blueblossom said:

so sorry about your son.

my cousin lost her daughter at 16 months and i really don't know how she carried on. we only know how we will react to something when you experience it. who knows what we are capable of when push comes to shove.

i totally agree about the terminal illness. i think

johnart said:

I'm not one for sentimental quotes, but Kahlil Gibran gives us this on despair: "The deeper that sorrow carves into your being the more joy you can contain. Is not the cup that holds your wine the very cup that was burned in the potter's oven?"

I'd never compare my pain to that of others, but I've subjectively been there and, occasionally, still am there. Yet sometimes what gives me restraint is the notion what I'm going through gives me all the more capacity to appreciate times of joy... or, where I may not, it at least gives me experience wherefrom I might help others encounter joy. In your mom's condition, for example, she was in "better spirits even" through her final Christmas, and I'd bet those of you who love her hold the blessing of that final holiday in a somewhat higher place even than those of earlier years. In some ways, that shared season of pain and inevitability perhaps galvanized you all.

I don't judge, bro. I think I understand where you're coming from, and it does spark certain "what ifs" for me, too. I just suppose much of this boils down to leveraging life's incredible payoffs with the sometimes seemingly unbearable struggles we often encounter between them.
[Edited 7/31/09 8:46am]

Lammastide said:

Everybody always says that, but it never was like that for me. I don't need to experience pain and sorrow to enjoy things. For me it's quite the contrary: The more I have been through in my life the harder it gets for me to enjoy the little things in life that are beautiful. I don't feel stronger to have dealt with difficult times, but weaker. I know I learned form these experiences, but what I learned doesn't help me in any way. I guess I am just fucked-up .

Serious said:

you're not fucked up... you are just normal. I think there is no right or wrong way to deal with lifes struggles and nothing right or wrong even about suicide. Not everyone finds strength in trials and tribulations. Sometimes such experiences break one's soul, eat away at your resolve. In the end, everyone just does the best that they can.

I honestly think the whole stigma of suicide is based in religion then carried on from culture to culture. Not sure if people consider it shameful or if they view it as the result of some mental disorder but it's odd that it has such a negative connotation to it. I honestly think some people can handle having a murderer in the family rather than someone who's committed suicide.

DesireeNevermind said:

Thank you for your words, the describe pretty well how I feel .
I also agree with what you are saying about suicide. I don't understand why it is considered the most selfish thing you could ever do. People smoke, eat unhealty food, drive too fast, do extreme sports or whatever and risk their lives, but that seems to be okay. And isn't it also selfish of family members/friends to expect somebody to continue living just for others when that person doesn't see a meaning in his/her life anymore.

Serious said:

if (God forbid) anything happened to my kids I would not want to go on living.

I don't know...I have been very unhappy..but even when the thought has crossed my mind I think " I am no punk...I am a fighter" and I couldn't do that to my kids...or my mother...there are many people that count on me....so I digress...

JustErin said:

I was going to answer this with a simple NO but...you are right...the ONLY thing that could make me that sad would be the loss of one or both of my sons.
Even then...I just don't think I have the mentality to kill myself. It's just not the way my brain works.

Mars23 said:

A long term solution for a short term problem, I once heard someone say.

When I was in 5th grade and when I was in 8th grade, I was picked on by gangs of girls and was too scared to stand up to them. They used to threaten me, spread nasty rumors and do whatever they could to make my life hell. I used to contemplate it then.

If I catch any of these bitches now, it's on...

then again, they're prolly burnt out crack whores by now

I can think of tons. And it boggles my mind when people say it's a selfish act but they are thinking of themselves and how they would feel when they ask you to stick around.The fact that others are so selfish is one of the reasons I wanted to leave this world in the first place. It amazes me that people seem to care when you are gone but not so much when you are here. There were times that I felt if people actually gave a damn and actually tried to help, I wouldn't had felt so hopeless.

Thankfully, I haven't felt that way in a while.

1sexymf said:

aint that often the case with bullies?

Lol, yes, karma is a BEEYOTCH!

Serious said:

I don't think you're Fed-up. Well... not based on this discussion, anyway.

I probably agree with you that past trials stick with most of us one way or the other. Some of us remain so cognizant of the hurt that we cling all the more to present joys. Some of us so experience the hurt that it feels ever a part of us. But if neither predicament truly benefits us, I like to think there's still some possible benefit in empathizing with and shepherding others who'll inevitably go through something as painful. It'd be selfish of them to expect such a thing, I suppose. But it's perhaps no less charitable to be present for it if/when needed.

Lammastide said:

What are you implying here ?

And what you are saying may have been true in the past for me, but I have learned that lesson already as a small child. Currently I have the impression my own problems just make me more and more egoistic towards others and that's not a nice thought. At least my friends don't get that impression, but I myself have it .

johnart said:

That's beautiful, John.

This is a very deep question.....

Serious said:

Lammastide said:

Thank you .

johnart said:

My grandmother did NOT want Hospice because she was hardcore Mexican Valiant Warrior. In all the pain, which she described as someone repeatedly stabbing her breast with an ice pick. She took nothing more than Tylenol because she didn't want the hardcore stuff as she wanted to be present and not like a zombie.

Then her tumor burst and that was the beginning of the end. The week before she died, she agreed to let hospice come in and that was the last she knew of conciousness. My grandmother was HARDCORE and even she could not deal with the pain at the end. If you saw her breast, you would know exactly why.

Anyone who judges someone for choosing an escape from that kind of pain really just needs to save it for when THEY are in this situation. They will probably do the same damn thing.

.
[Edited 7/31/09 14:10pm]

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

My mother passed away at home. We didn't want her to go to hospice. We had someone come in and take care of her through the day. My dad would be up with her all night. She died of cancer on July 4th 1994. She was the strongest woman I've known.

She started working when she was 8 years old. She picked everything, from cotton to cherries.

I really really admired her and loved her very much.

when i had my cancer i have to be honest ,i thought about it.but then i said i am going to fight this and win no matter what.i am still standing,i guess it wasnt my time.

I've had a houseful of family here for my show so this is the first chance I've had to read/respond to any of the posts following mine. Lammi, Punk, Supa, Miguel:

i think to this day my cancer still haunts me.i am so scared to grt it back, i have nightmares,it was sooo hard, still is.

lladygold said:

I can imagine it is. Stay strong .

my cousin committed suicide during a meth fueled binge and depression.

i'm currently diagnosed as passively suicidal by my psychologist.

she says that suicides occur as people are coming out of depression for the most part. while depressed they don't really have the drive to do anything, but as they are coming out they take a look at their and decide that things are so must up because of what they did that they do suicide. that's why most people appear happy or normal before they do it, they've come to peace with their decision.

ehuffnsd said:

That makes sense to me.



I wish you lots of strength during your recovery.