I came across this article and, , damn.

A wise man once told me, "As a man, you have to die once in order to live." I never fully appreciated his advice, nor did I understand it until I experienced it firsthand. From that time on, I understood the origins of the Jerk vs. Nice Guy battle.

Readers may be asking themselves, "What in the world is this guy talking about?" Well, I'm referring to the widely known fact that women habitually date men that are jerks while the "nice" guys are often left twiddling their thumbs in solitaire. Does this sound familiar to anyone?

Figuratively speaking, in order for a man to enjoy the company of women and be able to seduce them, his inner nice guy must first die through heartache. It is at this point that his inner bad boy surfaces and goes on the prowl.

Any man that has experienced true love, only to have his heart crushed by the woman that he thought he would spend his life with, will understand what I am talking about. A man that has never experienced the heartache of being burned by the one person he really trusted probably won't understand my commentary. In any case, it is important to understand why nice guys finish last and why they probably always will.

[edited for compliance]

The fact is that women generally don't want nice guys, or maybe they're too busy chasing after jerks to realize that they do. Why? Because women act on impulse and emotion rather than fact. Who do you suppose brings out these same irrepressible emotions in women? The jerks, of course.

So what does this all add up to? No one wants to get hurt, but in the same instance, no one wants to be perceived as a jerk either. That is why it's important to have a balanced attitude towards relationships. A man has to be able to court a woman, amuse her and excite her while continuously remaining a challenge.

In other words, be nice to women, but remember who comes first in life; you, your irreplaceable family and friends, and then your woman. By following my theory, women will constantly be in hot pursuit

So is there truth to this theory?

A nice guy needs to get his heart broken to be able to become the "jerk" that women crave?

I know that the replies to this will vary depending on gender (), and I realize that it stereotypes and oversimplifies the issue.. but STILL it makes one wonder.

Full article here; http://www.askmen.com/dat...ton15.html

I honestly don't know if it's true or maybe people blindly loving "bad guys" is the problem idk lol

The fact is that women generally don't want nice guys, or maybe they're too busy chasing after jerks to realize that they do. Why? Because women act on impulse and emotion rather than fact. Who do you suppose brings out these same irrepressible emotions in women? The jerks, of course.

sorry but this is a flawed overgeneralization.

Whenever I read shit like this I always think some schmuck gets rejected and doesn't have even them least bit of self-introspection to blame himself once in a while.

imago said:

Whenever I read shit like this I always think some schmuck gets rejected and doesn't have even them least bit of self-introspection to blame himself once in a while.

OK, I realize that the OP sounds a little bitter.

HOWEVER, what really struck a nerve with me (besides my own shit) is that a week or so ago I was having a heart-to-heart with a friend of mine who is having marital issues. We share similar battle scars, with the exception that his war is not lost yet and I believe that some counseling will help his relationship overcome this bump.

ANYWAY...what I find interesting is that he told me, point blank, that when he met his wife and they were dating, he was a jerk...even when they moved in together, he would go out all night, not tell her where he was going, ignore her sometimes...and she was madly in love with him. Now that he's a fully domesticated husband who caters to her every need, she is bored with him and wants to go out and hang out in bars. The kids that she wanted so bad are now a thorn in her side. The old flame with the tattoos warranted a reconnect via Facebook (that's a particularly nasty bump in the road that nearly did them in).

XxAxX said:

The fact is that women generally don't want nice guys, or maybe they're too busy chasing after jerks to realize that they do. Why? Because women act on impulse and emotion rather than fact. Who do you suppose brings out these same irrepressible emotions in women? The jerks, of course.

sorry but this is a flawed overgeneralization.

Very flawed.

At a young age I was involved with the "bad boy". He was abusive, unfaithful and degraded me for 2 years. When I finally left him, I hooked up with a guy my own age, cute and nice. I married this guy. He treats me with much respect and kindness and does everything he can to make me happy and show his love. Because he didn't have the fast sportscar, money or fancy clothes, my friends told me to dump him, but I knew better. If you think with your heart and not your head or wallet, it will usually lead you in the right direction. We have been married for almost 23 years and have traveled all over together. He is my rock!

[Edited 6/27/11 10:09am]

Empress said:

XxAxX said:

sorry but this is a flawed overgeneralization.

Very flawed.

At a young age I was involved with the "bad boy". He was abusive, unfaithful and degraded me for 2 years. When I finally left him, I hooked up with a guy my own age, cute and nice. I married this guy. He treats me with much respect and kindness and does everything he can to make me happy and show his love. Because he didn't have the fast sportscar, money or fancy clothes, my friends told me to dump him, but I knew better. If you think with your heart and not your head or wallet, it will usually lead you in the right direction. We have been married for almost 23 years and have traveled all over together. He is my rock!

[Edited 6/27/11 10:09am]

Awww... now THAT'S a love story.

Timmy84 said:

Empress said:

Very flawed.

At a young age I was involved with the "bad boy". He was abusive, unfaithful and degraded me for 2 years. When I finally left him, I hooked up with a guy my own age, cute and nice. I married this guy. He treats me with much respect and kindness and does everything he can to make me happy and show his love. Because he didn't have the fast sportscar, money or fancy clothes, my friends told me to dump him, but I knew better. If you think with your heart and not your head or wallet, it will usually lead you in the right direction. We have been married for almost 23 years and have traveled all over together. He is my rock!

[Edited 6/27/11 10:09am]

Awww... now THAT'S a love story.

Thanks Timmy - it truly is. I feel very fortunate. I can't imagine what my life would've been like had I stayed with the "bad boy". I'm sure I would be a broken women today.

Empress said:

XxAxX said:

sorry but this is a flawed overgeneralization.

Very flawed.

At a young age I was involved with the "bad boy". He was abusive, unfaithful and degraded me for 2 years. When I finally left him, I hooked up with a guy my own age, cute and nice. I married this guy. He treats me with much respect and kindness and does everything he can to make me happy and show his love. Because he didn't have the fast sportscar, money or fancy clothes, my friends told me to dump him, but I knew better. If you think with your heart and not your head or wallet, it will usually lead you in the right direction. We have been married for almost 23 years and have traveled all over together. He is my rock!

[Edited 6/27/11 10:09am]

So you're kind of supporting the original point then right?

You chose the bad boy and then got over it. It's the antithesis to the point presented as the guys side in the first post.

I took it as being females are attracted to bad boys, at least initially while they're young and naive.

I think both genders generally grow out of that whole game...well maybe not right out of it, but once they get to know it, it's no stress and alot more fun!

Empress said:

XxAxX said:

sorry but this is a flawed overgeneralization.

Very flawed.

At a young age I was involved with the "bad boy". He was abusive, unfaithful and degraded me for 2 years. When I finally left him, I hooked up with a guy my own age, cute and nice. I married this guy. He treats me with much respect and kindness and does everything he can to make me happy and show his love. Because he didn't have the fast sportscar, money or fancy clothes, my friends told me to dump him, but I knew better. If you think with your heart and not your head or wallet, it will usually lead you in the right direction. We have been married for almost 23 years and have traveled all over together. He is my rock!

Congratulations! I'm inspired by stories like yours.

Now if you could indulge me with one simple question, and your honest response is important...do you have the same feelings stirred by your "nice guy" as you did by the "bad boy"? Not to be confused with "love" or anything...I'm talking about those inner stirrings that people get in their gut...the butterflies, the anticipation, the tingles, whatever you want to call it.

We probably all agree that settling down with a responsible, dedicated man is the smart thing to do...but this piece talks about those primal desires, I think, that can just as easily lead a man to leave his wife & family for a young thang with big boobs & a smile.

PurpleJedi said:

Empress said:

Very flawed.

At a young age I was involved with the "bad boy". He was abusive, unfaithful and degraded me for 2 years. When I finally left him, I hooked up with a guy my own age, cute and nice. I married this guy. He treats me with much respect and kindness and does everything he can to make me happy and show his love. Because he didn't have the fast sportscar, money or fancy clothes, my friends told me to dump him, but I knew better. If you think with your heart and not your head or wallet, it will usually lead you in the right direction. We have been married for almost 23 years and have traveled all over together. He is my rock!

Congratulations! I'm inspired by stories like yours.

Now if you could indulge me with one simple question, and your honest response is important...do you have the same feelings stirred by your "nice guy" as you did by the "bad boy"? Not to be confused with "love" or anything...I'm talking about those inner stirrings that people get in their gut...the butterflies, the anticipation, the tingles, whatever you want to call it.

We probably all agree that settling down with a responsible, dedicated man is the smart thing to do...but this piece talks about those primal desires, I think, that can just as easily lead a man to leave his wife & family for a young thang with big boobs & a smile.

I have deeper, more real feeling for the nice guy. To be honest, the bad boy was gorgeous, older, from a wealthy family with a very hot corvette. He scared the shit out of me and even though I wanted to leave him for a long time, I was too scared to do it. He bought me clothes, shoes and that's probably one reason why I stayed, but in my gut, I was petrified of him. My husband is a great lover and always thinks of me first (if you get my drift??). He has good morals and is a hard worker and a very fun person to be around.

To this day, it breaks my heart to hear of a young woman (or any woman) who is with a man who has no respect, no real love and is abusive.

Empress said:

PurpleJedi said:

Congratulations! I'm inspired by stories like yours.

Now if you could indulge me with one simple question, and your honest response is important...do you have the same feelings stirred by your "nice guy" as you did by the "bad boy"? Not to be confused with "love" or anything...I'm talking about those inner stirrings that people get in their gut...the butterflies, the anticipation, the tingles, whatever you want to call it.

We probably all agree that settling down with a responsible, dedicated man is the smart thing to do...but this piece talks about those primal desires, I think, that can just as easily lead a man to leave his wife & family for a young thang with big boobs & a smile.

I have deeper, more real feeling for the nice guy. To be honest, the bad boy was gorgeous, older, from a wealthy family with a very hot corvette. He scared the shit out of me and even though I wanted to leave him for a long time, I was too scared to do it. He bought me clothes, shoes and that's probably one reason why I stayed, but in my gut, I was petrified of him. My husband is a great lover and always thinks of me first (if you get my drift??). He has good morals and is a hard worker and a very fun person to be around.

To this day, it breaks my heart to hear of a young woman (or any woman) who is with a man who has no respect, no real love and is abusive.

OK, well I'm definitely glad that you finally gathered the courage to exit that seemingly abusive relationship (if I read you correctly).

...and the butterflies? Are they just as strong with your hubby? Seems like he keeps the relationship going and not becoming the "boring guy" that the article mentioned. That makes all the difference, no?

my first two boyfriends were 100% jerks! and that's why our relationships ended, in the begining of our relationships they were both sweet and as nice as can be. but once time went on they showed their real selves to me. i never wanted to date a jerk and that's why i left.

i've know my husband for 9 years, he was sweet when i met him, and he's sweet still to this day. he has never once said a rude word to me, and people NEVER believe this, but we've never had am arguement in all the years we've been together. he's a very calm person, and so am i. most people think we're a boring couple, but it works for us. i love that my husband treats me with respect, and makes me feel loved. i would not be with him, if he wasn't a "nice guy".

kimrachell said:

my first two boyfriends were 100% jerks! and that's why our relationships ended, in the begining of our relationships they were both sweet and as nice as can be. but once time went on they showed their real selves to me. i never wanted to date a jerk and that's why i left.

i've know my husband for 9 years, he was sweet when i met him, and he's sweet still to this day. he has never once said a rude word to me, and people NEVER believe this, but we've never had an arguement in all the years we've been together. he's a very calm person, and so am i. most people think we're a boring couple, but it works for us. i love that my husband treats me with respect, and makes me feel loved. i would not be with him, if he wasn't a "nice guy".

Uhm...that's not humanly possible.

Come on. Hasn't he ever left the toilet seat up when it was your "time of the month" and suddenly bad things are being said and dishes thrown about?

PurpleJedi said:

kimrachell said:

my first two boyfriends were 100% jerks! and that's why our relationships ended, in the begining of our relationships they were both sweet and as nice as can be. but once time went on they showed their real selves to me. i never wanted to date a jerk and that's why i left.

i've know my husband for 9 years, he was sweet when i met him, and he's sweet still to this day. he has never once said a rude word to me, and people NEVER believe this, but we've never had an arguement in all the years we've been together. he's a very calm person, and so am i. most people think we're a boring couple, but it works for us. i love that my husband treats me with respect, and makes me feel loved. i would not be with him, if he wasn't a "nice guy".

Uhm...that's not humanly possible.

Come on. Hasn't he ever left the toilet seat up when it was your "time of the month" and suddenly bad things are being said and dishes thrown about?

There's a difference between disagreements (which is what my mom and dad have all the time, they used to argue back in the day though) and arguments.

Timmy84 said:

PurpleJedi said:

Uhm...that's not humanly possible.

Come on. Hasn't he ever left the toilet seat up when it was your "time of the month" and suddenly bad things are being said and dishes thrown about?

There's a difference between disagreements (which is what my mom and dad have all the time, they used to argue back in the day though) and arguments.

Po-ta-toe...po-tah-to...it's all well & good until someone pokes an eye out.

You mean making her come first?

Yeah, I agree.

PurpleJedi said:

Timmy84 said:

There's a difference between disagreements (which is what my mom and dad have all the time, they used to argue back in the day though) and arguments.

Po-ta-toe...po-tah-to...it's all well & good until someone pokes an eye out.

You think all arguments end in bloodshed?

Timmy84 said:

PurpleJedi said:

Po-ta-toe...po-tah-to...it's all well & good until someone pokes an eye out.

You think all arguments end in bloodshed?

Sorry...I'm confusing this one with the UFC thread.

PurpleJedi said:

Timmy84 said:

You think all arguments end in bloodshed?

Sorry...I'm confusing this one with the UFC thread.

NDRU said:

You mean making her come first?

Yeah, I agree.

PurpleJedi said:

kimrachell said:

my first two boyfriends were 100% jerks! and that's why our relationships ended, in the begining of our relationships they were both sweet and as nice as can be. but once time went on they showed their real selves to me. i never wanted to date a jerk and that's why i left.

i've know my husband for 9 years, he was sweet when i met him, and he's sweet still to this day. he has never once said a rude word to me, and people NEVER believe this, but we've never had an arguement in all the years we've been together. he's a very calm person, and so am i. most people think we're a boring couple, but it works for us. i love that my husband treats me with respect, and makes me feel loved. i would not be with him, if he wasn't a "nice guy".

Uhm...that's not humanly possible.

Come on. Hasn't he ever left the toilet seat up when it was your "time of the month" and suddenly bad things are being said and dishes thrown about?

we have never argued, really i know it's hard for people to believe, but we just never do that. if we feel frustrated about something we discuss it with one another in a calm manner. i think the reason my husband hates to argue is because his parents argued all of the time during his childhood, and it really hurt him, even to this day it bothers him. we never scream or yell, or throw things. sure, sometimes we don't agree on a subject, but it doesn't mean we argue over it. he just doesn't ever give me a reason to be angry at him. he's not perfect, and neither am i, but we understand that about each other.

kimrachell said:

PurpleJedi said:

Uhm...that's not humanly possible.

Come on. Hasn't he ever left the toilet seat up when it was your "time of the month" and suddenly bad things are being said and dishes thrown about?

we have never argued, really i know it's hard for people to believe, but we just never do that. if we feel frustrated about something we discuss it with one another in a calm manner. i think the reason my husband hates to argue is because his parents argued all of the time during his childhood, and it really hurt him, even to this day it bothers him. we never scream or yell, or throw things. sure, sometimes we don't agree on a subject, but it doesn't mean we argue over it. he just doesn't ever give me a reason to be angry at him. he's not perfect, and neither am i, but we understand that about each other.

Idk...maybe it's true.

I don't think I've ever fallen for the quintessential "bad" boy. And if I did, it was most likely a passing thing. Anyways, the bad boys would only want me for sex (presumably), and I respect myself too much for that.

I've fallen for what i deem to be "good guys". They were bright, sweet, kind, talented...everything I wished for in someone else. But they never fell for me. And if they did, they never told me.

Eh, it's just as well I guess. Give it six months and the good guy will treat you just as bad as the bad boy.

I think it has a lot to do with age and self-esteem. A lot of people don't want to be treated nice (even if they don't know it by themselve). And the bad guy won't threat you nice, so that's when the urging starts. It's actually very exciting when somebody doesn't treat you well, because you need to fight for his love. "Why doesn't he love me?", "Why does he do that to me?".

When you grow older, i think it changes...you want somebody you can rely on, who you can trust. That's when the nice guy comes in.

Sorry but when I read articles like this I have to roll my eyes.

These dudes always proclaim themselves as "nice guys" and when a woman doesn't want them they claim they want what they feel is the opposite of them - the "bad boy"

Well, here's what I've experienced. These so called "nice guys" were nice, sure...but they were also pussies, and insecure and uninteresting and a whole bunch of other unattractive things. But oh no, it can't be them that's the problem. It's women.

Let's be honest here. Nice guys end up in relationships. Women do want nice dudes - with the whole package. They don't want jerks, and certainly not whiny bitches like this guy comes off as.

Nice guys don't finish last, wallowing pussies do.

JustErin said:

Sorry but when I read articles like this I have to roll my eyes.

These dudes always proclaim themselves as "nice guys" and when a woman doesn't want them they claim they want what they feel is the opposite of them - the "bad boy"

Well, here's what I've experienced. These so called "nice guys" were nice, sure...but they were also pussies, and insecure and uninteresting and a whole bunch of other unattractive things. But oh no, it can't be them that's the problem. It's women.

Let's be honest here. Nice guys end up in relationships. Women do want nice dudes - with the whole package. They don't want jerks, and certainly not whiny bitches like this guy comes off as.

Nice guys don't finish last, wallowing pussies do.

touche!

And let's add that most "nice guys" don't notice that "nice girl" beside them who has liked them for years but does not look like a Victoria's Secret model.

In other words:

If a nice guy is being at all superficial in his love interest, he needs to understand that that woman gets to be superficial, too, and most likely will be to some extent.

NDRU said:

In other words:

If a nice guy is being at all superficial in his love interest, he needs to understand that that woman gets to be superficial, too, and most likely will be to some extent.

I was going to say, if you want a woman who only wants jerks you're going after the wrong women, plain and simple.

Are there women who only date jerks? Sure. But that's her problem. Not yours. There are plenty of nice women who want to date nice guys. They get together all the time.

Even if nice guys finish last in love . . . they finish.

Love is not a race to be won. Love me some Pat Benatar, but it's no battlefield either. True love requires clear eyes and a deep commitment. But I digress.

A lot of folks find their ways into relationships more easily than others. But speaking from the experience of a so-called "nice guy," there is a little truth to what the author says. But it has less to do with women as a whole as it does the maturation process. ON BOTH SIDES.

robertlove had it right; age plays a factor. Younger women's choices in men over time are reflective of their maturation process. What they seek is in line with where they are and what they expect: attractiveness, confidence, flash, etc.

But the hypothetical "nice guy" does that as well: he seeks the "yang" to his "yin," the OneWhoLightsUpTheRoom, etc. He believes that he's groomed himself (or been groomed) to be the GuySheReallyNeeds, and believes friendship is a true path to love.

The problem is that neither the nice guys nor the women they're drawn to have much experience in making a relationship work: honesty, communication, intimacy, work. So they put themselves through trials and errors that will help them ultimately find a decent relationship. But both the nice guys and the lovely gals have growing up to do.

Getting from A to B for some of us m en and women (and more than a few times for still more of us) is a process of highs and lows, great memories and painful lessons, but Lord willing, we learn and improve and finish the process successfully.