SynthiaRose said:

I was reading a recent story about Floyd Mayweather and Ray J going to a strip club and throwing $20,000 at the strippers there. Floyd Mayweather and Ray J, especially Ray J, are fucking idiots. Maybe I´m being judgmental here, and I don´t really know them, but I can´t stand Ray J.

I looked up their ages and Floyd and 35 and Ray J is 31. I'm sorry, I find this incredibly bizarre -- that a man would grow in age but not in sexual refinement. Why would a man grow in sexual refinement as the years go by? Age does not necessarily equal sexual refinement. Look at all those "dirty old men" type of guys running around. And Ray J and sexual refinement? Of all people? Ray J? Haven´t you seen that Kim Kardashian video? Ray J and sexual refinement are polar opposites. There´s nothing to refine to begin with.

I can understand if they went to burlesque shows -- because burlesque is fucking art, okay?!

Is it, really? Maybe. To me it seems a bit like some relic from the days of the Wild West. I don´t mind burlesque dancing, the visual aspects of it and the stuff that comes with it (tatoos, old school lingerie, etc. etc) but, frankly,I find it boring and it does nothing for me, and I´ve ODed on tatoos, lingerie, platinum blonde hair, pale make up etc. etc.

It´s nice, but overpresent these days. Sometimes I feel oversaturated, like a foie gras goose.

It is elevated and elegant, I think burlesque is quite beautiful. And let's face it, people are not pouring liquor on the Burlesque performers and throwing singles at them.

True dat.

Are there seriously guys out there who pour liquor on women and throw singles at them?

How disgusting. Then again, men often do disgusting stuff when they´re drunk and with their "buddies", especially in whorehouses or at stripclubs, so I wouldn´t be too surprised if what you say is true.

To me the whole culture of the strip club is low, BASIC, ugly, cheap and trashy. Seriously, throwing dollars at women? And then the women pick them up from the floor? How does this not make both parties feel like shit. This is some degenerate shit.

I agree. Most folks on this thread disagree. To each his (or her) own. There are women (and men) who are willing to humiliate themselves, and there are men (and women) who enjoy this stuff ( not necessarily humiliating people but enjoying this whole phenomenon). Whatever floats their boat(s). Different strokes for different folks. I won´t say I´ll never understand it because I do but that doesn´t mean I´d enjoy it. I

I can understand going to strip clubs in your 20s. Sex is still new. You're kind dumb to the multi-dimensions of sexuality, and the idea that it can be elevated and beautiful. So, gutter trash sex is titillating.

Sexually, I was doing crazy intense shit in my 20s. But I have NEVER had any interest in strip clubs, strippers, or prostitutes. I knew many of them but never liked the atmosphere of their workplaces. But I´ve always liked beautiful, naked women with nice bodies ever since I was a little kid.

How is gutter sex attractive for a grown ass man?

Gutter sex will always be attractive for a lot of men...and women. You´d be surprised if you knew how many socalled "refined" and elite, sophisticated people like gutter sex and everything that comes with it, from simple stuff like watching big titted strippers to sucking out used condoms of the Johns that came before them or fucking prostitutes without using a condom just for the thrill of it or paying a girl to walk her around the block on a leash like a dog while whipping her with a whiplash just for the fun of it. It´s a big world with lots of different people with lots of different interests.

I´m not into gutter sex though.

Only thing I can think is that their minds are stunted and that they really haven't developed any meaningful thoughts and identity when it comes to sexuality. They are just dumb members of a herd following the crowd.

Ray J? For sure.

Many men? Definitely. Then again I´ve never been a "buddy buddy" type of man and hate most "men" activities but most guys on this thread are really nice people ( who obviously happen to like strippers and strip clubs).

It's not just Floyd and men. Women can be guilty too. I know on RHOA, Kandi Burruss is 36 and she cannot live without having a naked male stripper swing a dick in her face at a social gathering.

I just don't understand how at 35, 40 or 50, one has the same sexual mentality they had at 20. Will Floyd be 65 and still at the strip club? Will you?

Will I ? I hope not. Never liked strip clubs, striptease,strippers and any sexual service you have to pay for. And I could tell you MANY stories about whores, whorehouses, pimping, strippers and red light districts...but I find that whole scene disgusting (probably because I´ve spent enough time in that environment). Floyd and Ray J will probably be just the same or worse. Just take a look at Prince and how his ideas of sex and relationships have regressed over the years. In the past, some questionable lyrics were kept in the vault, these days, some of the really ugly stuff gets an official release while some of his classic shit gets the "self-censorship" treatment.

But hey, who knows...at 65 , I´ll probably be a bitter, old and lonely man who goes to strip clubs or hookers, or invites them to his home.

I´ll convince myself that it´s just a service they´re offering, like going to a chiropractic or dentist, and it basically is, isn´t it?

We all compromise on our principles sooner or later. Don´t we?

my responses are in red!

KoolEaze said:

Why would a man grow in sexual refinement as the years go by? Age does not necessarily equal sexual refinement. Look at all those "dirty old men" type of guys running around. And Ray J and sexual refinement? Of all people? Ray J? Haven´t you seen that Kim Kardashian video? Ray J and sexual refinement are polar opposites. There´s nothing to refine to begin with.

I think I'm going to quote one of your favorite sayings back to you now: "The man who views the world at 50 the same as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life."--
(Muhammad Ali)"

Checkmate and thanks for playing.

Or do you isolate sexuality into the rare realm of things where a man doesn't progresss his views?

Sexually, I was doing crazy intense shit in my 20s. But I have NEVER had any interest in strip clubs, strippers, or prostitutes. I knew many of them but never liked the atmosphere of their workplaces. But I´ve always liked beautiful, naked women with nice bodies ever since I was a little kid.

As you should. The human body is gorgeous. That's not what my objection is over, but I know you know that.

Gutter sex will always be attractive for a lot of men...and women. You´d be surprised if you knew how many socalled "refined" and elite, sophisticated people like gutter sex and everything that comes with it, from simple stuff like watching big titted strippers to sucking out used condoms of the Johns that came before them or fucking prostitutes without using a condom just for the thrill of it or paying a girl to walk her around the block on a leash like a dog while whipping her with a whiplash just for the fun of it. It´s a big world with lots of different people with lots of different interests.

I´m not into gutter sex though.

Just to clarify, I'm not suggesting people be sophisticated, per se. Or that sex be elegant -- because primal, raw sex can be amazing. But I expect the two people to respect each other. And have mutual dignity. Even if a couple agrees to walking each other on a leash, I presume there is a relationship of trust and respect there that allows this to be so risque.

So to me, that can't really compare to a strip club. These are strangers who don't even known each other degrading each other and acting like it's the epitome of awesomeness. It's hollow anyway because it's so detached and then they strip anything else beautiful from it; it's almost blasphemous to me, but I understand that maybe I'm not explaining my passions about this properly so people can't relate to what I'm saying.

But ok, right there is a big world. But I am telling you I bet Floyd Mayweather felt like he was THE MAN -- and that's the thing... there is some weird mentality going on. He doesn't see it for what it is. He says this as the top of the sex pyramid, but it's the bottom. His behavior to me makes him reptilian, not a man.

I just have very VERY strong views about this. You know i"m not sexually uptight, but I do believe the human body should be respected and man and women should have respect for each other if they do something sexual.

but most guys on this thread are really nice people ( who obviously happen to like strippers and strip clubs).

Oh yes, I know. I'm just really passionate about this. I don't hate these people or think they're scum. I like most of them. I'm just venting.my

But hey, who knows...at 65 , I´ll probably be a bitter, old and lonely man who goes to strip clubs or hookers, or invites them to his home.

Um.....No. I predict you will fall in love and have elevated yet primal sex without using dollar bills.

[Edited 10/6/12 21:13pm]

SynthiaRose said:

JoeTyler said:

thread back on track:

wooohh party!!!

Well, I see that video, but I raise this this one.

No thrown dollars or skanky behavior. The art of the strip tease.....with everyone's dignity in tact:

[Edited 10/6/12 17:38pm]

The burlesque ones always make sure to leave a lot to the imagination even when it does reveal breasts - though covered up in pastries.

Stymie said:

thinking someone has a mental delay is not a judgment? Why would you go there? Why not just ask why people enjoy going to strip clubs? And now folks are degenerates? How is my saying its jacked to make a judgment now a judgment? But carry on. I should have never replied to this thread in the first place.

Stymie I'm glad you responded. Disagreeing with you doesn't bother me. Yes, I'm passionate about this topic, so I'm kinda heated with these responses. And to be honest, I didn't realize what i said was going to be so controversial. But in the end, it's just a conversation to me.

No hard feelings, please.

But I think it's time for me to let this debate go.....

[Edited 10/6/12 21:33pm]

Stymie said:

SynthiaRose said:

Adisa said:

Et tu, Brute? I sought other views while giving my own.

LOL at people passing judgement while calling this thread judgemental.

People judge in life. It's pretty standard... as your comment clearly shows.

thinking someone has a mental delay is not a judgment? Why would you go there? Why not just ask why people enjoy going to strip clubs? And now folks are degenerates? How is my saying its jacked to make a judgment now a judgment? But carry on. I should have never replied to this thread in the first place.

I love going to see naked women. I love it when they stick their tits in my face, and I love to watch them dance and shake what they got. And as far as the Champagne Room...let's just say my experience has been a bit different from Chris Rock's.

It's not that deep or serious. And it has nothing to do with anything mental or mind-related in the first damn place.

Haven't you ever heard the term "mindless entertainment"? Some people like stupid comedies. Others enjoy a good shoot-em-up action movie. And some of us just love to watch titties bounce and asses shake. I assure you, "meaningful thoughts," as the OP mentioned, do not enter the picture.

The original post speaks VOLUMES about the OP's issues, and says next to nothing about the people who enjoy this certain form of entertainment.

Efan said:

"Sexual refinement" sounds like an oxymoron, and definitely not something to strive for.

I'm 42 and I love looking at titties. And I'm a gay man. Not that I go to female strip clubs all that often, but if any of my friends asked me to, I'd be like, "Hell, yeah!"

Thank you.

I know I'm late to this thread, but the whole idea of "sexual refinement" made me LOL.

Sex isn't refined. It's primal. It's animal. It's raw. It's the fulfillment of needs and desires that are completely unrelated to refinement and elegance.

I love to read, learn, elevate my mind, all kinds of grown-up and "mature" things.

But when it comes to sex and sexuality? I want to FUCK. I want to lick, suck, drool, touch, slip, slide, squeeze, watch bodies moving and gyrating and penetrating and bouncing and shaking, taking take delight and joy in complete nakedness - in every sense of the word.

If I were to meet a potential partner who expressed the hangups about sex that are revealed in the post which started this thread, I would run as far as possible in the opposite direction.

P.S. I'm a married woman in my 30s. My husband and I have a mature, loving, supportive and joyful union filled with communication and respect.

P.P.S. SynthiaRose, are you willing to accept the possibility that the fact that a person frequents a strip club doesn't necessarily mean they fit the pathetic description you provided? (My example alone would seem to disprove your stated theory, no?)

PurpleJedi said:

The stripper giving me a "show" had only one good titty (I am not joking).

as long as it was a good one

PunkMistress said:

Efan said:

"Sexual refinement" sounds like an oxymoron, and definitely not something to strive for.

I'm 42 and I love looking at titties. And I'm a gay man. Not that I go to female strip clubs all that often, but if any of my friends asked me to, I'd be like, "Hell, yeah!"

Thank you.

I know I'm late to this thread, but the whole idea of "sexual refinement" made me LOL.

Sex isn't refined. It's primal. It's animal. It's raw. It's the fulfillment of needs and desires that are completely unrelated to refinement and elegance.

I love to read, learn, elevate my mind, all kinds of grown-up and "mature" things.

But when it comes to sex and sexuality? I want to FUCK. I want to lick, suck, drool, touch, slip, slide, squeeze, watch bodies moving and gyrating and penetrating and bouncing and shaking, taking take delight and joy in complete nakedness - in every sense of the word.

If I were to meet a potential partner who expressed the hangups about sex that are revealed in the post which started this thread, I would run as far as possible in the opposite direction.

P.S. I'm a married woman in my 30s. My husband and I have a mature, loving, supportive and joyful union filled with communication and respect.

P.P.S. SynthiaRose, are you willing to accept the possibility that the fact that a person frequents a strip club doesn't necessarily mean they fit the pathetic description you provided? (My example alone would seem to disprove your stated theory, no?)

Thank you. I wonder how many 20something year-old men the OP even knows personally. I know tons, and their views on sexuality and sexual behavior greatly vary. Some are ultra-conservative and have biblical views on sex. Some are virgins. Some are wild and free with it all. Some aare finding their sexual identity. Some think porn is distigsting, and some are fighting a porn addiction. The point is as they grow older some of those views may swing to the other side of their spectrums. Whatever stage they are in or will be in, THAT will be THEIR OWN sexual and MENTAL growth.

went to one once early 20s in hawaii .. was bored .. it was hot the chicks were sweaty u had to buy drinks it wasnt sexy ..

Probably the same reason women in their 30s and 40s read Fifty Shades of Grey.

SynthiaRose said:

I just don't understand how at 35, 40 or 50, one has the same sexual mentality they had at 20. Will Floyd be 65 and still at the strip club? Will you?

for what it is worth, i appreciate where ur coming from(sex can be an enlightening mutual exercise/experience etc), but most people dont pursue or experience sex in that way and for that reason. also dont forget the sexism involved inthe practice....

i think it mght be case of "know your audience". its not aboutmental retardation so much as, for a lot of people,esp men in our culture, things stay on the "american pie" level. it seems morelike emotional retardation than an intellectual thing. like people who prefer mastrubation to having lovers(lars and the real girl stuff)itsan immature response to a perfectly heathly natural impulse we all have.

its always disappointing when people dont strive but i dont think they are defective or wonky or whatever.

wavesofbliss said:

SynthiaRose said:

I just don't understand how at 35, 40 or 50, one has the same sexual mentality they had at 20. Will Floyd be 65 and still at the strip club? Will you?

for what it is worth, i appreciate where ur coming from(sex can be an enlightening mutual exercise/experience etc), but most people dont pursue or experience sex in that way and for that reason. also dont forget the sexism involved inthe practice....

i think it mght be case of "know your audience". its not aboutmental retardation so much as, for a lot of people,esp men in our culture, things stay on the "american pie" level. it seems morelike emotional retardation than an intellectual thing. like people who prefer mastrubation to having lovers(lars and the real girl stuff)itsan immature response to a perfectly heathly natural impulse we all have.

its always disappointing when people dont strive but i dont think they are defective or wonky or whatever.

Why can't we have both? I like to masturbate AND have partnered sex. I like raunchy porn and strippers AND I am in a monogamous, romantic relationship with deeply connected, intensely intimate lovemaking.

Explain to me how consuming entertainment such as strippers constitutes, as you said, "an immature response."

PunkMistress said:

wavesofbliss said:

for what it is worth, i appreciate where ur coming from(sex can be an enlightening mutual exercise/experience etc), but most people dont pursue or experience sex in that way and for that reason. also dont forget the sexism involved inthe practice....

i think it mght be case of "know your audience". its not aboutmental retardation so much as, for a lot of people,esp men in our culture, things stay on the "american pie" level. it seems morelike emotional retardation than an intellectual thing. like people who prefer mastrubation to having lovers(lars and the real girl stuff)itsan immature response to a perfectly heathly natural impulse we all have.

its always disappointing when people dont strive but i dont think they are defective or wonky or whatever.

Why can't we have both? I like to masturbate AND have partnered sex. I like raunchy porn and strippers AND I am in a monogamous, romantic relationship with deeply connected, intensely intimate lovemaking.

Explain to me how consuming entertainment such as strippers constitutes, as you said, "an immature response."

THANK YOU!!! I mean seriously...

RenHoek said:

PunkMistress said:

Why can't we have both? I like to masturbate AND have partnered sex. I like raunchy porn and strippers AND I am in a monogamous, romantic relationship with deeply connected, intensely intimate lovemaking.

Explain to me how consuming entertainment such as strippers constitutes, as you said, "an immature response."

THANK YOU!!! I mean seriously...

Ren knows what I'm talkin' about! A big Borat Hiiiiii Fiiiiiiive to my fellow happily-married, certified nasty freak!

The posters on this thread who are throwing judgments seem to have no basis for what they're saying. The ones speaking about "immaturity" and "mental delays" don't have any experience to back up their claims. But so far, those of us who DO choose to frequent strippers and the like after a certain age have shown ourselves to be mature, thoughtful, well-rounded and open-minded people who - GASP! - have more than one facet to their sexuality.

Four of the poeple who have posted here about enjoying strippers are happily partnered - which blows away these claims of stunted, lonely individuals (or, in the OP's own words, lowly reptiles with no pride) who are incapable of relating to "real women" or understanding the beauty and nuance of sex.

In other words: FAIL!

(Edited to include direct quotes of the hateful language used by the OP.)

[Edited 10/8/12 21:55pm]

I don't think that refinement looks the same in terms of sexuality as it looks in terms of how we act, dress, etc.

I think it looks the opposite.

When I was young, I was turned on by big blond hair and breasts. That is still fine, but now I can get turned on by a neck, a calf, an ear. So I am far MORE "perverted" than I was as a kid. I objectify more than I ever have. I am refining my powers of objectification. That does not mean I don't respect women. It just means I think they are beautiful in more ways than ever.

But one thing I will go with the OP on, is that I don't like strip clubs as much as I used to. But as much as I may have changed, I believe that they have changed even more.

I was never a huge fan, but when I was young, they were a place to go have a fake beer and a smoke while you watched some naked women dance. Now they are a place where you cannot be left alone for the strippers wanting to give you a lap dance. Somewhere along the line they discovered where the real money is, and while the pole dancing is still thriving, the offers for lap dances are a constant distraction.

So I would actually agree with the OP that I would probably rather see a burlesque show at this point. But it's for reasons that have nothing to do with sex.

sorry but if you think 30's and 40's in general are old and you have to have experienced certain things by a certain age, that says more about narrowmindedness than anything else.

[Edited 10/8/12 22:45pm]

That's what some men do... the visual thing. I don't see the big deal.

To be straight up, some men are going to strip clubs because that's all they can do, look. You'd be surprise how many 40 year old men are walking around flaccid.... Viagra isn't the cure all for everything.

I know I´m in the minority here but I happen to find most of the responses to the OP just as rude and judgmental as the participants here accuse her of. Of course she could´ve chosen better words than to call men who frequent strip clubs "mentally delayed" but as far as I´m concerned she made an effort to elaborate a bit on what she meant, and I see absolutely no hint of her "having issues" , at least not from what she wrote, and especially not after she responded to my post and explained what she meant ( with the Floyd Mayweather example).

I mean it´s nice that you all enjoy strip clubs, have fulfilling sex lives and relationships but to assume that the OP "has issues" just because she has had a different experience with strip clubs or different views on that topic is, in my opinion, also a bit hurtful, but that´s my opinion. I happen to have a very active, kinky, nasty, raw and highly physical sex life ( not that it´s anybody´s business here) but I also happen to find strip clubs and everything that comes with that territory extremely sleazy, cheap, vulgar, obscene and totally devoid of any eroticism, and while I do agree with Ol´ Dirty Bastard ( "Ooooh baby I like it raw"), I also see the OP´s point about sexual refinement. This doesn´t mean that I don´t understand why strip clubs, strippers and everything that comes with it might be an accepted and popular form of entertainment to some people (or, to most people, as seen in this thread). But to me they´re just as un-erotic as those video chicks you see in most rap videos these days.

But I also do agree with Punkmistress that the words the OP used were inappropriate ( I don´t find them very hateful though because of the way she tried to explain her use of them in her reply to my post).

Anyway, that´s just my opinion.

The whole direction of this thread actually made me a bit sad for a bunch of reasons and I will stay out of this after one more reply to the OP.

SynthiaRose said:

my responses are in red!

KoolEaze said:

[Edited 10/6/12 21:13pm]

I want to clarify that the man who was walking around the block with that naked girl was NOT her partner and the whole thing was NOT some fetish thing executed in the privacy of the "couple´s" home.

It was a man who went from hooker to hooker in the redlight distric of Hamburg, asking the girls something outrageous and most of them almost attacked him for asking them. At first I didn´t know what he wanted them to do. Then he found a girl who was willing to undress, wearing nothing but boots and a mask, he handcuffed her with her hands on her back, put a leash with a long chain around her neck and then he walked her around the block like you´d walk a dog, all the while whipping her with a lash. Legally it was a very questionable thing but he paid her well. The other prostitutes freaked out and were booing and shouting.

I know this has probably very little to do with strip clubs and the average strip club connoisseur but my point is that I do agree with the OP that there are indeed some underlying mysoginistic tendencies in some men who think they can behave the way they behave simply because they are men, or drunk, or pay money, or are dealing with strippers and prostitutes.

But I know this may sound very far fetched to some people on this thread, and like I said, it has nothing to do with the average strip club visitor.

PunkMistress tellin' it like it is

uPtoWnNY said:

PunkMistress tellin' it like it is

...after reading about all that "gyrating and penetrating and bouncing and shaking" I lost track of what anyone was saying...

electricberet said:

Probably the same reason women in their 30s and 40s read Fifty Shades of Grey.

Anyway, people really should try to concentrate on why they do the things they do and maybe stop wasting so much time trying to figure out why others do what they do.

wavesofbliss said:

SynthiaRose said:

I just don't understand how at 35, 40 or 50, one has the same sexual mentality they had at 20. Will Floyd be 65 and still at the strip club? Will you?

for what it is worth, i appreciate where ur coming from(sex can be an enlightening mutual exercise/experience etc), but most people dont pursue or experience sex in that way and for that reason. also dont forget the sexism involved inthe practice....

i think it mght be case of "know your audience". its not aboutmental retardation so much as, for a lot of people,esp men in our culture, things stay on the "american pie" level. it seems morelike emotional retardation than an intellectual thing. like people who prefer mastrubation to having lovers(lars and the real girl stuff)itsan immature response to a perfectly heathly natural impulse we all have.

its always disappointing when people dont strive but i dont think they are defective or wonky or whatever.

I prefer masturbation for two reasons: men were not getting me off and not wanting to deal with the bullshit that comes along with sex. Immature? If you say so. If I were out there fucking men until I found the "one" I'd be viewed as a whore.

JustErin said:

electricberet said:

Probably the same reason women in their 30s and 40s read Fifty Shades of Grey.

Anyway, people really should try to concentrate on why they do the things they do and maybe stop wasting so much time trying to figure out why others do what they do.

KoolEaze said:

I know I´m in the minority here but I happen to find most of the responses to the OP just as rude and judgmental as the participants here accuse her of. Of course she could´ve chosen better words than to call men who frequent strip clubs "mentally delayed" but as far as I´m concerned she made an effort to elaborate a bit on what she meant, and I see absolutely no hint of her "having issues" , at least not from what she wrote, and especially not after she responded to my post and explained what she meant ( with the Floyd Mayweather example).

I mean it´s nice that you all enjoy strip clubs, have fulfilling sex lives and relationships but to assume that the OP "has issues" just because she has had a different experience with strip clubs or different views on that topic is, in my opinion, also a bit hurtful, but that´s my opinion. I happen to have a very active, kinky, nasty, raw and highly physical sex life ( not that it´s anybody´s business here) but I also happen to find strip clubs and everything that comes with that territory extremely sleazy, cheap, vulgar, obscene and totally devoid of any eroticism, and while I do agree with Ol´ Dirty Bastard ( "Ooooh baby I like it raw"), I also see the OP´s point about sexual refinement. This doesn´t mean that I don´t understand why strip clubs, strippers and everything that comes with it might be an accepted and popular form of entertainment to some people (or, to most people, as seen in this thread). But to me they´re just as un-erotic as those video chicks you see in most rap videos these days.

But I also do agree with Punkmistress that the words the OP used were inappropriate ( I don´t find them very hateful though because of the way she tried to explain her use of them in her reply to my post).

Anyway, that´s just my opinion.

The whole direction of this thread actually made me a bit sad for a bunch of reasons and I will stay out of this after one more reply to the OP.

Regardless of what she meant E, it doesn't work to paint people with broad strokes. We wouldn't know why any of these people do what they do unless we asked each of them. Who are we to sit back and make assumptions about people we don't know and don't care about? Had the OP phrased it differently, she may have gotten the answers she was looking for.

NDRU said:

But one thing I will go with the OP on, is that I don't like strip clubs as much as I used to. But as much as I may have changed, I believe that they have changed even more.

I was never a huge fan, but when I was young, they were a place to go have a fake beer and a smoke while you watched some naked women dance. Now they are a place where you cannot be left alone for the strippers wanting to give you a lap dance. Somewhere along the line they discovered where the real money is, and while the pole dancing is still thriving, the offers for lap dances are a constant distraction.

So I would actually agree with the OP that I would probably rather see a burlesque show at this point. But it's for reasons that have nothing to do with sex.

Yeah, that's why a few times was enough for me. Some of those women would just put their leg around me, start grinding themselves against me and tell me that I should pay. Well, I did pay, but it didn't feel comfortable at all.

I hope that my earlier comment that referred to the dancers being often immigrants wasn't taken simply in the sense that "men that go to strip clubs are bad and the women are victims". I was really just more bothered how exploitative it could sometimes be according to my own experiences, from all angles involved.

KoolEaze said:

I know I´m in the minority here but I happen to find most of the responses to the OP just as rude and judgmental as the participants here accuse her of. Of course she could´ve chosen better words than to call men who frequent strip clubs "mentally delayed" but as far as I´m concerned she made an effort to elaborate a bit on what she meant, and I see absolutely no hint of her "having issues" , at least not from what she wrote, and especially not after she responded to my post and explained what she meant ( with the Floyd Mayweather example).

I mean it´s nice that you all enjoy strip clubs, have fulfilling sex lives and relationships but to assume that the OP "has issues" just because she has had a different experience with strip clubs or different views on that topic is, in my opinion, also a bit hurtful, but that´s my opinion. I happen to have a very active, kinky, nasty, raw and highly physical sex life ( not that it´s anybody´s business here) but I also happen to find strip clubs and everything that comes with that territory extremely sleazy, cheap, vulgar, obscene and totally devoid of any eroticism, and while I do agree with Ol´ Dirty Bastard ( "Ooooh baby I like it raw"), I also see the OP´s point about sexual refinement. This doesn´t mean that I don´t understand why strip clubs, strippers and everything that comes with it might be an accepted and popular form of entertainment to some people (or, to most people, as seen in this thread). But to me they´re just as un-erotic as those video chicks you see in most rap videos these days.

But I also do agree with Punkmistress that the words the OP used were inappropriate ( I don´t find them very hateful though because of the way she tried to explain her use of them in her reply to my post).

Anyway, that´s just my opinion.

The whole direction of this thread actually made me a bit sad for a bunch of reasons and I will stay out of this after one more reply to the OP.

I appreciate a kindred mind.

(except I don't agree with PunkMistress. I found her responses ridiculous and short-sighted for reasons I'll explain in a bit).

Stymie said:

KoolEaze said:

I know I´m in the minority here but I happen to find most of the responses to the OP just as rude and judgmental as the participants here accuse her of. Of course she could´ve chosen better words than to call men who frequent strip clubs "mentally delayed" but as far as I´m concerned she made an effort to elaborate a bit on what she meant, and I see absolutely no hint of her "having issues" , at least not from what she wrote, and especially not after she responded to my post and explained what she meant ( with the Floyd Mayweather example).

I mean it´s nice that you all enjoy strip clubs, have fulfilling sex lives and relationships but to assume that the OP "has issues" just because she has had a different experience with strip clubs or different views on that topic is, in my opinion, also a bit hurtful, but that´s my opinion. I happen to have a very active, kinky, nasty, raw and highly physical sex life ( not that it´s anybody´s business here) but I also happen to find strip clubs and everything that comes with that territory extremely sleazy, cheap, vulgar, obscene and totally devoid of any eroticism, and while I do agree with Ol´ Dirty Bastard ( "Ooooh baby I like it raw"), I also see the OP´s point about sexual refinement. This doesn´t mean that I don´t understand why strip clubs, strippers and everything that comes with it might be an accepted and popular form of entertainment to some people (or, to most people, as seen in this thread). But to me they´re just as un-erotic as those video chicks you see in most rap videos these days.

But I also do agree with Punkmistress that the words the OP used were inappropriate ( I don´t find them very hateful though because of the way she tried to explain her use of them in her reply to my post).

Anyway, that´s just my opinion.

The whole direction of this thread actually made me a bit sad for a bunch of reasons and I will stay out of this after one more reply to the OP.

Regardless of what she meant E, it doesn't work to paint people with broad strokes. We wouldn't know why any of these people do what they do unless we asked each of them. Who are we to sit back and make assumptions about people we don't know and don't care about? Had the OP phrased it differently, she may have gotten the answers she was looking for.

Agreed. I don't think people are taking offense at the topic of "why" people go to strip clubs, or even if it's a yay or nay thing, rather than the delivery in the OP that reeked up judgement, a sense of superiority over anyone not in alignment with their taste, and little to no room left for anyone to have a different opinion without being found lacking, or less than in some way. We're a pretty chatty bunch around here with a willingness to dialogue about nearly anything, but a little less arrogance and a few less sweeping generalizations might go a longer way in encouraging others here to engage in discussion in a more measured fashion. A wise woman here once taught me many years ago that there is a difference between criticizing concepts and ideas vs. criticizing people, and with the latter having taken up far too much of the OP that started this whole thing, I don't find it surprising at all that that the post has garnered as many knee-jerk reactions as it has.

However the post was intended, it came off as accusatory, belittling, and in closing one could dare say with an infallibly superior attitude concerning what constitutes maturity and taste where sex is concerned- and quite frankly, that's just so uncool.

I don't think Synthia actually meant to offend anyone here, just looks like the way the message was communicated was crappy and she was completely oblivious to that. Poop happens. We'll get through it. Another thread where we can all live, learn, and try to understand one another, after of course, initially being misunderstood. Another day on the Org, Chile.