NDRU said:

hard to believe nobody could have helped him get back up but they had time to take a photo?

Something is fishy about this whole situation. The photographer films an altercation in the street, then follow them into the subway, only to watch and film the man being pushed in front of the train? Someone please explain this one. Am I missing something here?

This is sad. The photographer who took the picture was wrong for doing that, but he said the victim struggled for a minute while others stood by and did nothing.

"What really surprises me is the people who were 100 feet or 150 feet away from Mr. Han did not reach out to help him," Abbasi said. "The people standing near the 50th street exit could have grabbed him and moved him."

Count sixty seconds to yourself, that's a long time. Way to go New Yorkers.

Beautifulstarr123 said:

NDRU said:

hard to believe nobody could have helped him get back up but they had time to take a photo?

Something is fishy about this whole situation. The photographer films an altercation in the street, then follow them into the subway, only to watch and film the man being pushed in front of the train? Someone please explain this one. Am I missing something here?

hold on.. i've been following this story and i never heard that this started on the streets

where did you read this ?

The man who took the photograph is a reporter and was on the Today show explaining that he was covering another story and saw the altercation.

He witnessed Mr. Hun (I think that is the victim's name?) being pushed onto the tracks and he then took photos of the man, as soon as the man stood up he was struck by the train.

I believe there were a series of photograhs taken as he was struck, and photos leading up to him being pushed onto the tracks.

The photographer did NOT help him because he was afraid of the pan-handler also. He ducked in the crowd to not be pushed onto the tracks as well. He knew the agressor saw him taking pictures of the incident.

BUT>>> this photographer made good money with that photo and sold it to the Post.

He should be ashamed of himself profitting from someone's brutal death.

paintedlady said:

The man who took the photograph is a reporter and was on the Today show explaining that he was covering another story and saw the altercation.

He witnessed Mr. Hun (I think that is the victim's name?) being pushed onto the tracks and he then took photos of the man, as soon as the man stood up he was struck by the train.

I believe there were a series of photograhs taken as he was struck, and photos leading up to him being pushed onto the tracks.

The photographer did NOT help him because he was afraid of the pan-handler also. He ducked in the crowd to not be pushed onto the tracks as well. He knew the agressor saw him taking pictures of the incident.

BUT>>> this photographer made good money with that photo and sold it to the Post.

He should be ashamed of himself profitting from someone's brutal death.

Beautifulstarr123 said:

NDRU said:

hard to believe nobody could have helped him get back up but they had time to take a photo?

Something is fishy about this whole situation. The photographer films an altercation in the street, then follow them into the subway, only to watch and film the man being pushed in front of the train? Someone please explain this one. Am I missing something here?

Anguished fotog: Critics ...condemn me

• By R. UMAR ABBASI
• Last Updated: 10:21 AM, December 5, 2012
• Posted: 12:39 AM, December 5, 2012

banks said:

Beautifulstarr123 said:

Something is fishy about this whole situation. The photographer films an altercation in the street, then follow them into the subway, only to watch and film the man being pushed in front of the train? Someone please explain this one. Am I missing something here?

hold on.. i've been following this story and i never heard that this started on the streets

where did you read this ?

Oh never mind. I mistaken the freelance photographer from the victim here

paintedlady said:

The man who took the photograph is a reporter and was on the Today show explaining that he was covering another story and saw the altercation.

He witnessed Mr. Hun (I think that is the victim's name?) being pushed onto the tracks and he then took photos of the man, as soon as the man stood up he was struck by the train.

I believe there were a series of photograhs taken as he was struck, and photos leading up to him being pushed onto the tracks.

The photographer did NOT help him because he was afraid of the pan-handler also. He ducked in the crowd to not be pushed onto the tracks as well. He knew the agressor saw him taking pictures of the incident.

BUT>>> this photographer made good money with that photo and sold it to the Post.

He should be ashamed of himself profitting from someone's brutal death.

Here's the link to that interview. http://today.msnbc.msn.com/?_r=1

AshK said:

PDogz said:

There are probably at least a dozen different models of train cars that pass through each station at any given time, each model with doors located at different positions along side the car. Even if they designed a barrier that took into consideration the average location of all the car doors, there would still probably be more open space than actual barrier, and the barriers themselves would pose a safety risk during rush hour when you have thousands of people every minute pushing to get on and off the trains.

I applaud your barrier idea (because you're trying to think of a solution that would save human life), but it wouldn't work, and would probably cause more injury than not having them at all.

We have barriers for certain Tube/subway stops in London so it's definitely possible. Here's a pic of Westminster station...

Very interesting. Worth NY tax dollars to build something like this. Would save a lot of lives, I believe.

TD3 said:

paintedlady said:

The man who took the photograph is a reporter and was on the Today show explaining that he was covering another story and saw the altercation.

He witnessed Mr. Hun (I think that is the victim's name?) being pushed onto the tracks and he then took photos of the man, as soon as the man stood up he was struck by the train.

I believe there were a series of photograhs taken as he was struck, and photos leading up to him being pushed onto the tracks.

The photographer did NOT help him because he was afraid of the pan-handler also. He ducked in the crowd to not be pushed onto the tracks as well. He knew the agressor saw him taking pictures of the incident.

BUT>>> this photographer made good money with that photo and sold it to the Post.

He should be ashamed of himself profitting from someone's brutal death.

Here's the link to that interview. http://today.msnbc.msn.com/?_r=1

Thanks for the link... I was going by my memory and I might be inaccurate.

But seriously.... I think this freelancer is a POS for this. He is even pictured talking to the perp.

PurpleJedi said:

PDogz said:

Excellent point.

I actually gave this idea more thought after my last post. They also have this type of setup in many airports, like in Atlanta, GA for example. But it would still be cost-prohibitive to convert the entire NYC subway system in this manner. They can't even afford to keep the subways in NY clean, not to mention completely overhauling them.

Still the fact remains (as you have pointed out), there are certainly safer (and apparently cleaner) train stations in the world than in New York.

That pic right there makes absolute sense.

It can and should be done.

MOST of the subway stations in NY are filthy/disgusting. I don't even want to breathe the air down there.

At least they've fixed the intercom system so that nowadays you can more-or-less understand what they're saying on the speakers!

It'll probably take a multi-billion class-action lawsuit to get something like the Westminster station done here.

I still don't see how these barriers could be built. As PDogz pointed out, there are different models of trains running through the subway so the openings would have to move according to which train is approaching the station. That would be VERY expensive.

PDogz said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

In Los Angeles, the underground subway has a space under the platform which is big enough for someone to duck into in the event of something like this happening. From what I can tell the electrified part of the rail is on the other side against the wall so someone would have a chance of survival by moving into that space.

He could have also rolled to the center of the track, between the two main rails, laid flat, and allowed the train to pass over him. If he was unable to lift himself back up to the platform for some reason, it would have sure beat just standing there waiting for the train to hit him.

Or he could have just moved in the other direction and stood in between the support beams separating the northbound and southbound tracks. I don't recall any gate or wall between the two tracks at that station. He died because he panicked. Very sad.

paintedlady said:

TD3 said:

Here's the link to that interview. http://today.msnbc.msn.com/?_r=1

Thanks for the link... I was going by my memory and I might be inaccurate.

But seriously.... I think this freelancer is a POS for this. He is even pictured talking to the perp.

That's not him talking to the perp. That's the victim.

sexton said:

PDogz said:

He could have also rolled to the center of the track, between the two main rails, laid flat, and allowed the train to pass over him. If he was unable to lift himself back up to the platform for some reason, it would have sure beat just standing there waiting for the train to hit him.

Or he could have just moved in the other direction and stood in between the support beams separating the northbound and southbound tracks. I don't recall any gate or wall between the two tracks at that station. He died because he panicked. Very sad.

That's lil tricky because he would have had to get over the third rail (the electricity) his best bet would have been to lay down flat between the 2 rails but i'm sure it happened really fast and i really don't understand why the trains can't slow down upon entering the station.. They slow down upon entering 42nd street (Grand Central) but that's because they have to come around a curve.

banks said:

paintedlady said:

Thanks for the link... I was going by my memory and I might be inaccurate.

But seriously.... I think this freelancer is a POS for this. He is even pictured talking to the perp.

That's not him talking to the perp. That's the victim.

Oh, OK I got confused since victim and the photographer are wearing similar outfits... well, at least he wasn't talking to the panhandler/murderer.

But still a shitty thing to do and my heart goes out to to the victim's family.

banks said:

btw He's now in custody

But he's not officially charged

http://abcnews.go.com/US/...d=17873672

The more I think about the photographer and what he did, the more angry I get.

First of all, I don't buy the excuse that he was using his flash to alert the train operator. If anything, the flash would have taken the operator's attention AWAY from the tracks and to the photographer instead. Maybe the operator didn't notice the victim earlier because he was distracted by the flashes?

Even if there was truly no way the photographer could have pulled the victim out in time, why the hell take pictures? Seriously ... why? What purpose does it serve?

Oh, wait a minute - there WAS a purpose, to make money! Obviously that was his motivation for taking the pictures, particularly since he claims that he was so upset about what happened that he didn't even want to look at them afterward.

If the photographer had a shred of decency, he would not have sold that picture to anyone. Making money off someone else's horrific death is revolting, and I'm talking to you too NY Post.

Pokeno4Money said:

The more I think about the photographer and what he did, the more angry I get.

First of all, I don't buy the excuse that he was using his flash to alert the train operator. If anything, the flash would have taken the operator's attention AWAY from the tracks and to the photographer instead. Maybe the operator didn't notice the victim earlier because he was distracted by the flashes?

Even if there was truly no way the photographer could have pulled the victim out in time, why the hell take pictures? Seriously ... why? What purpose does it serve?

Oh, wait a minute - there WAS a purpose, to make money! Obviously that was his motivation for taking the pictures, particularly since he claims that he was so upset about what happened that he didn't even want to look at them afterward.

If the photographer had a shred of decency, he would not have sold that picture to anyone. Making money off someone else's horrific death is revolting, and I'm talking to you too NY Post.

I'm telling you...I saw that coverstory/picture and I rolled my eyes in disgust (figuratively lol) and decided right then & there that I'll probably never buy another copy of the NY Post ever again.

AshK said:

PDogz said:

There are probably at least a dozen different models of train cars that pass through each station at any given time, each model with doors located at different positions along side the car. Even if they designed a barrier that took into consideration the average location of all the car doors, there would still probably be more open space than actual barrier, and the barriers themselves would pose a safety risk during rush hour when you have thousands of people every minute pushing to get on and off the trains.

I applaud your barrier idea (because you're trying to think of a solution that would save human life), but it wouldn't work, and would probably cause more injury than not having them at all.

We have barriers for certain Tube/subway stops in London so it's definitely possible. Here's a pic of Westminster station...

Beautiful subway.I ride the NYC subway.eeek

Beautifulstarr123 said:

banks said:

btw He's now in custody

But he's not officially charged

http://abcnews.go.com/US/...d=17873672

i'm just happy he's off the street.. The charges will come later

sexton said:

PDogz said:

He could have also rolled to the center of the track, between the two main rails, laid flat, and allowed the train to pass over him. If he was unable to lift himself back up to the platform for some reason, it would have sure beat just standing there waiting for the train to hit him.

Or he could have just moved in the other direction and stood in between the support beams separating the northbound and southbound tracks. I don't recall any gate or wall between the two tracks at that station. He died because he panicked. Very sad.

In post 35 it looks like there is an opening that he could have ducked into. Nobody knows how they will react under such circumstance but it is a brings to mind the importance of remaining centered under difficult circumstances. So sad.

Thank GOD this crazy freak is caught.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

sexton said:

Or he could have just moved in the other direction and stood in between the support beams separating the northbound and southbound tracks. I don't recall any gate or wall between the two tracks at that station. He died because he panicked. Very sad.

In post 35 it looks like there is an opening that he could have ducked into. Nobody knows how they will react under such circumstance but it is a brings to mind the importance of remaining centered under difficult circumstances. So sad.

i see that too. looks like some kind of doorway or something. the victim was likely in shock at the moment, deer in the headlights thing...

XxAxX said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

In post 35 it looks like there is an opening that he could have ducked into. Nobody knows how they will react under such circumstance but it is a brings to mind the importance of remaining centered under difficult circumstances. So sad.

i see that too. looks like some kind of doorway or something. the victim was likely in shock at the moment, deer in the headlights thing...

The "doorway" is the space between the support rails and to get there he'd have to step over the 3rd rail which carries 600-750 volts of electricity. It's also not that low to step over - at least it doesn't look that low to me, from the platforms.

The whole thing is f*cked up.

The Post is a disgusting rag. I don't understand why people read it.

In the NY Times, they reported the victim may have also been drinking.

Here is an article that discusses (seriously) what to do if you fall (or I suppose, are pushed) onto the subway tracks:

http://gawker.com/5965694/what-to-do-if-you-fall-onto-the-subway-tracks-run-away-seriously?tag=how-to

jone70 said:

In the NY Times, they reported the victim may have also been drinking.

Here is an article that discusses (seriously) what to do if you fall (or I suppose, are pushed) onto the subway tracks:

http://gawker.com/5965694/what-to-do-if-you-fall-onto-the-subway-tracks-run-away-seriously?tag=how-to

His wife indicated that he had been drinking

jone70 said:

XxAxX said:

i see that too. looks like some kind of doorway or something. the victim was likely in shock at the moment, deer in the headlights thing...

The "doorway" is the space between the support rails and to get there he'd have to step over the 3rd rail which carries 600-750 volts of electricity. It's also not that low to step over - at least it doesn't look that low to me, from the platforms.

The whole thing is f*cked up.

The Post is a disgusting rag. I don't understand why people read it.

banks said:

jone70 said:

The "doorway" is the space between the support rails and to get there he'd have to step over the 3rd rail which carries 600-750 volts of electricity. It's also not that low to step over - at least it doesn't look that low to me, from the platforms.

The whole thing is f*cked up.

The Post is a disgusting rag. I don't understand why people read it.

I think we can all agree it's easier to jump over the third rail than climb back onto the platform.

z

sexton said:

banks said:

I think we can all agree it's easier to jump over the third rail than climb back onto the platform.

Maybe... everytime something like this happens I think about what I would do. I feel like I'd be so panicked that I'd trip trying to step over the 3rd rail and fry myself.

There's also the "try to lie flat in the muck between the rails and hope the train rolls over you" option.

If I see someone who seems a little "off" I subtlely (so as not to agitate them further) try to move away from them and try to stand in front of a column...that way no one can come up from behind and push me. They'd have to grab me from the front putting themselves between me and the train tracks.

The fact we even have to have this discussion is another thing that annoys me about society. It should be common sense to keep your hands to yourself and not push someone in front of a f*cking train.

jone70 said:

z

sexton said:

I think we can all agree it's easier to jump over the third rail than climb back onto the platform.

Maybe... everytime something like this happens I think about what I would do. I feel like I'd be so panicked that I'd trip trying to step over the 3rd rail and fry myself.

There's also the "try to lie flat in the muck between the rails and hope the train rolls over you" option.

If I see someone who seems a little "off" I subtlely (so as not to agitate them further) try to move away from them and try to stand in front of a column...that way no one can come up from behind and push me. They'd have to grab me from the front putting themselves between me and the train tracks.

The fact we even have to have this discussion is another thing that annoys me about society. It should be common sense to keep your hands to yourself and not push someone in front of a f*cking train.

I think being pushed in front of an oncoming train is a pretty rare occurrence. What is more common is people falling onto the tracks on their own due to fainting, drunkenness or seizures.