two I'm with. I'm certainly not the kind who has to be dominant for the sake of it, or who strongly identifies with that dominant male type, if you know what I mean.

.

[Edited 2/22/13 12:52pm]

Cheers for expanding on that.

It's interesting. It'd be good to have those conversations while still in the relationship! But maybe impossible and it's only separation and a little time that allows it to happen, what do you think? I've never broken up with anyone or been broken up with, so I've no idea.

Fauxie said:

Dave1992 said:

It doesn't happen that often that I don't talk to a person that used to be close to be anymore. Sure, we go our seperate ways and move on and all that, but there might come a time when you sit down together and just go through all the things that happened and clear things up. I find that very healthy and have found that it has helped healing old wounds in the past.

For instance, I would meet someone I was very close with in a bar and we'd just chat. Of course, we'd start talking about old times and what went wrong and how, and maybe we'd be more open about some of the fears we had back then. That's where I was told a couple of times that people started to rely on me making most of the major decisions and that they were content that way.

If you want a specific context, I can only remember one: I said something about me missing inspiration and that I had the feeling of having to handle two lives instead of just one. She answered that she simply felt secure knowing that I was the one "wearing the pants"...

edit: But I'm sure it's only a coincidence that more people have described me as being slightly more "dominant" when it comes to decision making. It depends on two I'm with. I'm certainly not the kind who has to be dominant for the sake of it, or who strongly identifies with that dominant male type, if you know what I mean.

.

[Edited 2/22/13 12:52pm]

Cheers for expanding on that.

It's interesting. It'd be good to have those conversations while still in the relationship! But maybe impossible and it's only separation and a little time that allows it to happen, what do you think? I've never broken up with anyone or been broken up with, so I've no idea.

It's not like I had the feeling that the relationship went wrong because someone was holding back from giving their honest opinion. I always try to talk things through extensively and make people as comfortable as possible sharing their opinions and telling me about what they long for and what they miss.

But sometimes we just need some time to pass and to gather some new experiences to be able to look at the past and be even more objective than it might have been possible to be back then.

I guess.

Interesting question...

In our relationship (we've been together close to 30 years, married 22), I don't have a problem handling the big decisions (cars, house, repairs) and she tends to actually look for my advice re these items. However, I know where her strengths are (bills, money management, electronic gadgets) and I gladly let her take the lead (also, i find those things to be a bore).

We work very well together, and that's also key.

I don't want to start a war, but, i've seen relationships where the woman is definately the dominant one, and they didn't end pretty.

50/50 is best, but only when leaning towards your strengths.

It takes lots of self-confidence to let the other person take charge of some tasks.

I don't mind that because, who wants a weak partner?

[Edited 2/22/13 15:04pm]

CarrieMpls said:

Pokeno4Money said:

Define dominant.

I pretty much let my girlfriends have their way on most things because I don't sweat the small stuff, but if I really want something and I give good reasons why I should have my way then I damn well am going to get what I want. So is she the dominant one for getting her way most of the time, or am I the dominant one for always getting my way when I really want something?

Another example, sometimes I reluctantly agree to what she wants and then intentionally screw things up or pretend I don't know what I'm doing or just plain "forget". So is she the dominant one for getting me to let her have her way, or am I the dominant one for putting on my passive-aggressive hat and ultimately convincing her to voluntarily withdraw her request? (This was actually the theme of a "Everybody Loves Raymond" episode).

Well that's just sleazy. Passive-agressive BS is just that - BS.

Same as with not being 100% honest sometimes, it depends on how you use it. When done with good intentions (ie: keeping the peace) it is far from sleazy, just like if your boyfriend asks what you think of his new tattoo and you tell him it's nice or okay looking even though you hate it. You wouldn't make him feel like crap by telling him it looks horrible, would you?

You see I can't stand arguing, I absolutely hate it (even if the makeup sex is great!) so when a girlfriend demands that I do something and I am dead set against it and there's no possibility for compromise, there are basically just three ways to handle the situation:

1) Continue to refuse whatever is being asked, resulting in tension/anger/yelling/ugliness for both parties.

2) Give in to her unreasonable demands, which makes her happy but me miserable and resentful (ever heard the term "enabler"?)

3) Avoid the tension and arguing by letting her have her way, and then with the help of my discreet actions/nonactions allow the situation to evolve into one where I'm not forced into something I'm strongly against and she feels good about the fact that she got her way even though the end result didn't work out as she hoped.

So which do you prefer? Scenario #1 where nobody is happy, Scenario #2 where one person is happy and the other is miserable, or Scenario #3 where both people are happy?

I choose #3 because avoiding conflicts and arguments is a good way for relationships to remain healthy and strong.

ZombieKitten said:

I have told him that's passive aggressive but he doesn't know what that means

Perhaps that's just what he wants you to think.

Let's all be honest here, everyone has their own ways to "win" whenever there's an impasse.

Women sometimes use seduction or tears to get what they want, men sometimes use ignorance or forgetfulness to get what they want.

In a perfect world there would always be compromise from both parties, but as we gravitate more and more toward a narcissistic society it's becoming increasingly difficult to find significant others who care as much about you as they do about themselves.

He does... as much as I would like to lie to myself and pretend I have some say... he does.

He is evolving and is learning to be a good listener though.

Always.

Me of course after browbeating the man down. "Yes dear."

Seriously, its still me. I'm the planner, I'm the captain of the ship.

Pokeno4Money said:

I was brought up being the "Little brother" who is just added to whatever the household has planned, so I am quite comfortable in that role, but I think it tended to be me in the pants in past relationships.

I like it when women wear pants instead of skirts, actually. I'm not taking any of that men's shoes shit though.

CarrieMpls said:

I think we trade off.

I probably wear the pants most of the time and my bf is happy to let me. That's cause I'm a planner and a decision-maker and he'd rather wander and explore and leave his options open, so just by virtue of how we do things I have stuff planned out for us and he's fine with coming along for the ride.

But once in a while he really wants something his way and then he takes charge and that's that.

This is actually pretty close to how we are in my house as well.

Ideally its 50/50, but that's not the normal situation. I'd be happy with a 60/40.

I have found that my personal freedom that I allow myself is received by many as something to be jealous of (strangely.). Even though I'm extremely loyal and honest, most relationships can't handle that kind of loyalty and honesty. Maybe it's too much pressure for some. Like I'm some unreal unattainable person or something.

I wear the pants most of the time-but I don't have to.

Pokeno4Money said:

CarrieMpls said:

Well that's just sleazy. Passive-agressive BS is just that - BS.

Same as with not being 100% honest sometimes, it depends on how you use it. When done with good intentions (ie: keeping the peace) it is far from sleazy, just like if your boyfriend asks what you think of his new tattoo and you tell him it's nice or okay looking even though you hate it. You wouldn't make him feel like crap by telling him it looks horrible, would you?

You see I can't stand arguing, I absolutely hate it (even if the makeup sex is great!) so when a girlfriend demands that I do something and I am dead set against it and there's no possibility for compromise, there are basically just three ways to handle the situation:

1) Continue to refuse whatever is being asked, resulting in tension/anger/yelling/ugliness for both parties.

2) Give in to her unreasonable demands, which makes her happy but me miserable and resentful (ever heard the term "enabler"?)

3) Avoid the tension and arguing by letting her have her way, and then with the help of my discreet actions/nonactions allow the situation to evolve into one where I'm not forced into something I'm strongly against and she feels good about the fact that she got her way even though the end result didn't work out as she hoped.

So which do you prefer? Scenario #1 where nobody is happy, Scenario #2 where one person is happy and the other is miserable, or Scenario #3 where both people are happy?

I choose #3 because avoiding conflicts and arguments is a good way for relationships to remain healthy and strong.

Sleazy was a bit harsh, I admit. But I would prefer 1. While 3 isn't immediately obvious I would resent it more in the long run. I'd rather fight it out and be done with it then have the ill feelings linger while someone acts like a child.

Guess we work differently.

Pokeno4Money said:

ZombieKitten said:

I have told him that's passive aggressive but he doesn't know what that means

Perhaps that's just what he wants you to think.

Let's all be honest here, everyone has their own ways to "win" whenever there's an impasse.

Women sometimes use seduction or tears to get what they want, men sometimes use ignorance or forgetfulness to get what they want.

In a perfect world there would always be compromise from both parties, but as we gravitate more and more toward a narcissistic society it's becoming increasingly difficult to find significant others who care as much about you as they do about themselves.

I don't "use" anything to get my way, other than logic and reason when applicable. I ask for what I want and if he's not willing to give it to me we can figure out what to do about that. If the request is reasonable, any partner should go along with it. If it's not reasonable or your partner has a reasonable reason to decline, anyone should be OK with that.

I don't do well with manipulations. I can't imagine being in that kind of relationship. Perhaps that's why I was single so long.

The downside of most of my relationships is that I've been made to wear pants.

novabrkr said:

The downside of most of my relationships is that I've been made to wear pants.

What a tough question.

Maybe the best way to articulate this is to say my wife is CEO and Chief Financial Officer. She conceives and manages the day-to-day affairs of our household. And thank God, 'cause if it were left to me, we'd have much more fun, but probably would be bankrupt in 3 years.

I, on the other hand, am the Board of Directors. I chart our longer-term trajectory, give ultimate approval or veto to big-ticket decisions, and do what I can to ensure the CEO has got what she needs to keep things running.

[Edited 2/23/13 7:21am]

I wear the pants. I think.

Lammastide said:

Kim wears the pants.

[img:$uid]http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/18881xfuzz9orjpg/original.jpg[/img:$uid]

Kanye wears the skirt.

Lammastide said:

What a tough question.

Maybe the best way to articulate this is to say my wife is CEO and Chief Financial Officer. She conceives and manages the day-to-day affairs of our household. And thank God, 'cause if it were left to me, we'd have much more fun, but probably would be bankrupt in 3 years.

I, on the other hand, am the Board of Directors. I chart our longer-term trajectory, give ultimate approval or veto to big-ticket decisions, and do what I can to ensure the CEO has got what she needs to keep things running.

[Edited 2/23/13 7:21am]

I like your though process.

Using your analogy I'm definitely the B.O.D., C.E.O., C.F.O., and President of Operations. My wife is the Chief Administrative Officer, Chief Legal Counsel (she wanted to attend law school at one point), VP of Operations, and office intern

Adisa said:

Lammastide said:

What a tough question.

Maybe the best way to articulate this is to say my wife is CEO and Chief Financial Officer. She conceives and manages the day-to-day affairs of our household. And thank God, 'cause if it were left to me, we'd have much more fun, but probably would be bankrupt in 3 years.

I, on the other hand, am the Board of Directors. I chart our longer-term trajectory, give ultimate approval or veto to big-ticket decisions, and do what I can to ensure the CEO has got what she needs to keep things running.

[Edited 2/23/13 7:21am]

office intern

Shame on you.

Me. I'm the captian and she's the first mate. I insist upon it. Sometimes she fusses about it, but overall she says she's never felt this free. Neither have I.

JustErin said:

Generally there is one person who is bossier, more aggressive, more outgoing, takes charge, etc and the other is more passive, quiet and laid back in a relationship.

I'm sure there might be relationships where it's equal but I've actually never, ever seen that.

I dont buy the equal thing at all. I've never known a woman to want her equal in a man. Some men claim they do, but that's because they're told they should (and they think saying this will help them get pussy).

[Edited 2/23/13 12:11pm]