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Reply #90 posted 09/10/09 6:02am

Mach

SCNDLS said:

Imago said:

Dress for success.


Nobody is forcing anyone to try and pursue a career of any type. If the environment requires a standard of dress and appearance, and you really want to make the money. Then dress for success.

If it's something you want to do, then don't bother trying. But certain, folks who complain about it astound me. It's their money. If you want to earn it, play by their rules.


Now that being said, I do find certain requirements for non-customer facing jobs to be extreme or strange. For example computer techs at JPMorgan & Chase are required to wear business casual every day except Friday (and on Friday's it's up their management). The stupid thing behind all of that is that Computer techs hall equipment and craw up under tables, etc. etc. The appropriate attire for this is work jeans and a colored shirt and no jewelry. Instead, there are techs walking around in kahkis or slacks and button up shirts who can wear jewelry. It makes no sense.

But yeah, my opinion is if you really want the job, you should be willing to play by their game. The time and place for changing the rules and culture is once you've reached the top--not down at the bottom. Just my two cents.

yeahthat


yeahthat too
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Reply #91 posted 09/10/09 6:33am

shellyevon

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What about trying the plastic piercing retainers? You can get clear for your nose, brown for eyebrows ect.

http://www.naturalexpress...iners.html
"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"-Dr Seuss

Pain is something to carry, like a radio...You should stand up for your right to feel your pain- Jim Morrison
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Reply #92 posted 09/10/09 6:46am

jone70

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meow85 said:


That's great and all, but it still begs the question: What IS "professional"?


Meow, c'mon. You're not that dumb, you know the game. And I just gave you examples: hair neatly pulled back, no facial jewerly (one pair of small earring is fine), clean fingernails, and a suit.

Besides, I hardly think pointing out that people who adorn themselves in the same horribly offensive, unprofessional way I do are actually the majority is childish whining. It's the truth. What sort of thought process ignores two thirds of qualified potential employees?


Nowhere did I say body modification was offensive. But using the constant excuse of "60% of people have it, so why does it matter." is akin to a child wanting to do something all his/her friends do just because. I could have responded with, "If 60% of people jumped off a bridge, would you, too?"

People are trying to help you and you constantly come back with excuses of why you shouldn't have to do this, or why that doesn't apply to you. If that's how are in interviews, I don't think visible piercings are the only issue. Most of us have to compromise ourselves at some point for a job. The level of compromise you're will to put up with is up to you, but you also have to be prepared to accept the consequences, which in this case seems like unemployment.

No, it's not fair, but life isn't fair.


.
[Edited 9/10/09 6:50am]
The check. The string he dropped. The Mona Lisa. The musical notes taken out of a hat. The glass. The toy shotgun painting. The things he found. Therefore, everything seen–every object, that is, plus the process of looking at it–is a Duchamp.
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Reply #93 posted 09/10/09 7:15am

PREDOMINANT

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A certain level of professionalism is always going to help. I would tone it down for interview and then be normal once you have the job. needless to say I have tats and piercings but they are in places where they cannot be seen at work wink. I certainly considered work when i had them done, even though it was before my professional career took off.
Happy is he who finds out the causes for things.Virgil (70-19 BC). Virgil was such a lying bastard!
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Reply #94 posted 09/10/09 7:27am

PunkMistress

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meow85 said:

Maybe I should start bringing in "before" photos of myself to potential employers to show much I've already changed myself for their overly-fussy asses. "See? You think I look "rebellious" or whatever shit problem you have with me now,,,"

lol


I know you're kidding, but if I were your employer I would find that attitude incredibly immature and self-absorbed.

In their eyes, it's not about you. I'd tell you to get over yourself.
It's what you make it.
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Reply #95 posted 09/10/09 7:29am

CalhounSq

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Genesia said:

meow85 said:


Horsecrap. That store was always ridiculously busy. The stated reason for closing was lack of management. They've got no one to blame but themselves.


You just have alllll the answers, don't you? lol

Go ahead...wear the piercings. Flash the ink. Don't get a job. It's no skin off their nose.

Because remember - no matter what the government dictates, the real minimum wage is always zero. Which is what they pay when they don't hire you.

lol Well DAMNNNNN... cold but true exclaim
heart prince I never met you, but I LOVE you & I will forever!! Thank you for being YOU - my little Princey, the best to EVER do it prince heart
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Reply #96 posted 09/10/09 8:49am

PunkMistress

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CalhounSq said:

Genesia said:



You just have alllll the answers, don't you? lol

Go ahead...wear the piercings. Flash the ink. Don't get a job. It's no skin off their nose.

Because remember - no matter what the government dictates, the real minimum wage is always zero. Which is what they pay when they don't hire you.

lol Well DAMNNNNN... cold but true exclaim


Very. lol
It's what you make it.
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Reply #97 posted 09/10/09 9:23am

johnart

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PunkMistress said:

CalhounSq said:


lol Well DAMNNNNN... cold but true exclaim


Very. lol


Absolutely.
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Reply #98 posted 09/10/09 10:42am

NDRU

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Look, there is no good reason. It's arbitrary. Why can't I wear a skirt to an interview? How come you can wear a skirt but I can't even wear shorts? What the fuck IS a tie fer chrissakes?! It is not an important question when seeking a job, it's a bunch of whining. You want a job, you know what you should do.

However, just for the sake of discussion, I will offer this.

You have said that the concessions to your wardrobe & hair & jewelry are starting to make you uncomfortable with how you look. The thought of taking out your jewelry seems like selling out. So it sounds as if you define your character in part by what you wear & how you look. So why shouldn't they do the same? It's not just holes in your face. You said they are important to you. So there are deeper implications. Maybe to you those implications are positive, but to them maybe not so positive.

You are also judging them by their appearance. Not directly, but by extension of the fact that you adamantly do not want to look like them. It's not just clothes, it's character, and a character you don't want to play. This thread has made that painfully obvious. In fact it proves exactly what your rings indicate to the employer--that you are contrary & not willing to play by their rules! lol

You're obviously intelligent & capable of succeeding. But remember you're trying to succeed on a level of mediocrity. Don't expect it to be what it is not.
[Edited 9/10/09 10:43am]
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Reply #99 posted 09/10/09 11:05am

PunkMistress

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NDRU said:

Look, there is no good reason. It's arbitrary. Why can't I wear a skirt to an interview? How come you can wear a skirt but I can't even wear shorts? What the fuck IS a tie fer chrissakes?! It is not an important question when seeking a job, it's a bunch of whining. You want a job, you know what you should do.

However, just for the sake of discussion, I will offer this.

You have said that the concessions to your wardrobe & hair & jewelry are starting to make you uncomfortable with how you look. The thought of taking out your jewelry seems like selling out. So it sounds as if you define your character in part by what you wear & how you look. So why shouldn't they do the same? It's not just holes in your face. You said they are important to you. So there are deeper implications. Maybe to you those implications are positive, but to them maybe not so positive.

You are also judging them by their appearance. Not directly, but by extension of the fact that you adamantly do not want to look like them. It's not just clothes, it's character, and a character you don't want to play. This thread has made that painfully obvious. In fact it proves exactly what your rings indicate to the employer--that you are contrary & not willing to play by their rules! lol

You're obviously intelligent & capable of succeeding. But remember you're trying to succeed on a level of mediocrity. Don't expect it to be what it is not.



Wow, excellent points. I hadn't even thought of it that way.
It's what you make it.
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Reply #100 posted 09/10/09 11:09am

hokie

meow85 said:

hokie said:




All the people in my nursing school class that have tattoos have to cover them during clinicals. Some of them mofos are gonna be wearing turtlenecks in the summer. lol

Because clearly, passing out with heatstroke is the more professional option. nod



Well, you're in a hospital so I don't think you'd pass out. lol You might burn up when you go outside to your car. It's just the way it is. People in the class aren't bitching about it they just do what they have to do. Our society just has rules. shrug
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Reply #101 posted 09/10/09 3:42pm

missfee

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You should definitely wear the role you need to play to get the job, but if you like to wear piercings and have lots of tattoos, you may want to ask if that would be a problem in that particular workplace. A better way of wording it is: "Does the office have a specific dress code? Are there any designated dress down days?" And the interviewer should have no problem answering that, if they do, then you should know that, even though thats a little detail, that it could possibly not be a place you want to work.

I've been doing the interviewing thing a lot lately myself because I would love to find a better job than the dump I work at now and I've noticed more and more that interviews are just for the employer looking for the right person for the position, its also about the candidate looking for the right company to work for as well. I've learned that some interviewers aren't even well prepared for the interview before I arrive. And some aren't even knowledgeable about their own department!!! It's unbelieveable.
I will forever love and miss you...my sweet Prince.
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Reply #102 posted 09/10/09 4:36pm

ZombieKitten

NDRU said:

Look, there is no good reason. It's arbitrary. Why can't I wear a skirt to an interview? How come you can wear a skirt but I can't even wear shorts? What the fuck IS a tie fer chrissakes?! It is not an important question when seeking a job, it's a bunch of whining. You want a job, you know what you should do.

However, just for the sake of discussion, I will offer this.

You have said that the concessions to your wardrobe & hair & jewelry are starting to make you uncomfortable with how you look. The thought of taking out your jewelry seems like selling out. So it sounds as if you define your character in part by what you wear & how you look. So why shouldn't they do the same? It's not just holes in your face. You said they are important to you. So there are deeper implications. Maybe to you those implications are positive, but to them maybe not so positive.

You are also judging them by their appearance. Not directly, but by extension of the fact that you adamantly do not want to look like them. It's not just clothes, it's character, and a character you don't want to play. This thread has made that painfully obvious. In fact it proves exactly what your rings indicate to the employer--that you are contrary & not willing to play by their rules! lol

You're obviously intelligent & capable of succeeding. But remember you're trying to succeed on a level of mediocrity. Don't expect it to be what it is not.


awesome post! clapping
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Reply #103 posted 09/10/09 4:47pm

Fauxie

NDRU said:

Look, there is no good reason. It's arbitrary. Why can't I wear a skirt to an interview? How come you can wear a skirt but I can't even wear shorts? What the fuck IS a tie fer chrissakes?! It is not an important question when seeking a job, it's a bunch of whining. You want a job, you know what you should do.

However, just for the sake of discussion, I will offer this.

You have said that the concessions to your wardrobe & hair & jewelry are starting to make you uncomfortable with how you look. The thought of taking out your jewelry seems like selling out. So it sounds as if you define your character in part by what you wear & how you look. So why shouldn't they do the same? It's not just holes in your face. You said they are important to you. So there are deeper implications. Maybe to you those implications are positive, but to them maybe not so positive.

You are also judging them by their appearance. Not directly, but by extension of the fact that you adamantly do not want to look like them. It's not just clothes, it's character, and a character you don't want to play. This thread has made that painfully obvious. In fact it proves exactly what your rings indicate to the employer--that you are contrary & not willing to play by their rules! lol

You're obviously intelligent & capable of succeeding. But remember you're trying to succeed on a level of mediocrity. Don't expect it to be what it is not.
[Edited 9/10/09 10:43am]


Great post, very interesting! smile
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Reply #104 posted 09/10/09 4:55pm

Fauxie

For a teaching job I was told by the boss of the agency during a tour of a school they'd set me up at that I had to shave my beard. lol He said in Thailand people didn't really like beards and that they made people look dirty. I said I would but I never did. It wasn't a big issue for me, I just don't like shaving all that much.

.
[Edited 9/10/09 16:56pm]
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Reply #105 posted 09/10/09 5:15pm

LeCram

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meow85 said:

Have you ever done or not done something with your appearance specifically for the sake of a job? I don't mean anything as extreme as cosmetic surgery, just things like how you wear your hair or clothing.

How did you feel about this, if you had? Were you happy or unhappy about it? Did you not care either way? What did you do, and why? Do you feel it was justified? Tell me about it.


During the name change of prince into prince i wrote in my letter by hobbies and interrests:

prince He's a musical genius.

when i got a job interview as quickly as possible the conversation started about prince, because no one knew there what prince meant. I made them curious.
so we had something to talk about.

Basically it's a good thing to do that on an job interview. Talk as quickly as possible about common things instead going into all the technical things of the job.

p.s. I got the job as student radiographic laborant
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Reply #106 posted 09/10/09 6:41pm

johnart

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NDRU clapping
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Reply #107 posted 09/11/09 4:34am

Genesia

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johnart said:

NDRU clapping


Laid it down! nod
We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #108 posted 09/11/09 5:10am

novabrkr

NDRU said:


You have said that the concessions to your wardrobe & hair & jewelry are starting to make you uncomfortable with how you look. The thought of taking out your jewelry seems like selling out. So it sounds as if you define your character in part by what you wear & how you look. So why shouldn't they do the same?


I disagree here.

Because they've occupied a position within the economic system and are actually in a dominant position in regards with those who are dependant on the vacancies they offer. If they are indeed already in such a position that they can afford to expect individuals to comform to their own requirements for even factors concerning personal appearance, then they are already most likely taking room away from those companies in the industry who wouldn't have such requiremnts (usually smaller ones). It's not a two-way pact between an individual and the company. In fact, the societies these days function based on the assumption that people will get their income for even the basic necessities based on another assumption that there is a sufficient amount of jobs available for everybody out there at all times. If somebody can't find a decent enough job because he has a couple of holes in his / her face, then the society operates on pretty strange values altogether.

Of course, I'd advice anybody just to personally seek out some middle-ground in these cases (or look for a job elsewhere). I doubt the situation's going to change too much too soon.

NDRU said:

In fact it proves exactly what your rings indicate to the employer--that you are contrary & not willing to play by their rules!


Well this is certainly true, and that's part of the problem to begin with.
[Edited 9/11/09 5:14am]
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Reply #109 posted 09/11/09 5:35am

ThreadBare

meow85, you keep asking should this be the way things are. There are a lot of shoulds and should nots in this world. What makes us unique and, in many cases, better people is how we go about responding to those world factors.

People of all stripes and realities change their appearance and interaction styles to get the job done and earn their salaries.

Now, if your identity is really inseparable from your fashion choices, then you might want to reevaluate how you earn your living.

Maybe this is but an indication that your life journey is one that will happen on your terms and, in many situations, outside the corporate and retail setting.
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Reply #110 posted 09/11/09 2:09pm

meow85

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I appreciate the responses and all, but I'm not and never will be applying for an office position. How I look at the office will never be an issue for me. I've been applying at places where, for the most part, there are no such dress code restrictions. Most often this issue never comes up, but on occasion it has. I'm not out looking for any serious job right now, just something to tide me over until I can finish my degree and have a job worth doing.

In my initial post I asked for people's own experiences and their feelings on it, not a lecture about how I'm doomed to homelessness if I don't comply.

My problem with such dress restrictions can be summed up pretty quickly. Any outfit that requires its personnel -whether it's a workplace, school, or the military -to dress alike, also expects them to think alike. In fact, that's the stated goal of many of these groups. No thanks. I happen to enjoy using my own brain from time to time.
"A Watcher scoffs at gravity!"
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Reply #111 posted 09/11/09 5:06pm

amorbella

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Both my arms are tattooed. If Im meeting with someone at work or the VIP's are coming by the office I will wear a long sleeved blouse. But on a daily basis, i'd wear what i wanted to. The way I see it I was hired for my skills not my body...
Say it's just a dream...
U open up ur eyes and come 2 realize
u simply imagined this
So u lean over and give her a kiss
Here on earth, here on earth,
with u it's not so bad
Here on earth, here on earth
eye don't feel so sad
Stay right here
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Reply #112 posted 09/11/09 5:18pm

meow85

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amorbella said:

Both my arms are tattooed. If Im meeting with someone at work or the VIP's are coming by the office I will wear a long sleeved blouse. But on a daily basis, i'd wear what i wanted to. The way I see it I was hired for my skills not my body...

That's how it should always be, regardless of the line of work. A person's appearance has absolutely no bearing on their ability to be a productive and competent worker. None. That anyone, employer or customer, believes otherwise shows just how ignorant and misinformed people can be.
"A Watcher scoffs at gravity!"
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Reply #113 posted 09/12/09 12:10am

CalhounSq

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meow85 said:

I appreciate the responses and all, but I'm not and never will be applying for an office position. How I look at the office will never be an issue for me. I've been applying at places where, for the most part, there are no such dress code restrictions. Most often this issue never comes up, but on occasion it has. I'm not out looking for any serious job right now, just something to tide me over until I can finish my degree and have a job worth doing.

In my initial post I asked for people's own experiences and their feelings on it, not a lecture about how I'm doomed to homelessness if I don't comply.

My problem with such dress restrictions can be summed up pretty quickly. Any outfit that requires its personnel -whether it's a workplace, school, or the military -to dress alike, also expects them to think alike. In fact, that's the stated goal of many of these groups. No thanks. I happen to enjoy using my own brain from time to time.


confused People's responses have to do w/ the question you asked:


Should I take that extra step and remove what amounts to quite a lot of money's worth of jewelry (for me) from my person? I've already drastically altered my appearance for the sake of a potential job and honestly, I don't feel comfortable anymore with how I look.



Maybe you just don't like the responses you're hearing? shrug
heart prince I never met you, but I LOVE you & I will forever!! Thank you for being YOU - my little Princey, the best to EVER do it prince heart
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Reply #114 posted 09/13/09 9:03pm

Lotus2unfld

RudyIsBackForGood said:

you should defnitly take thhose piercings off. I mean you can wear them all the time butt why wear them at work when you obviusly need a job and need to elevate your finanshial status?
I am absolutely against discriminaion based on appereance butt then again, I do know that the corprate world doesnt think like I_ do and sometimes you just have to abide their rules.

just play nice til you have the job you want. show em that your the one they looking for. proof them wrong when they question your skills. butt dont let your appereance let them judge you ...play nice for the time being.

later, once they know you and your qualities, you can slowly, gradually switch back to normal....except for the piercings because those are alwayys a no no.




falloff Uhm, what if the general public cannot 'SEE' the pericings. LOL.


Also, have you ever noticed that you always pronoucn "but" as Butt? LOL Too fun. too much fun. lol.


after all that being said... I agree. In the corporate or even work world one should dress accordingly ... professionally and keep the piercings and tattoo's or whatever else they got going on .. on the down low.
this is the time of the first fast.
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