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PrintableImago said: It's just that speaking to a straight male friend and speaking to a woman or gay man, about the same event we witness or see, I get very very different takes on what was 'experienced'.
I think a lot of gay men speak with more surface level emotion and convey their thoughts in a more artistic/expressive way, like many women do, than your typical straight guy. I probably wouldn't classify that as less 'masculine' though - because you see it in straight guys, too, that are in more expressive careers such as acting, singing, etc... Oh and do straight guys even know what to do with poppers?  [Edited 7/13/09 6:54am] | |
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jtfolden said: Imago said: It's just that speaking to a straight male friend and speaking to a woman or gay man, about the same event we witness or see, I get very very different takes on what was 'experienced'.
I think a lot of gay men speak with more surface level emotion and convey their thoughts in a more artistic/expressive way, like many women do, than your typical straight guy. I probably wouldn't classify that as less 'masculine' though - because you see it in straight guys, too, that are in more expressive careers such as acting, singing, etc... Oh and do straight guys even know what to do with poppers?
[Edited 7/13/09 6:54am] Actors and singers are all gay. ALL OF THEM. And the ones that aren't are only acting 'gay' to score poppers from their gay friends. I'm not sure if straight guys know what to do with anything in their hands but beer, a t.v. remote, and their own cocks, honestly. | |
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meow85 said: ehuffnsd said: all the bi men i've meant except for one turned out to be gay... using bi as a step to saying they were gay or claiming bi because they thought that was hotter and would get them more tricks.
But don't you run in mostly gay male circles? True bi men generally aren't welcome, so it stands to reason that many bi men you would personally run into were just easing their way out of the closet. Who told you this? | |
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Imago said: The first 2 bi-men I met was in the military.
The first was just a ho. Actually the second one too. I never saw the second with a guy, ever. I mean, ever. And the first one made a pass at me, but I wasn't really into it. But I never really saw him with a guy either, other than the pass he made at me. I know a lot of bis who I suspect are just plain old gay. Nothing wrong with that of course. But from my experience with gay men, and I am completely generalizing here, they think almost exactly like women...emotionally and everything. I've never met a gay man that was truly "masculine" in that regard. Sure you can control the swinging of your wrist, the bounce of your walk, the facial expressions that make you look...like a woman. But that doesn't mean you're "masculine". They're like girls. Only more cute, and a willingness to breed like cockroaches. With the self-admitted "bi's", I still get that sense from them too, only with a certain, cute layer of repression on top of it all. But I've known a few bi males and they're all true alpha-males, and very sexually charged....and for some reason, extremely smart. But let me just say, I'm a terrible observer of such things. I think all british men sound and appear gay. And after this last week in Bangkok, I sense a certain gheyness to the ENTIRE thai male population. I honestly think that most Thai men would mess around with other Thai men just for fun. You really should meet my partner. If it wasn't for his allergy to female genitalia he'd be straight. I'm talking emotionally and all. I wasn't aware that this was such a rarity, maybe I've found the Gay Bigfoot. | |
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Fauxie said: Imago said: Look, if you met Chris in real life, you'd want him to slap your face with his cock a few times too. He's on fiya I have a feeling it'd make me pretty damned trendy too, after the Summer of JerseyKRS and all that. forget trendy, wouldn't that make you my bitch??? | |
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johnart said: meow85 said: But don't you run in mostly gay male circles? True bi men generally aren't welcome, so it stands to reason that many bi men you would personally run into were just easing their way out of the closet. Who told you this? No one had to tell me that. I see it with my own eyes. Being bi and having bi friends, I've experienced it firsthand. Bisexual people, whether male or female, are generally not included in "the community", or if they are it's mere lip service. Look no farther than the legions of gay men and women who insist there's no such thing as bisexuality, bi people are traitors, or greedy, or disease carriers, etc. Major queer publications rarely mention bisexuality (or people of colour or women of any stripe, for that matter, but that's for another thread) If you swing both ways you're not allowed into the clique. "A Watcher scoffs at gravity!" | |
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meow85 said: johnart said: Who told you this? No one had to tell me that. I see it with my own eyes. Being bi and having bi friends, I've experienced it firsthand. Bisexual people, whether male or female, are generally not included in "the community", or if they are it's mere lip service. Look no farther than the legions of gay men and women who insist there's no such thing as bisexuality, bi people are traitors, or greedy, or disease carriers, etc. Major queer publications rarely mention bisexuality (or people of colour or women of any stripe, for that matter, but that's for another thread) If you swing both ways you're not allowed into the clique. I'm sorry that's been your experience. It's never been mine as far as any group of friends I've been a part of. Or clubs I've frequented in the past. We always were accepting and inclusive of pretty much anyone who showed us the same respect/courtesy. As far as publications not including bi/women/folk of color. I mostly read local/regional gay publications. The DC area publications are pretty inclusive of all. Matter of fact, DC even has a Black Gay Pride celebration in addition to the regular Gay Pride. [Edited 7/13/09 10:40am] | |
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Imago said: meow85 said: Men falsely claiming bisexuality to be trendy doesn't happen very much. If anything, it's the opposite. Plenty of guys who could more accurately be described as bi identify as just gay or just straight instead.
Fellas, regardless of which way you swing, it's a real man who can stand up and admit it. There's no pride in picking a different label just to fit in.  You indentify as 'just straight' when you are in the mood to be with women. That way you can actually get some sweet sweet poontang. cause if you tell a woman you're bi, she'll run for the hills thinking your just a represed ghey, then the sweet sweet poontang is forever lost. I imagine maybe it works in a similar fashion if you admit to being gay but are really bi. Funkmistress called herself gay before she got some of Jerseykrs's sweet sweet mantang. I called myself QUEER and said I preferred women. Everyone else called me a lesbian.  | |
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johnart said: meow85 said: No one had to tell me that. I see it with my own eyes. Being bi and having bi friends, I've experienced it firsthand. Bisexual people, whether male or female, are generally not included in "the community", or if they are it's mere lip service. Look no farther than the legions of gay men and women who insist there's no such thing as bisexuality, bi people are traitors, or greedy, or disease carriers, etc. Major queer publications rarely mention bisexuality (or people of colour or women of any stripe, for that matter, but that's for another thread) If you swing both ways you're not allowed into the clique. I'm sorry that's been your experience. It's never been mine as far as any group of friends I've been a part of. Or clubs I've frequented in the past. We always were accepting and inclusive of pretty much anyone who showed us the same respect/courtesy. As far as publications not including bi/women/folk of color. I mostly read local/regional gay publications. The DC area publications are pretty inclusive of all. Matter of fact, DC even has a Black Gay Pride celebration in addition to the regular Gay Pride. [Edited 7/13/09 10:40am] National and international publications only have one major focus, as do many local ones. And if you're not man-identified male, white, and %100 gay you're lucky to be mentioned in the footnotes. And this is in a city where minorities are actually the majority in numbers. In my day-to-day dealings with my social circle there's more or less even acceptance of everyone, it's the larger community that's the problem. Hell, even here on the Org. I could pull up God only knows how many threads with definite examples of dumbassery on the part of straight and gay posters when it comes to bisexuality, including several where people debate the orientation's existence like they were talking about unicorns or UFO's. "A Watcher scoffs at gravity!" | |
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Alej said: Most of the "bi" guys I know are actually gay. They just don't want to come out
But I *do* live in México, so...
. [Edited 7/9/09 20:01pm] I sure believe that!  | |
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great thread | |
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Bisexual men...pssshhh!!! I have NEVER seen a "bisexual" male dating another male....what's up with that? If people are so "bi" how come they are rarely if ever seen dating or with someone the same sex as them, as they so claim to half be attracted to? Whenever I hear someone say they're "bi", to me It sounds like they're saying "I could be gay if I wanted to or when/it it's convenient for me." Which is why I don't believe in bisexuality anyway.
With that being said... Sexy asian and latin guys can be bi all they want for me. Hay!  [Edited 9/2/09 10:51am] | |
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ScarletScandal said: Bisexual men...pssshhh!!! I have NEVER seen a "bisexual" male dating another male....what's up with that? If people are so "bi" how come they are rarely if ever seen dating or with someone the same sex as them, as they so claim to half be attracted to? Whenever I hear someone say they're "bi", to me It sounds like they're saying "I could be gay if I wanted to or when/it it's convenient for me." Which is why I don't believe in bisexuality anyway.
With that being said... Sexy asian and latin guys can be bi all they want for me. Hay!
[Edited 9/2/09 10:51am] Asian men are goddamned sexy. | |
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Congratulations first taking the first step to tell the folks that you are Bisexual. I admire your courage for this.
Fauxie said: Does this happen?
Would this represent a peculiar form of progress? What would it be for, an air of mystery or perhaps a display of open-mindedness? In what social circles might it happen? | |
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Imago said: ScarletScandal said: Bisexual men...pssshhh!!! I have NEVER seen a "bisexual" male dating another male....what's up with that? If people are so "bi" how come they are rarely if ever seen dating or with someone the same sex as them, as they so claim to half be attracted to? Whenever I hear someone say they're "bi", to me It sounds like they're saying "I could be gay if I wanted to or when/it it's convenient for me." Which is why I don't believe in bisexuality anyway.
With that being said... Sexy asian and latin guys can be bi all they want for me. Hay!
[Edited 9/2/09 10:51am] Asian men are goddamned sexy. Do I NEED to turn this into a picture thread? | |
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violator said: I don't know about guys, but I swear nearly half the women I know claim to be bi. And for most of them I think that means they're willing to make out with one of their friends in a club.....to attract guys.
You're right. I hate that shit. If I make out with a girl it means I like her/want to sleep with her, and has nothing to do with wanting male attention. If I've got a girl, guys can fuck off but for the majority of women I come across, what you've said is so true.  | |
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The only men I've met who claim to be bi and likely aren't are gay guys -- either in earnest denial or as a ruse to make themselves appear somehow more "masculine."
I can't think of any straight male circle wherein being bi or gay is trendy. [Edited 9/2/09 13:39pm] Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.” | |
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ScarletScandal said: Bisexual men...pssshhh!!! I have NEVER seen a "bisexual" male dating another male....what's up with that? If people are so "bi" how come they are rarely if ever seen dating or with someone the same sex as them, as they so claim to half be attracted to? Whenever I hear someone say they're "bi", to me It sounds like they're saying "I could be gay if I wanted to or when/it it's convenient for me." Which is why I don't believe in bisexuality anyway.
With that being said... Sexy asian and latin guys can be bi all they want for me. Hay!
[Edited 9/2/09 10:51am] A lot of bisexual people, myself included, tend more towards opposite sex partners because it's easier socially. Call it "straight privilege" if you want, but sometimes it's not easy or practical, particularly if you live in a rural or conservative area, to have romantic or sexual partners of the same sex, so you just don't. People's desire dictates their sexuality, not their actions. If it were actions, then people who have never had sex would be asexual. Since that idea is obviously nonsense, so is saying someone who identifies as bisexual but isn't evenly split between men and women is lying. I find it deeply offensive that you're proclaiming you don't believe bisexual people exist, like we're debating aliens or some shit. "A Watcher scoffs at gravity!" | |
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Lammastide said: The only men I've met who claim to be bi and likely aren't are gay guys -- either in earnest denial or as a ruse to make themselves appear somehow more "masculine."
I can't think of any straight male circle wherein being bi or gay is trendy. [Edited 9/2/09 13:39pm] Certain small musician and artist circles, it can be. I doubt it's very common, but it's not unheard of. "A Watcher scoffs at gravity!" | |
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meow85 said: ScarletScandal said: Bisexual men...pssshhh!!! I have NEVER seen a "bisexual" male dating another male....what's up with that? If people are so "bi" how come they are rarely if ever seen dating or with someone the same sex as them, as they so claim to half be attracted to? Whenever I hear someone say they're "bi", to me It sounds like they're saying "I could be gay if I wanted to or when/it it's convenient for me." Which is why I don't believe in bisexuality anyway.
With that being said... Sexy asian and latin guys can be bi all they want for me. Hay!
[Edited 9/2/09 10:51am] A lot of bisexual people, myself included, tend more towards opposite sex partners because it's easier socially. Call it "straight privilege" if you want, but sometimes it's not easy or practical, particularly if you live in a rural or conservative area, to have romantic or sexual partners of the same sex, so you just don't. Riiiiight..... It's SO hard to be gay! | |
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meow85 said: Lammastide said: The only men I've met who claim to be bi and likely aren't are gay guys -- either in earnest denial or as a ruse to make themselves appear somehow more "masculine."
I can't think of any straight male circle wherein being bi or gay is trendy. [Edited 9/2/09 13:39pm] Certain small musician and artist circles, it can be. I doubt it's very common, but it's not unheard of. In my experience, occasions like this among "artsy" men tend to accompany some earnest expectation they might actually be something other than hetero. It's had little to do with fashionability. I've seen this sort of thing happen as a function of trend a lot more commonly among women. Just my own experience. Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.” | |
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Lammastide said: meow85 said: Certain small musician and artist circles, it can be. I doubt it's very common, but it's not unheard of. In my experience, occasions like this among "artsy" men tend to accompany some earnest expectation they might actually be something other than hetero. It's had little to do with fashionability. I've seen this sort of thing happen as a function of trend a lot more commonly among women. Just my own experience. I've seen the 'fashionability' aspect of this behavior. It very much exists
10 years later, a few of those I knew who claimed this are very much straight and knew it all along. A few actually are bi but in straight relantionships though. A few others are just gay as hell. | |
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Imago said: Lammastide said: In my experience, occasions like this among "artsy" men tend to accompany some earnest expectation they might actually be something other than hetero. It's had little to do with fashionability. I've seen this sort of thing happen as a function of trend a lot more commonly among women. Just my own experience. I've seen the 'fashionability' aspect of this behavior. It very much exists
10 years later, a few of those I knew who claimed this are very much straight and knew it all along. A few actually are bi but in straight relantionships though. A few others are just gay as hell. I find this fascinating. I've never witnessed it among males. All the other permutations, I've definitely seen. [Edited 9/2/09 14:16pm] Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.” | |
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I see the whole trendy bi thing happening more with women. And it's annoying.  I know I'm not all defined and shit, but mixing that with chicks doing it for kicks is stressful.Which is why I gear towards older women who aren't total b.s.
I had no idea guys were doing this too.  | |
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ScarletScandal said: meow85 said: A lot of bisexual people, myself included, tend more towards opposite sex partners because it's easier socially. Call it "straight privilege" if you want, but sometimes it's not easy or practical, particularly if you live in a rural or conservative area, to have romantic or sexual partners of the same sex, so you just don't. Riiiiight..... It's SO hard to be gay!If you live somewhere where it's not widely accepted -and that's most places, to be honest -then yes, it is. It could be argued that as a bisexual person only or mostly only having relations with people of the opposite sex is cheating or taking advantage of some "privilege" others in the queer community don't have, but that's an aside to this discussion. If you think that being openly gay is the easy option for anyone, you're mistaken. Whether they're exclusively same-sex oriented or are interested in both, coming out and living with/dating/having sex with people of the same sex is a big decision people have to grapple with, with a lot of potential negative social repurcussions. People can still lose their jobs, be denied housing, have their kids taken away, be shunned by their friends and families... "A Watcher scoffs at gravity!" | |
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Lammastide said: meow85 said: Certain small musician and artist circles, it can be. I doubt it's very common, but it's not unheard of. In my experience, occasions like this among "artsy" men tend to accompany some earnest expectation they might actually be something other than hetero. It's had little to do with fashionability. I've seen this sort of thing happen as a function of trend a lot more commonly among women. Just my own experience.
In some social cliques it's almost expected that you be bi. Why, I don't know. But I've heard of both men and women who are actually just straight or gay saying they swing both ways to fit in. "A Watcher scoffs at gravity!" | |
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meow85 said: Lammastide said: In my experience, occasions like this among "artsy" men tend to accompany some earnest expectation they might actually be something other than hetero. It's had little to do with fashionability. I've seen this sort of thing happen as a function of trend a lot more commonly among women. Just my own experience.
In some social cliques it's almost expected that you be bi. Why, I don't know. But I've heard of both men and women who are actually just straight or gay saying they swing both ways to fit in. Hey, I buy it if you say so.   I've certainly not seen everything.
Gay IDing as bi I see all the time. I've just personally not seen straight IDing as bi unless a guy truly is questioning his sexuality. Do these straight guys actually act on this charade? If so, I know some gay men who'd LOVE to vacation where you are. [Edited 9/2/09 14:32pm] Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.” | |
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Lammastide said: meow85 said:
In some social cliques it's almost expected that you be bi. Why, I don't know. But I've heard of both men and women who are actually just straight or gay saying they swing both ways to fit in. Hey, I buy it if you say so. I've certainly not seen everything.
Gay IDing as bi I see all the time. I've just personally not seen straight IDing as bi unless a guy truly is questioning his sexuality. Do these straight guys actually act on this charade? If so, I know some gay men who'd LOVE to vacation where you are.
[Edited 9/2/09 14:32pm] Just based on what I've seen, straight guys and girls who call themselves bisexual will maybe get as far the the kissing or making out stage, but halt things before they go any further than that. I'm sorry, but it takes more than a little smooching to qualify for the club. "A Watcher scoffs at gravity!" | |
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Imago said: The first 2 bi-men I met was in the military.
The first was just a ho. Actually the second one too. I never saw the second with a guy, ever. I mean, ever. And the first one made a pass at me, but I wasn't really into it. But I never really saw him with a guy either, other than the pass he made at me. I know a lot of bis who I suspect are just plain old gay. Nothing wrong with that of course. But from my experience with gay men, and I am completely generalizing here, they think almost exactly like women...emotionally and everything. I've never met a gay man that was truly "masculine" in that regard. Sure you can control the swinging of your wrist, the bounce of your walk, the facial expressions that make you look...like a woman. But that doesn't mean you're "masculine". They're like girls. Only more cute, and a willingness to breed like cockroaches. With the self-admitted "bi's", I still get that sense from them too, only with a certain, cute layer of repression on top of it all. But I've known a few bi males and they're all true alpha-males, and very sexually charged....and for some reason, extremely smart. But let me just say, I'm a terrible observer of such things. I think all british men sound and appear gay. And after this last week in Bangkok, I sense a certain gheyness to the ENTIRE thai male population. I honestly think that most Thai men would mess around with other Thai men just for fun. r u gay or bi? As long as we keep our luv strong we'll never shed no tears | |
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