TonyVanDam said:

Well, he gave that interview to the BLACK media so I still don't see the big deal. If Spike was at all concerned about public opinion, which I don't think he is, he woulda just not answered the question. He obviously felt it was important enough to speak on it regardless of people's perceptions and he shouldn't have to bite his tongue in his valid criticisms of TP.

And, again, why does he need to say anything to directly to TP? Do you think Spielberg would call Scorcese and say, "Hey, Marty, Kundun sucked!" I don't get this thing about a sitdown. Are they supposed to present some fake ass united front just cuz they're both black? That's some bullshit. Do they even have beef? I think a lot of folks are just whipping it up into something it ain't.
[Edited 10/27/09 20:27pm]

2elijah said:

Where is the proof that they have beef that warrants a sitdown? As far as I know, all there is, is Spike's interview which wasn't a personal attack on TP, and TP's half-assed explanation about using his characters as bait. So, where's the beef?

babynoz said:

Okay, I remember Spike's comments about P and his women (which, again, were on point, if I recall correctly) but I wasn't aware that lil man responded. What happened.

2elijah said:

To tell the truth, I would rather have seen Spike mentor TP because I think it would have been more classy for someone of his stature in the industry to do that. Of course, he has no obligation to do so, but it would have been a more gracious way to address his concerns and who knows, maybe some common ground would have resulted from it.

Now if he did that and TP had rebuffed his suggestions, that would have been different.

babynoz said:

Exactly. Had Spike took a different approach, then I think things could have worked out better. I also don't see TP as a person that would disrespect Spike. This is not the first time TP has caught flack for some of the minstrel characters he displays in his plays/films, so Spike is just another person added to TP's list of complainers.

SCNDLS said:

Spike basically gave Prince a pass was even apologetic about what he had said. Prince acted like it was so unimportant that he vaguely remembered it and Spike let him get away with that too.

Here's the link...

http://findarticles.com/p..._19711157/

SCNDLS said:

I am not saying they have actual "beef" with one another, but possible "creative" differences. I am saying if Spike feels the way he does about some of TP's characters, then why can't he just get together with TP in private, and discuss it?

It's okay if you don't like the characters that TP displays in his plays/films or feel his writing is not "up-to-par". I already stated that I don't care for many of TP's films, but only one or two of them so far, as well as Spike's, where I only enjoyed two of his films so far, but I'm willing to be patient and see what else they can both produce to the masses in the future.
[Edited 10/27/09 21:05pm]

2elijah said:

It almost seems like Prince patted him on the head and said "now take this here check and stay outta my bidness son...run along now".

babynoz said:

Thanks, Babynoz, here's the section to that interview where Spike questions Prince about it (referred to as "The Artist" at that time):

[Edited 10/27/09 21:04pm]

babynoz said:

Spike sure didn't say no.

SCNDLS said:

I would love to answer THAT question, except that we're in GD, not P&R. Therefore, I will not gamble on it.

But I will answer the other question.....

Given that there has always been sharp generational cultural divisions among people (especially black folks), the situation between Spike & Tyler should have been settle behind close doors first BEFORE putting the situation out there for the public (especially media in general) to see. Because now, it is the case of movie audiences (especially black folks) having to choose sides rather than supporting both of them for the cause.

Yes, Spike is entitled to have an opinions. But after 25 years as a celebrity, he should have known beforehand how his opinions (positive or negative) were going to be used by the media, because the word was going to get to Tyler either way.

2elijah said:

Spike was almost like putty in Prince's hands.

missfee said:

A very convincing portrayal of stereotypical traits of Black men in the '70's!

LOVED IT!!!

I just got home and have to get back up in 4 hours so I need to get some sleep and I don't have time to view everything but I just had to thank the posters who have reminded me of some good movies that I must check out again!

You guys rock!

SCNDLS said:

SAY THAT SHIT

2elijah said:

I hardly call Spike receiving money from celebrities to finance one of the best movies in history as "begging". Even Spike felt sympathtic towards the ones who did give money by shedding some tears about it on the "In the Actor's Studio" show on Bravo when he was being interviewed by James Lipton. I think you are being way too harsh. If it wasn't for the celebrities chipping in with the money (and why not?) we wouldn't have even seen the movie on the big screen. Just comes to show what type of movies Hollywood really wants its audience to see. Duh.
[Edited 10/28/09 4:02am]

babynoz said:

exactly.

babynoz said:

At the end of the day, it's the ONLY solution in my book.

TonyVanDam said:

There's cultural differences in all ethnic groups, no matter what race you are from, so that doesn't single out Blacks when it comes to cultural differences . I think the problem is that people tend to lump us in one group, as if we all eat, drink, think, and live the same.

Secondly, I don't feel Blacks have to choose sides, so-to-speak, between Perry and Lee, mainly because it depends on the story behind the films they put out there. It's a matter of what the film is about really, not specifically who made it. If Tyler did the Malcolm X film I would have paid money to see it too, mainly because Malcolm X is a historical figure, in my eyes and many others.

I believe there are many Blacks who are not culturally-aware of the various cultures within the ethnic groups among the Black community as a whole, i.e., Africans from various parts of Africa;Blacks from the South, North, Midwest areas of the U.S,, the Caribbean, UK, etc., I believe this is where many misconceptions about all Blacks come from, because even many non-Blacks don't respect the fact that Blacks are from various ethnic groups in this world, and seem to think we all have the same cultures. Now they may share a similar ancestor or history, but socially/economically/politically/educationally and culturally, there are differences among us as well. So as mentioned before, in my opinion, Tyler and Spike, both have their own experiences as Black men in this world and present their views of Black cultures/lifestyles, differently in their films.

.
[Edited 10/28/09 7:40am]

TonyVanDam said:

Okay, nobody is anwering my questions: How do you or anyone here KNOW that there is even a "situation" to begin with that requires settling??? And I couldn't care less about "choosing sides" in a potentially non-existent beef. The only thing I'm choosing is NOT to watch TP's work cuz I don't like it. And I'm sure Spike knew it was gonna get back cuz he said it in an interview. Maybe he just didn't care.

I'm saying some of ya'll are making a lot of assumptions. Maybe Spike DID reach out to him and TP wasn't receptive to him. Maybe TP came in the game thinking he could write and direct and had no need for Spike's assistance or film school. Just cuz you've been in the game for a long time doesn't mean you can just force mentorship on a rookie. The rookie has to be open to that. Why is everyone placing all the onus on Spike if TP's box office success is all that matters? Who knows, who cares.

missfee said:

You don't have to agree with me, misfee, and that is okay, but I stand by my statement. I am sure Spike was grateful for the funds he received for his previous films, and I appreciate that he was able to complete them. Let's not forget, Spike is pretty harsh when criticizing other directors/filmmakers, and although I appreciate and respect Spike and his creativity and success of a few of his films, I don't have to always agree with his criticism of other filmmakers/directors. Point is, all the ones he criticized, were the same ones that backed up his films.

However, I do agree with Spike when he makes his point about Hollywood moguls who don't invest in certain types of films by Black filmmakers/directors, especially when he feels that Hollywooe would back a film with a quickness, that displays negative Black stereotypes, i.e, Blacks in roles as drug addicts, drug dealers, criminals, prostitutes, housekeepers, illiterate characters, etc., before they back a film which has Blacks in positive roles.

My point about Spike with a begging cup, was not to be taken literally, it was only to make the point that if you want to have total control of your own sh*t, then build yourself that empire where you can control your own sh*t, and don't have to always look for investors to push your product. It's fine if he does not like the type of characters Tyler has in his film, but early in Tyler's career, he was playing to a specific audience that could relate to those characters. Now he is on top of his game, and although I don't like some of Tyler's characters in his tv shows or films, mainly because it reminds me of roles that Blacks were only allowed to play back in the day, but I've seen about two of Tyler's films that I was impressed with, and I have this feeling that after watching the two films that I actually liked, I have the feeling tat Tyler will go further into making movies, past the "chitlin" circuit.

Maybe in the beginning of a filmmaker's career, I can understand where you may need financial help, but Spike's been in this business for a long time now. Tyler just got here, and Tyler own's his own studio, movie set and controls his own sh*t, not to mention can give financial backing to other filmmakers.

.

Vendetta1 said:

Girl, that torch is TOO HEAVY for Tyler Perry to carry

I love you Tony, but sit the FUCK down you make alot of sense most of the times, but this is one of the times where you "lose" me, dude.

Spike used to Tyler? In WHAT lifetime?

Speaking of Prince, didn't Spike direct "Money Don't Matter Tonight"?

Harlepolis said:

But here's something I don't get in hindsight... Tyler said what pisses him off is "It's attitudes like that that make Hollywood think that these people do not exist and that's why there's no material speaking to them."

What people is he talking about?

JackieBlue said:

The people in his demographic that we're not supposed to talk about.
[Edited 10/28/09 9:16am]

SCNDLS said:

I mean....

Those are MOSTLY the demographic that gets portrayed when it comes to black people Is he fuckin' kidding?

If a black man is not ignorant, if a black woman is not a loud extrovert, if an old couple are not church bunnies and if the children are not sassy who're in desparate need of a GOOD ol' school bitch slappin',,,,,you don't have a "black" movie

And if black people happen to be upscale,,,,,they're EXTREMELY upscale you don't see middle grounds here,,,,,I think the most honest hollywood depiction I've ever seen about black people is Medicine In Melancholy and a handful of others. HANDFUL.

Tyler is acting like he's pushing the envelope when in fact, he's doing the SAFEST thing in hollywood's book
[Edited 10/28/09 9:25am]

Harlepolis said:

Pretty much. And he's made it quite clear that his films are aimed at a narrow segment of American society in general. He always talks about appealing specifically to "African-American churchgoing women" and even aims much of his marketing at the black megachurches. Of course a few other types of people MAY go to his films but they aren't his bread and butter and he says so.

Spike on the other hand, I think draws a more diverse audience than TP.

http://www.salon.com/ent/...index.html

The new Amos 'n' Andy?
Critics hate Tyler Perry's outrageous comedies, but his black fans love them. Is Perry a stereotype-spouting minstrel -- or a smart writer and actor who knows how to connect with his audience?

By Russell Scott Smith

Feb. 23, 2006 | Blacks and whites don't always understand each other. But in Hollywood, everyone's favorite color is green. So movie executives of all races took notice last February when a movie called "Diary of a Mad Black Woman" hit No. 1 at the box office -- despite no bankable stars, scant mainstream press attention and reviews that were almost laughably bad.

"Downright awful," "an absolute mess" and "one of the worst pictures in ages," critics wailed. Salon's Stephanie Zacharek called it "the sort of movie that's so bad, you just wish it would go away." Roger Ebert was offended by the movie's star, a "Big Momma's House"-style granny named Madea, who smokes reefer, keeps a pistol in her purse and slices up furniture with a chain saw. This "Grandma from Hell," as Ebert called her, was played in drag by the film's 6-foot-5 writer-producer-mastermind, Tyler Perry. "All blame returns to Perry," Ebert wrote. "What was he thinking?"

But there was no arguing the numbers. Perry made "Diary" on a shoestring $5.5 million budget, and as of last April it had grossed some $50 million. Perry's distributor, Lions Gate Films, quickly greenlighted $10 million for a sequel, "Madea's Family Reunion," which hits theaters Feb. 24. Now the suits are thinking franchise. "We've got Tyler fever," says Lions Gate head of production Michael Paseornek. "As far as we're concerned, the last weekend of February belongs to Tyler Perry, and we plan to be there every year."

What shocked Hollywood insiders was how Perry seemed to come out of nowhere. In the wake of the "Diary" success, the Hollywood trade paper Variety wrote a story that led off, "Tyler who?" Paseornek had been asking himself the same question a year before, after he received a letter from Perry's agent, talking about a guy who wrote plays for African-American audiences on the "chitlin circuit," a name that goes back to Jim Crow days, when African-Americans were banned from mainstream auditoriums. Nowadays, Perry's plays regularly sell out major venues such as New York's Beacon Theater and the Kodak Theatre in Los Angeles, where the Oscars are held, and in the last eight years, they've grossed more than $100 million through ticket sales and DVDs of live performances sold through his Web site.

"It was an astronomical number for someone I'd never heard of," Paseornek recalls, "so I called around to other people in showbiz, and they hadn't heard of him either."

But those people were white. Paseornek got his first insight into the Perry phenomenon when he walked down the hall to the Lions Gate inventory control department, to talk to an African-American employee named Kenya Watson. "She said, 'Sure, I've heard of Tyler Perry,'" he recalls. "'I own all his DVDs. Whenever we have a cookout, we put one on.'"

Kenya must be his official black life tour guide.

"When I first went to the studios," Perry told Salon in a recent phone interview, "they told me my fans didn't go to movies." But actually, his audience -- hardworking, family-oriented, Christian African-American women -- had just been waiting for someone to make a movie they would like, and Perry used his own powerful marketing apparatus to get the fans out for "Diary." In the weeks leading up to the film's release, there were constant ads on black radio stations and Perry reached out to the more than 500,000 fans who've signed up on his Web site's e-mail list. "Every week or so, we tell them what's going on," Perry says of his fan base, adding that a similar countdown has been underway for "Family Reunion." He also talked to pastors at some of the country's most important African-American megachurches, with whom he says he has "really good relationships"; they got the word out, sometimes even talking about "Diary" from the pulpit. Church auxiliaries started buying group tickets and making plans to see "Diary" en masse.

"People forget that churchgoing folks like to be entertained," says Tamara McLaurin, a 32-year-old catering sales manager at the Atlanta convention center. The release of "Diary" was a major event for McLaurin and the other women in her church's "dance ministry," a group that dances during services. They were traveling to perform that weekend, watched four Perry DVDs in a row on the bus, and then piled into a multiplex to cheer "Diary." "We called it 'Tyler Perry Day,' " recalls McLaurin, who now owns a "Diary" DVD that she still watches about once a week -- "just in the background, while I do things around the house."

"These people were desperate to be spoken to," says Boston Globe film critic Wesley Morris. "When something came along that was even remotely relevant, they threw all their weight behind it, even though it was a shittily made movie." Morris didn't like "Diary." "Blows to the head are delivered with more subtlety," he wrote in his review. He also happens to be African-American, but as soon as his review came out, he says, he got phone calls and e-mails from Perry fans who accused him of being white -- and a racist at that. The fans were even harsher when they knew for sure that the critic was white. Ebert, who is married to an African-American woman and has long been a champion for black cinema, received so much angry e-mail and became such a lightning rod because of his negative "Diary" review that Perry felt compelled, during a visit to Chicago, to plead with his fans to lay off the guy.

Why is this ALWAYS the reaction when someone dares to criticize TP???
[Edited 10/28/09 9:43am]

$$$ is the almighty color indeed.

Watch the people who jump for joy everytime he releases a film react when he flops though those SAME people will be more vicious to him than anybody else.

Did you know that Stepin Fetchit was the most highly paid black actor in Hollywood back in the 40s? And like Tyler, he was generous to his peers who couldn't find work,,,,,he was a millionaire. But ALL of those millions evaporated,,,,,better not let history drop a dime on you, Tyler.
[Edited 10/28/09 9:51am]

Trapped on a bus watching four Perry DVDs back to back?