The league has crippled the Saints 4 next season. Coach gone 4 year, other major punishments.

Other news, Tebow 2 Jets. Why would they want this scrub?

[Edited 3/21/12 10:36am]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7718136/sean-payton-new-orleans-saints-banned-one-year-bounties

Oh well...

That's real bad.

I can't believe it!!!

I had to google it for myself.

Tim Tebow traded to New York Jets

Graycap23 said:

The league has crippled the Saints 4 next season. Coach gone 4 year, other major punishments.

Other news, Tebow 2 Jets. Why would they want this scrub?

[Edited 3/21/12 10:36am]

This wasn't a football move. The Jets braintrust can't get over the Giants beating them and going on to win the Super Bowl. They hate being second to Big Blue. The Tebow move is all about publicity, headlines and selling tickets/jerseys. Tebow is a scrub, but he's extremly popular and generates buzz. Woody Johnson(the Jets owner) wants that.

Wonder how Mark Sanchez feels right now.

[Edited 3/21/12 10:57am]

uPtoWnNY said:

Graycap23 said:

The league has crippled the Saints 4 next season. Coach gone 4 year, other major punishments.

Other news, Tebow 2 Jets. Why would they want this scrub?

[Edited 3/21/12 10:36am]

This wasn't a football move. The Jets braintrust can't get over the Giants beating them and going on to win the Super Bowl. They hate being second to Big Blue. The Tebow move is all about publicity, headlines and selling tickets/jerseys. Tebow is a scrub, but he's extremly popular and generates buzz. Woody Johnson(the Jets owner) wants that.

It certainly wasn't a football move.

Dude is a scrub.

If the saints were really doing that, I think they deserve it

Graycap23 said:

uPtoWnNY said:

This wasn't a football move. The Jets braintrust can't get over the Giants beating them and going on to win the Super Bowl. They hate being second to Big Blue. The Tebow move is all about publicity, headlines and selling tickets/jerseys. Tebow is a scrub, but he's extremly popular and generates buzz. Woody Johnson(the Jets owner) wants that.

It certainly wasn't a football move.

Dude is a scrub.

I think it was, but not for Tebow.

To push Sanchez.

Sanchez has some Hollywood in him. The NY fanbase and media are impatient. I think this was designed to send a message to #6: we will take your job and your shine if you don't step it up in '12.

uPtoWnNY said:

Graycap23 said:

The league has crippled the Saints 4 next season. Coach gone 4 year, other major punishments.

Other news, Tebow 2 Jets. Why would they want this scrub?

[Edited 3/21/12 10:36am]

This wasn't a football move. The Jets braintrust can't get over the Giants beating them and going on to win the Super Bowl. They hate being second to Big Blue. The Tebow move is all about publicity, headlines and selling tickets/jerseys. Tebow is a scrub, but he's extremly popular and generates buzz. Woody Johnson(the Jets owner) wants that.

Wonder how Mark Sanchez feels right now.

Nevamind how Sanchez FEELS...do you think he'll step up his game now???

NDRU said:

If the saints were really doing that, I think they deserve it

Bounties have been going on forever. Buddy Ryan was famous for it. The difference is:

1. The league is getting sued by former players, accusing it of not doing enough to stop injuries.

2. The league's health care costs (IIRC) are going up in the new CBA.

Plus, The Saints allegedly lied to the Commissioner's office about the system.

namepeace said:

NDRU said:

If the saints were really doing that, I think they deserve it

Bounties have been going on forever. Buddy Ryan was famous for it. The difference is:

1. The league is getting sued by former players, accusing it of not doing enough to stop injuries.

2. The league's health care costs (IIRC) are going up in the new CBA.

Plus, The Saints allegedly lied to the Commissioner's office about the system.

I'm not surprised. I can see an unwritten approval of injuring opposing players. Actual cash awards are a little surprising, I guess.

It's a fine line, because football is violent. But I think it's kind of damaging to the entire league if you encourage injuries.

Of course, I am a peace loving tree hugger

Tim Tebow hits snag for Jets, Broncs

After word spread rapidly Wednesday that the New York Jets had acquired quarterback Tim Tebow from Denver for draft picks, the teams have encountered a hang-up in the language in Tebow's contract that could nullify the trade, a Broncos source tells ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter.

Tebow has about $5 million worth of recapture language in his contract, meaning the Jets would have to pay back some money to Denver, and the Jets might be unwilling to do that.

http://espn.go.com/new-yo...ource-says

namepeace said:

Graycap23 said:

It certainly wasn't a football move.

Dude is a scrub.

I think it was, but not for Tebow.

To push Sanchez.

Sanchez has some Hollywood in him. The NY fanbase and media are impatient. I think this was designed to send a message to #6: we will take your job and your shine if you don't step it up in '12.

If you're going to push Sanchez, how about getting a QB who can throw the ball.

@Purple - Sanchez was no. 5 on the reasons the Jets finished 8-8. The o-line sucked(Sanchez was getting beat up all season), no stud RB, no legit pass rusher and no safety. The Jets had the lead in the Denver game. It wasn't the QB's fault the defense allowed Tebow to march the offense 90+ yards for the winning score. Sure Sanchez has to improve, but the entire team and the coaches took a step back.

namepeace said:

NDRU said:

If the saints were really doing that, I think they deserve it

Bounties have been going on forever. Buddy Ryan was famous for it. The difference is:

1. The league is getting sued by former players, accusing it of not doing enough to stop injuries.

2. The league's health care costs (IIRC) are going up in the new CBA.

Plus, The Saints allegedly lied to the Commissioner's office about the system.

Those "punishments" are ridiculous. Take away the draft picks, sure...suspend Payton for three-five games, sure...Williams, who was known to do this before in Washington, suspend indefinitely.

But suspend Payton for the whole fucking season? WHAT??!! And the assistant coach for six games? And then the NFL is still going to come back later and suspend players?

I agree with my man Drew..."I am speechless."

I would give my left nut (seriously...I already have three kids and aint having no more) to see my Saints go all the way this year, in spite of this foolishness. And then, to have Roger "Bow Down To Me" Goodell have to stand in the middle of the Superdome and hand Drew the Lombardi trophy AGAIN, in front of the New Orleans faithful.

Mr. Goodell...

Goodell is out of control.

I agree with the punishments....it's the only way to curtail this kind of stuff....stiff, hard punishments.

The game has changed...

Now, where's that happy median between dirty and good, hard hitting?

[Edited 3/21/12 15:16pm]

namepeace said:

NDRU said:

If the saints were really doing that, I think they deserve it

Bounties have been going on forever. Buddy Ryan was famous for it. The difference is:

1. The league is getting sued by former players, accusing it of not doing enough to stop injuries.

2. The league's health care costs (IIRC) are going up in the new CBA.

Plus, The Saints allegedly lied to the Commissioner's office about the system.

3. NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell said the Saints lied to his office when these claims were investigated 2 years ago.

4. The NFL warns teams against such practices before each season and still it continued.

Yes, Ryan used to award "bounties". At the same token when you see widely accepted cultural practices begin to change and shift... it's best you reconize it as such and change too, or else. We've seen the "or else", oh well.

Funny how the NFL never seemed to care about concussions and all of that until it went public that they refuse to take care of the old timers who built this fucking game and can now barely walk.

When the league has to give up dineros, STOP! Rather than pay to take care of these legends, let's just change all the rules of the game to make sure no one gets hurt and we dont have to hear their whining.

Same as the lockout last year...the league is greedy!

I know this is nothing new, just a pissed off Saints fan!

FUCK IT! We gon' win it all anyway!

uPtoWnNY said:

namepeace said:

I think it was, but not for Tebow.

To push Sanchez.

Sanchez has some Hollywood in him. The NY fanbase and media are impatient. I think this was designed to send a message to #6: we will take your job and your shine if you don't step it up in '12.

If you're going to push Sanchez, how about getting a QB who can throw the ball.

Maybe they think the way to push Sanchez is to have someone steal the spotlight from him. Plus, for all Tebow's faults, i) he was cheap (relatively speaking), and ii) he has manufactured wins, like Ryan's Jets have. I don't think it's a good fit, but the Jets must have for some reason. It may have hit a snag.

@Purple - Sanchez was no. 5 on the reasons the Jets finished 8-8. The o-line sucked(Sanchez was getting beat up all season), no stud RB, no legit pass rusher and no safety. The Jets had the lead in the Denver game. It wasn't the QB's fault the defense allowed Tebow to march the offense 90+ yards for the winning score. Sure Sanchez has to improve, but the entire team and the coaches took a step back.

True indeed.

StonedImmaculate said:

namepeace said:

Bounties have been going on forever. Buddy Ryan was famous for it. The difference is:

1. The league is getting sued by former players, accusing it of not doing enough to stop injuries.

2. The league's health care costs (IIRC) are going up in the new CBA.

Plus, The Saints allegedly lied to the Commissioner's office about the system.

Those "punishments" are ridiculous. Take away the draft picks, sure...suspend Payton for three-five games, sure...Williams, who was known to do this before in Washington, suspend indefinitely.

The main reason for the sentence was lying to Goddell, IMO. Payton and the GM may not have gotten any punishment outside of fines if they hadn't been found guilty of that.

But suspend Payton for the whole fucking season? WHAT??!! And the assistant coach for six games? And then the NFL is still going to come back later and suspend players?

This is about the pending lawsuits too.

I agree with my man Drew..."I am speechless."

They need to sign Brees now, and it will probably happen in the next 10 days before Loomis begins his sentence.

TD3 said:

namepeace said:

Bounties have been going on forever. Buddy Ryan was famous for it. The difference is:

1. The league is getting sued by former players, accusing it of not doing enough to stop injuries.

2. The league's health care costs (IIRC) are going up in the new CBA.

Plus, The Saints allegedly lied to the Commissioner's office about the system.

3. NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell said the Saints lied to his office when these claims were investigated 2 years ago.

4. The NFL warns teams against such practices before each season and still it continued.

Yes, Ryan used to award "bounties". At the same token when you see widely accepted cultural practices begin to change and shift... it's best you reconize it as such and change too, or else. We've seen the "or else", oh well.

Very true. As I indicated earlier and you did above, you don't lie to the Goodie Mob.

Whether Goodell has too much power can be argued. But the owners gave it to him and none of the Saints' brass are under any CBA. Goodell is judge jury and executioner, and it was stupid to lie to him.

There have been a lot of changes to the rules of the game in the last few years. This is a natural extension of that. The punishment is stiff, it penalizes the Saints fans more than anything, but Goodell plans to be around a while and he wants to send a message to everyone that old school is out.

I agree that the Saints needed to be punished but a year for coach Peyton was

way too harsh. It should have been for 8 games at the most especially considering

they pretty much let Bill Belicheck slide with a shitty fine and no games suspension.

When the two sides signed a new labor agreement the players union shouldn't have

given Roger Goodell all this fucking power. I can't wait to see the next suspension

James Harrison gets for making a routine tackle.

namepeace said:

TD3 said:

3. NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell said the Saints lied to his office when these claims were investigated 2 years ago.

4. The NFL warns teams against such practices before each season and still it continued.

Yes, Ryan used to award "bounties". At the same token when you see widely accepted cultural practices begin to change and shift... it's best you reconize it as such and change too, or else. We've seen the "or else", oh well.

Very true. As I indicated earlier and you did above, you don't lie to the Goodie Mob.

Whether Goodell has too much power can be argued. But the owners gave it to him and none of the Saints' brass are under any CBA. Goodell is judge jury and executioner, and it was stupid to lie to him.

There have been a lot of changes to the rules of the game in the last few years. This is a natural extension of that. The punishment is stiff, it penalizes the Saints fans more than anything, but Goodell plans to be around a while and he wants to send a message to everyone that old school is out.

With the exception of those who belong to a Union; in the US people can be fired and/or suspended for any reason, as long as those actions weren't because of bias or retaliation. I'm sure the owner's assumed their "guy" would never act or punish an organization as he does NFL players, oops.

Being a sports fan is an option, supporting a sports team (whether you watch on TV, have season tickets, or buy their merchandise) is an option. How much this hurts the fan base? We are so sports obsessed in this country, many have proven they'll look the other way when anytype of wrong doing is taking place. Winning shouldn't be put above everything.

====================

[Edited 3/22/12 6:48am]

Graycap23 said:

Goodell is out of control.

Thank you for reading between the line Gray.

NFL Commish Roger Goodell is out of his damn mind. And most of his latest business decisions is taking damn nearly all of the full out of playing defense. American football in the NFL is getting bad to the point that most defensive linemen AND linebackers are going to be too afraid to sack the QB without getting fined and/or suspended.

Revolution said:

I agree with the punishments....it's the only way to curtail this kind of stuff....stiff, hard punishments.

Apart from former Saints defensive coordinator Gregg Williams, no one else should have been punish, let alone head coach Sean Payton and GM Mickey Loomis.

And even with Gregg Williams, he should NOT be banned from the NFL at all. And for what, for doing his damn job by motivating the Saints defense (by any means necesssary) to shut down the passing of the opposing team?!?

TD3 said:

Being a sports fan is an option, supporting a sports team (whether you watch on TV, have season tickets, or buy their merchandise) is an option. How much this hurts the fan base? We are so sports obsessed in this country, many have proven they'll look the other way when anytype of wrong doing is taking place. Winning shouldn't be put above everything.

I think you're mining for an argument, but okay.

Just about every role in life is optional. Our country is obsessed with a lot of things (this Org is proof positive of that). But to the extent you believe the fans share the blame, I'd say they got theirs.

namepeace said:

TD3 said:

Being a sports fan is an option, supporting a sports team (whether you watch on TV, have season tickets, or buy their merchandise) is an option. How much this hurts the fan base? We are so sports obsessed in this country, many have proven they'll look the other way when anytype of wrong doing is taking place. Winning shouldn't be put above everything.

I think you're mining for an argument, but okay.

Just about every role in life is optional. Our country is obsessed with a lot of things (this Org is proof positive of that). But to the extent you believe the fans share the blame, I'd say they got theirs.

Oh, by no means.

"It hurts the fans more than anything" in my opinion is a rationalization to excuse, ignore, or minimize wrong doing. I don't hear anyone speaking to the facts that the Saints organization (some of its coaches and players) violated league rules, bylaws, and NFL policy repeatedly. The fans outrage should directed at the New Orleans Saints organization not Mr. Goodell. That's all I'm saying.

TD3 said:

namepeace said:

I think you're mining for an argument, but okay.

Just about every role in life is optional. Our country is obsessed with a lot of things (this Org is proof positive of that). But to the extent you believe the fans share the blame, I'd say they got theirs.

Oh, by no means.

"It hurts the fans more than anything" in my opinion is a rationalization to excuse, ignore, or minimize wrong doing. I don't hear anyone speaking to the facts that the Saints organization (some of its coaches and players) violated league rules, bylaws, and NFL policy repeatedly. The fans outrage should directed at the New Orleans Saints organization not Mr. Goodell. That's all I'm saying.

I misunderstood. My apologies.

The hurt to the fans is collateral damage. It doesn't mean that Goddell's actions were not warranted. It just means that Goodell knew one of his most loyal fanbases -- perhaps the one which had the most to deal with over the last 10 years off the field -- would suffer by this move but it needed to be done anyway.

Right now I'm limping around swallowing pain killers for recurring knee pain, which my specialist says was caused by sprained ligaments that I suffered playing HS football . . . over 25 years ago. A lot of other Orgers can probably say the same thing. It's a risky game and sometimes injuries don't manifest until years down the line.

The LEGAL hits football players take and give in an era of bigger, faster, stronger athletes are terrifying enough. Policing ILLEGAL hits is even more important, now that NFLers are earning more guaranteed money than ever.

Add to that 1) a top-down system of rewarding dirty hits, and 2) a years-long coverup, and it's easy to see why Goodell did what he did. My point was Goodell had to do it for the game and to make a point despite what the Who Dats paying good money/living or dying with NO may have to say. We're on the same page there.

TonyVanDam said:

Graycap23 said:

Goodell is out of control.

Thank you for reading between the line Gray.

NFL Commish Roger Goodell is out of his damn mind. And most of his latest business decisions is taking damn nearly all of the full out of playing defense. American football in the NFL is getting bad to the point that most defensive linemen AND linebackers are going to be too afraid to sack the QB without getting fined and/or suspended.

The NFL is entertainment. Its main entertainers are offensive skill players. They take the brunt of the injuries. When they're out, teams lose games AND money. They want to protect their investments -- the players who "draw."

They've eliminated helmet-to-helmet hits, late hits on QBs, horsecollars, etc. There have been problems with overzealous refs who flag clean hits. The "sack zone" is becoming like MLB's "strike zone" -- changes from crew to crew.

The flip side of that is that defenders are sloppier tacklers than they used to be. The "form tackle" is increasingly a lost art. And today's defenders are bigger, stronger and faster than ever. That's a perfect storm for injuries. To Os and Ds (Ds wind up being carted off as often as Os). Protecting these freakishlyh talented ballers from themselves is not a bad thing. Especially when the NFL is paying a larger share of the med care than it used to.

The game is also changing as a result. Like the NBA and MLB before them, the NFL is emphasizing scoring which not only drives ratings but could help cut down on injuries. Football has ALWAYS evolved by innovations and/or necessity. If it hadn't, Teddy Roosevelt would have killed the game a century ago.

A lot of folks don't like the changes, but they'll get over it. Myself included.

[Edited 3/22/12 12:11pm]

Have to agree with namepeace here.