uPtoWnNY said:

Just heard some good news - Knicks are working on a deal for Tyson Chandler. That's the big man we desperately need.

And TC is a security blanket for none other than Mr. Chris Paul. I see this as part of a strategy to lure Paul to NY for less money, and maybe Paul's willing to do it.

Signing Paul or not, that would move Amar'e back to the 4, his natural position, which would be huge. Chandler gives them the defensive presence to bang with the KGs and Noahs in the EC.

[Edited 12/8/11 14:49pm]

IF they're willing to trade him Paul can go pretty much anywhere this season. The problem is going to be keeping him AFTER this season.

Cerebus said:

IF they're willing to trade him Paul can go pretty much anywhere this season. The problem is going to be keeping him AFTER this season.

Right.

Nobody's going to give up a franchise player under contract for a player in a contract year that won't re-up. A lot of teams with tradeable assets -- Golden State, Minnesota, Boston, etc. -- are falling by the wayside (to hear the media tell it) because Paul won't commit to any of them long term.

Paul is leaving them with 2 options:

Trade him to NY or LA (Clips OR Lakes) for something.

OR . . .

Let him walk to NY leaving them nothing.

uPtoWnNY said:

Just heard some good news - Knicks are working on a deal for Tyson Chandler. That's the big man we desperately need.

Hey uPtoWnNY, I was just about tp start a thread for the NBA, but you beat me to it.

An any rate, the players have officially approved the new NBA labor agreement, and the owners are expected to ratify it later tonight. This should open up a wild, freewheeling free agency period beginning tomorrow. It appears several teams are interested in getting Chris Paul, but it appears Chris Paul will not sign any extension or long term contract upon any trade unless it's to the New York Knicks. Meanwhile, the Lakers are looking to get Dwight Howard in a three team deal with the Orlando Magic and Houston Rockets. The Lakers would get Dwight Howard, while the Magic would get Andrew Bynum and the Rockets would get Pau Gasol. The Rockets would send a couple of other players to the Magic in this deal.

Meanwhile, Chauncey Billups could be headed out of New York, but it appears the Miami Heat are ready to sign Shane Battier and Eddy Curry to their roster. And could Kirk Hinrich be returning to the Chicago Bulls? Stay tuned...

Well I hope he doesn't go to the Clippers. I know they've been trying to put together a better team for the last few years, but people need to remember the twenty before that!

I know its considered "bad business", but sometimes I wonder why teams don't just keep these guys if they can't get what they really want in return. He'll play hard this season in N.O. if they keep him. Fans will still come to see him in hopes that he'll be convinced to return. It won't happen - they'll hold on to him until closer to the trade deadline if they have to. But I bet he goes someplace else at some point this season. Maybe to a different contender who will then let him walk to LA or NY at seasons end.

Golden State is still a mess. We've been so close, so many times in the last decade, but we still aren't there. We keep getting the same type of players, instead of the pieces we're missing. We don't need Chris Paul to run up and down the court and play minimal defense. We have plenty of players, including PGs, who can do that. We need a versatile power forward, a fast big man who can still be a presence down low (Biedrens rebounds, but not much else) and consistent outside shooting (and by that I don't mean every player jacking up threes). Our biggest proble, as I see it, is that our "trading pieces" are our best players. So if we don't get something to fill the spots we need AND take their place, what's the point?

Battier to Miami? That's a solid move. Even at his age he'll contribute by doing the dirty, diving on the floor work, and he's never taken any shit from the "superstars" he's payed with.

I'm surprised LA might let Pau and Bynum go. So, are they planning to have LO back up Dwight Howard? Or do they both start and the get some shlub to backup both of them? (I don't remember who all they have under contract this season.) Obviously a lot could still take place between now and the trade deadline, but that seems a bit risky to me.

uPtoWnNY said:

Just heard some good news - Knicks are working on a deal for Tyson Chandler. That's the big man we desperately need.

I hate we let him walk, Tyson was a big part of why we won our Championship. Cube needs to find a way to get Howard here now, but the cap is kicking our ass. Howard will be out of Orlando before this summer. Brendan Haywood is not the lone solution.. Butler jetted to the Clippers and Barea's 'bout to bounce.. We're going to get our asses handed to us, this season.

Breaking news, according to Adrian Wojnaraski...

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-wojnarowski_chris_paul_lakers_hornets_nba_120811

Lakers set to land Paul

The Los Angeles Lakers have reached an agreement to acquire All-Star point guard Chris Paul in a three-team trade that will cost them Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

The Lakers have finalized the trade with the New Orleans Hornets and Houston Rockets. The Lakers sent Gasol to the Rockets. The Hornets receive Odom, Rockets guards Kevin Martin and Goran Dragic and forward Luis Scola, league sources said.

Houston also agreed to send a 2012 first-round pick – previously obtained from the Knicks – to New Orleans as part of the package, a source said.

Hornets general manager Dell Demps informed two of the other finalists for Paul on Thursday evening that he had a deal in place for Paul to go the Lakers, front-office sources said.

Paul had listed the Lakers as one of his preferred destinations, and it became a more clear choice for him on Thursday after the New York Knicks moved to the brink of completing a four-year, $58 million contract for free-agent center Tyson Chandler. The Knicks lost the salary-cap space they would’ve needed to sign Paul this summer, and the Lakers had been pushing hard to close a deal for Paul with Houston and New Orleans.

The Lakers could turn their attention toward using center Andrew Bynum as a trading chip to make a play for Orlando Magic center Dwight Howard.

Kobe Bryant was disappointed to see Gasol go in the deal, a source told Yahoo! Sports. He had been a great facilitator for Bryant and the Lakers out of the post, but Bryant was thrilled about the possibilities of playing with Paul. The point guard can ease a lot of Bryant’s ball-handling and play-making responsibilities, something that will benefit him at 33 years old.

The trade also frees up salary-cap room for the Rockets to pursue free-agent center Nene, league sources said. The Denver Nuggets also have made a strong bid to keep Nene.

Lakers letting LO and Pau go makes more sense than Bynum and Pau. But something tells me they'll still gut the rest of the team to get Dwight Howard. They wouldn't have a problem getting the small piece players to come to LA for cheap with Kobe, Chris Paul and Dwight Howard as starters.

uPtoWnNY said:

The NBA killed the Paul deal.

Crazy. I can't even get the page about the story to load. Do you know why?

At least there's something interesting happening with the NBA, FINALLY!

Other bits on NBA.com not posted here yet...

Oden to sign with Trailblazers

Butler agrees to new deal with the Clippers

Well that's some whiny bullshit right there.

FROM ALMOST DONE TO “DEAD”

UPDATE 9:47 p.m.: One of the biggest blockbuster trades of this new NBA season died before it ever got done. Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo! Sports, who first reported the deal earlier, is now reporting that the deal was killed by the league.

NBA commissioner David Stern has killed the New Orleans Hornets’ trade of Chris Paul after several owners complained about the league-owned team dealing the All-Star point guard to the Los Angeles Lakers, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

Some owners pushed Stern to demand that trade be nullified, and the Hornets be made to keep Paul on the roster for the foreseeable future, sources said. A chorus of owners were irate with the belief that the five-month lockout had happened largely to stop big-market teams from leveraging small-market teams for star players pending free agency.

All the players involved in the trade have been told to report to their teams for the start of training camp on Friday.

Before Stern intervened, the Lakers had reached an agreement to acquire Paul in a three-team trade that would have cost them Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

The shockwaves that the initial reports of the deal sent around the league will be matched by the outrage simmering now that the deal is apparently off.

..and the dish ran away with the spoon.

.. What's next!!

[Edited 12/8/11 19:54pm]

Cerebus said:

uPtoWnNY said:

The NBA killed the Paul deal.

Crazy. I can't even get the page about the story to load. Do you know why?

Because this is unprecedented. This trade did not violate any CBA rules, it was not one-sided -- LA gave up two cornerstones of a 3-time Finalist and 2-time champ -- and the money roughly matched up. That was the reason Houston got involved; to make the money match up.

The NBA killed this trade for no basketball-related reason. New Orleans would have received a starting unit -- Odom, Scola, Martin, Dragic and a 1st -- for Paul. Paul was willing to sign off on an extension to make the deal work: something he wasn't willing to do for any other team, including the Boston Celtics.

The only reason this trade is dead is because of blowback from other franchises and fanbases who hated to see yet another Big 3 in the making. But LA didn't swindle anyone. It is using its cachet to lure free agents to be to join them. Those FAs-to-be are not inclined to re-up with their own teams. LA's move was well within bounds.

Now, LA has an even worse chemistry problem than it had 7 months ago. Houston has a roster full of gun-shy players. And NO gets it the worst: it will enjoy a Chris Paul holdout, perhaps losing him to free agency for nothing. David Stern may have just killed a small market team's chances to compete and be profitable, bowing to pressure from small market owners upset because they can't compete with big-market franchises.

I heard former NBA flunky Russ Granik trying to say it was simply a case of a basketball trade being nixed. But it is not. The NBA overruled smart basketball people, alienated NO's superstar, and set it up for a bare cupboard in 12 months. It's a move so incompetent that it can only be explained by outside pressure.

namepeace said:

Cerebus said:

Crazy. I can't even get the page about the story to load. Do you know why?

Because this is unprecedented. This trade did not violate any CBA rules, it was not one-sided -- LA gave up two cornerstones of a 3-time Finalist and 2-time champ -- and the money roughly matched up. That was the reason Houston got involved; to make the money match up.

The NBA killed this trade for no basketball-related reason. New Orleans would have received a starting unit -- Odom, Scola, Martin, Dragic and a 1st -- for Paul. Paul was willing to sign off on an extension to make the deal work: something he wasn't willing to do for any other team, including the Boston Celtics.

The only reason this trade is dead is because of blowback from other franchises and fanbases who hated to see yet another Big 3 in the making. But LA didn't swindle anyone. It is using its cachet to lure free agents to be to join them. Those FAs-to-be are not inclined to re-up with their own teams. LA's move was well within bounds.

Now, LA has an even worse chemistry problem than it had 7 months ago. Houston has a roster full of gun-shy players. And NO gets it the worst: it will enjoy a Chris Paul holdout, perhaps losing him to free agency for nothing. David Stern may have just killed a small market team's chances to compete and be profitable, bowing to pressure from small market owners upset because they can't compete with big-market franchises.

I heard former NBA flunky Russ Granik trying to say it was simply a case of a basketball trade being nixed. But it is not. The NBA overruled smart basketball people, alienated NO's superstar, and set it up for a bare cupboard in 12 months. It's a move so incompetent that it can only be explained by outside pressure.

Oh, well, I only meant what was the reason they were giving for not allowing the trade, actually.

I agree this is a complete cluster-fuck, but I don't think its so much as all that.. The fallout is more likely going to go against the league office and owner knucklheads, most of whom the fans already know have issues. And it was the owners who made a stink - fans had nothing to do with it.

If this decision is upheld...

I don't think Chris Paul will be a problem in/for NO. Its really a win/win situation for him. He's very well-liked in NO, he continue to play hard (he doesn't have a choice, really), he'll get traded before the deadline or he can go wherever he wants at seasons end. Sure, there's been a couple superstars who have played the pouting game, but I've never seen Chris Paul as that type of person.

The players who didn't get traded on the other teams will keep playing just like normal, too. The NBA is a trade happy league - players know this. They could get traded at any time and they've got to keep playing hard to keep their trade value up.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

The NBA killing the trade basically mean the Hornets killed the trade. NO is owned by the league and the other 29 owners didn't like it.

Particularly dickheads like Dan Gilbert, who's still butt-hurt Leron didn't want to stay in his shit-hole of a city. Well guess what - Paul's leaving anyway, and the Hornets will get nothing for him. Great move by the owners.

How about all of the big moves the Bulls are making?

That trade made a small-market team - New Orleans - vastly better. Sure they were losing a second-tier star (if you think CP3 is first-tier, that's your problem, LOL), but they were getting MUCH more in return. Not to mention that Paul is going to leave anyway and sign with the Lakers this summer, leaving New Orleans with bupkas.

WTF?

[Edited 12/9/11 8:02am]

Graycap23 said:

How about all of the big moves the Bulls are making?

Hell, as of yesterday afternoon, if I'm a GM I don't know if I try to pull the trigger on any trade. Because that whiny little bitch of an owner in Cleveland might go crying to David Stern and put the kibosh on it.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

The NBA killing the trade basically mean the Hornets killed the trade. NO is owned by the league and the other 29 owners didn't like it.

Wow, I didn't know NO was owned by the league! hhhmmm

uPtoWnNY said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

The NBA killing the trade basically mean the Hornets killed the trade. NO is owned by the league and the other 29 owners didn't like it.

Particularly dickheads like Dan Gilbert, who's still butt-hurt Leron didn't want to stay in his shit-hole of a city. Well guess what - Paul's leaving anyway, and the Hornets will get nothing for him. Great move by the owners.

For Real!!!! Dan Gilbert = former slaveowner or rather modern day slaveowner!

[Edited 12/9/11 8:08am]

RodeoSchro said:

Graycap23 said:

How about all of the big moves the Bulls are making?

Hell, as of yesterday afternoon, if I'm a GM I don't know if I try to pull the trigger on any trade. Because that whiny little bitch of an owner in Cleveland might go crying to David Stern and put the kibosh on it.

Your are so correct!

OK, this "the league owns the Hornets and that's why the trade was killed" argument is complete bullshit.

I wanted to hear the league's side of the story, so I went to NBA.com, where I was greeted with a steaming pile of poop written by some clown named Shaun Powell. If you want to know what the price of a man's integrity is, just find out what Powell makes because that's what it took to buy his.

I knew right away from the piece's title that I'd better put on my boots and roll up my pants - "League Was Put In Tough Situation With Paul-to_Lakers Trade".

Here is his (in other words, the NBA's) main argument for the killing of this trade:

(T)he trade was troublesome on many levels. Mainly, without Paul, the league would have had a hard time finding a fair price for the Hornets.

So what he (i. e. the NBA) is saying is that the Hornets are more valuable with a lame-duck, upset, not-a-chance-in-hell-staying-in-New-Orleans Chris Paul than they are with getting basically an entire starting line-up of very good NBA players in return. Plus a first-round draft pick.

Are you freaking kidding me?!?

Incredible.

Graycap23 said:

How about all of the big moves the Bulls are making?

I know, right. Do something. Derrick still needs some fucking help.

Cerebus said:

namepeace said:

Because this is unprecedented. This trade did not violate any CBA rules, it was not one-sided -- LA gave up two cornerstones of a 3-time Finalist and 2-time champ -- and the money roughly matched up. That was the reason Houston got involved; to make the money match up.

The NBA killed this trade for no basketball-related reason. New Orleans would have received a starting unit -- Odom, Scola, Martin, Dragic and a 1st -- for Paul. Paul was willing to sign off on an extension to make the deal work: something he wasn't willing to do for any other team, including the Boston Celtics.

The only reason this trade is dead is because of blowback from other franchises and fanbases who hated to see yet another Big 3 in the making. But LA didn't swindle anyone. It is using its cachet to lure free agents to be to join them. Those FAs-to-be are not inclined to re-up with their own teams. LA's move was well within bounds.

Now, LA has an even worse chemistry problem than it had 7 months ago. Houston has a roster full of gun-shy players. And NO gets it the worst: it will enjoy a Chris Paul holdout, perhaps losing him to free agency for nothing. David Stern may have just killed a small market team's chances to compete and be profitable, bowing to pressure from small market owners upset because they can't compete with big-market franchises.

I heard former NBA flunky Russ Granik trying to say it was simply a case of a basketball trade being nixed. But it is not. The NBA overruled smart basketball people, alienated NO's superstar, and set it up for a bare cupboard in 12 months. It's a move so incompetent that it can only be explained by outside pressure.

Oh, well, I only meant what was the reason they were giving for not allowing the trade, actually.

I knew that your question wasn't set up for my answer, I just needed a good point to jump off.

I agree this is a complete cluster-fuck, but I don't think its so much as all that.. The fallout is more likely going to go against the league office and owner knucklheads, most of whom the fans already know have issues. And it was the owners who made a stink - fans had nothing to do with it.

You're right; the owners pushed this. I wrote this post when speculation was running that owners were responding to fan pressure. Only saw the Gilbert e-mail this morning. That being said, I still think this is unprecedented. The money matched up, the personnel (with all 3 getting All Stars and NO getting a former All-Star and Sixth Man of Year) was more even than it was under similar circumstances (KG trade, Gasol trade, Bosh trade) and it didn't violate CBA terms. It was vetoed in an anti-competitive fashion.

If this decision is upheld...

I don't think Chris Paul will be a problem in/for NO. Its really a win/win situation for him. He's very well-liked in NO, he continue to play hard (he doesn't have a choice, really), he'll get traded before the deadline or he can go wherever he wants at seasons end. Sure, there's been a couple superstars who have played the pouting game, but I've never seen Chris Paul as that type of person.

He's not showing up to camp and is lawyering up.

There is a scenario where I'd agree with you: If Stern had simply told Demps to squash talks with LA with no further comment, then Paul may have lived with it.

But the trade was finalized, and it killed not only the LA trade but ANY trade. It was legal under the new CBA: the small-market owners took $3B in concessions to leave soft cap and flexibility for stars in place. Paul knows this BECAUSE HE WAS ON THE EXEC COMMITTEE THAT NEGOTIATED THE DOGGONE THING. (ed note -- not yelling in caps at you, C, just yelling in general). I doubt Paul will play the good soldier like he would have otherwise.

The players who didn't get traded on the other teams will keep playing just like normal, too. The NBA is a trade happy league - players know this. They could get traded at any time and they've got to keep playing hard to keep their trade value up.

Odom is not showing up for camp. Like I said, this is a different situation and not your ordinary trade trump.

Layzie said:

Graycap23 said:

How about all of the big moves the Bulls are making?

I know, right. Do something. Derrick still needs some fucking help.

The Bulls are pitiful............

Graycap23 said:

Layzie said:

I know, right. Do something. Derrick still needs some fucking help.

The Bulls are pitiful............

The Bulls are having a Booz hangover.