Harlepolis said:

Totally agree. I was just talking about how the media over the years have conditioned many in the masses with their negative displays of persons of color, and those negative images have a "lasting" effect. Unless people make an effort to do research on various races/cultures, ethnic groups and religions, then many who are "too lazy" to make that effort, will believe everything the media execs spoonfeed them with.

Harlepolis said:

Will Smith was definitely a clown but the sitcoms' resolutions/endings normally showed him making some kind progress. Especially the stories that dealt with his relationship with his parents/parent figures.

Most sitcoms start out with archetypal characters, and a comedian like Smith's character will always have a foil/straight man. That's what Carlton was.

In terms of family structure, however, (again, minus Jeffrey the butler -- though he easily could've been a weird uncle, in another series) I still say it was a realistic portrayal of a black family in that you had a professional, upper-middle to plain upper class professional couple and their children.

ThreadBare said:

As much as I enjoyed Fresh Prince, I thought that the constant "Carlton's acting white" jokes were too much... There was two show that addressed this issue when Will takes Carlton to Compton, and the fraternity episode... but I thought these were not enough to counteract all the Carlton/white jokes that were made...

daPrettyman said:

Yes, I forgot Everybody Hates Chris! Girlfriends was cool once I got into it, never watched The Game...

sextonseven said:

YEEEEES!!! I loved Roc, totally forgot about it!!

johnart said:

Did u see me cringe when he came on the screen?
I was so scared he was gonna be.. stupid. Not like Madea [of course], but, I dunno... it's like I see him, and the first things that comes to mind now are disturbing stereotypes..

Granted-- some of his movies are good, but those tv shows...
I watched House of Payne off & on the first season b/c I had a crush on Allen Payne in the early/mid '90s (but too many things about the other characters/actors [and their over-acting] just turned me off) but I will NEVER watch that Meet the Browns mess; I have to turn the channel when those commercials come on.....

The 21st century will soon say good-bye to its first decade -- how much longer are drug/alcohol abuse and ignorance (like not knowing how to spell or pronounce things correctly) gonna be "funny" ?

I couldn't stand Martin or the Steve Harvey show either (and Steve Harvey pissed me off last nite on Larry King (Joy Behar was host) talking about how relationships are games, and if you don't believe in God, you're an idiot and he will walk away from you.. http://transcripts.cnn.co...kl.01.html

PositivityNYC said:

House of Payne has slightly improved since it's first season. Many told me it was much worse when he did the test run for the show.

The actors are still acting as if they are on stage. They don't know how to adapt to an on-screen performance.

PositivityNYC said:

Thank you!!

I have 2 white co-workers ask me why House of Payne is funny to black people and that they see as black people making asses of themselves.

coolcat said:

But that's the role of the sidekick - to be the butt of the jokes.

daPrettyman said:

Oh, I know they were projecting b/c they're used to the stage, but, they still seem like they're over-doing it, or exaggerating (?).. *shrug*
- and you'd think the director would have made them quit doing that on day 1

PositivityNYC said:

Tyler directed most of the first season. That's why the director didn't say anything.

It was really bad the first season because you knew which character was about to speak because they focused the camera on them a second or 2 before they said the line. Just horrible.

Like it or not the show obviously resonates with a lot of people, I even have to admit there are some elements I can relate to, though there are many many times I don't get the joke or I cringe. IMHO it seems like its the over-acting that's the most annoying, stage actors that had to over accentuate on stage doing the same thing for the camera looks extremely loud and clownish. And the stars are fat average-looking black folks, nobody stars their fat average-looking people in anything.

morningsong said:

I agree with you. The character of Curtis has always bothered me. Why is he made to look much older when he should be in his late 40s or early 50s. Their size doesn't bother me because they look like me and the people I know. It bothers me that the characters are like characters instead of real people.

daPrettyman said:

My cringe with Curtis is the fact he throws his grown son around too much, I get the whole implied dynamics but it's very uncomfortable to watch.

morningsong said:

Very.

Some say that Curtis is like Fred Sanford and I totally disagree. With Fred, he never laid his hands on his son. Sure, he called him a "dummy", but at the end of the day, we knew he loved his "dummy" and never wanted him to leave home. Any father that has his best friend looking after his 30+ year old son while he takes a trip is very protective of his son.

paisleypark4 said:

Do The Right Thing is a Spike Lee joint.

SUPRMAN said:

Aren't all of his movie "joint"? Most of them are for sure.

daPrettyman said:

Yes.

MuthaFunka said:

It's the type of jokes they were though... I mean Carlton acting nerdy, speaking well = acting white...

The show was pretty blatant in reinforcing that stereotype...

coolcat said:

Wel, that's how rich Blacks that grew up around whites acted. I know firsthand of that.

MuthaFunka said:

I didn't write my post properly... The Carlton character isn't the stereotype I meant...

It's the stereotype that black people are not or should not be like a Carlton... I mean Will constantly accusing that Carlton was "acting white"... If a black person is nerdy... does speak very well... then accused of acting white... what impression does that give to black kids watching the show who may be nerds themselves...

they see Carlton contrasted with Will... one is a black guy who is supposedly acting white... the other is the black guy being supposedly being authentically black... what impression does that give to those kids about what blackness means...

coolcat said:

But Carlton also was a Republican and he was HEAVILY into Tom Jones and he sho' didn't dance like a brotha ! So it was more than just the "talking". But yeah, I can see how some could get that.

MuthaFunka said:

You're right... but will kids see understand all that...

I first watched Fresh Prince, when I moved to Canada from the UAE... At that point I didn't know a thing about race,racism as in the west... and the only "black" show I'd really watched at that point was the Cosby show... and I'd just seen it as an ordinary american family facing ordinary problems...

Then watching the Fresh Prince... at first it seemed again... like an ordinary american family... Carlton was the standard nerd, he worked hard at school... Will was a standard goofball, he was intelligent but didn't work hard... those things you can understand even if you're from another country (like you said, there's more to it than that... but these were the things that I understood from my background)... But the whole acting white thing... It did give me an impression that there's an expectation for blacks not to be nerds, and not to work hard at school...

coolcat said:

I can dig that stance.

MuthaFunka said:

coolcat said:

Can U say.....Tiger?

Graycap23 said:

I wonder if Tiger's a Republican?

MuthaFunka said:

Probably.

daPrettyman said:

daPrettyman said:

Yeah, Fred stuck to calling names nothing physical, it's the same dynamics though. Would be interesting to see if that stuff tones down after Calvin is able to get his father that last $20,000 he needs and is about to become a father himself.

Well, I'll chalk it up to Tyler trying to kill 2 birds with one stone, and maybe I'm softening but I do see some positives in the Payne's, I don't get the Brown's show though except for the fact that those 2 people (Cora & Brown) are actually married, which I guess is a draw.

With the need for positive role models, it should be interesting to see how much support Hawthorne actually get. Granted it's not a comedy, but it's a different formula.