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What killed Pontiac? GM done with brand NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- The Pontiac car brand, once marketed as General Motors' "excitement division," will be killed off by the end of next year, the carmaker announced Monday.
The decision to shutter Pontiac was one of several aggressive steps GM spelled out in an updated survival plan Monday. The government has given the company until the end of next month to restructure and slim down in order to survive. The new GM will focus on four core brands: Chevrolet, Buick, GMC and Cadillac. The fate of three other troubled lines -- Saturn, Saab and Hummer -- will be decided at a later date, GM said. They are likely to be sold off or shut down, while Pontiac will be shuttered. Pontiac's problem was not sales, GM Chief Executive Fritz Henderson indicated during a conference call Monday. In 2008, Pontiac was the company's third-best selling brand behind Chevrolet and GMC and sold twice as many vehicles as Buick, a brand that will apparently survive the changes at GM. The problem for Pontiac has been profitability. GM doesn't generally break out profits by brand, but Buick and GMC, which are sold in dealerships alongside Pontiacs, are more profitable, Henderson said. "We didn't have a strategy that we were satisfied with that would allow us to win with the Pontiac brand," he said. Roots in the 1950s Pontiac's identity as a "performance" brand dates back to the late 1950s and early 1960s. Pontiac cars were designed with wider bodies for cosmetic reasons and the wheels were pushed out to match. This "wide-track" design became a selling point and was advertised as giving Pontiac cars a distinct cornering advantage over other cars. The idea of Pontiac as a performance brand was solidified in 1964 with the creation of the Pontiac Tempest LeMans GTO. That car quickly evolved into the GTO and is often credited with creating a new class of American car, the muscle car. "There was a time, a long way back now, when you knew exactly what Pontiac stood for," said Kevin Smith, editorial director for the automotive Web site Edmunds.com. More recently, under vice chairman Bob Lutz, GM tried to revive Pontiac's image. One strategy floated for Pontiac was to sell only, or mostly, rear-wheel-drive cars. That would have set it apart from other GM divisions, and most cars sold in America. Rear-wheel-drive is associated with performance brands like BMW. Unfortunately, the 2004 model year reintroduction of the Pontiac GTO name on a performance coupe imported from Australia didn't result in big sales. So far, the Pontiac G8, a rear-wheel-drive four-door sedan also imported from GM's Australian Holden division, hasn't been a sales success either despite good reviews. Pontiac's most popular products remain the G6, a decent but unexciting midsize car available as a sedan, coupe or convertible, and the Vibe, a small wagon shared with Toyota, which sells it as the Matrix. Any plans to return Pontiac to the heavy-horsepower days of the 1970s ended as gas prices rose and Congress prepared stricter fuel economy rules for the industry. In response to those pressures, GM quietly introduced the Pontiac G3, which had been sold in Canada only. Once again, Pontiac was selling a rebadged Chevrolet product, this time the Korean-built Aveo subcompact car. Pontiac's lack of focus as a brand may finally have brought its demise, said Smith. "That's just death in a marketplace where there's so much competition and so much quality," he said. | |
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I NEVER understood the appeal of this brand. | |
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You mean APART from the fact that they made shit cars? | |
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mdiver said: You mean APART from the fact that they made shit cars?
The G8 Was an awesome car. If I was shopping for a brand new car and my budget was 35k, I'd buy that one in a second. But yes, mostly they have produced garbage for some time. They are also eliminating their Saturn division, which surprises me. Although not my cup of tea, I thought those cars were quite popular and functional, and far better than most of GMs products. "Knowledge is preferable to ignorance. Better by far to embrace the hard truth than a reassuring faith. If we crave some cosmic purpose, then let us find ourselves a worthy goal" - Carl Sagan | |
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mdiver said: You mean APART from the fact that they made shit cars?
I have a 99 Sunfire (193,000+ miles) and she's still going strong ![]() | |
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I have never been a fan of the Pontiac brand. The designs never appealed to me. The only Pontiac I have liked in recent years has been the 2 seater sports car.
I do like GM products, though. I have owned 3 and I have never had any major issues with them. I really love their trucks and Cadillac line. I also like the Hummer line. I was listening to the TJMS this morning and Sheryl Underwood made some great comments regarding Pontiac. http://v3.player.abacast....diainc.asx **--••--**--••**--••--**--••**--••--**--••**--••-
U 'gon make me shake my doo loose! http://www.twitter.com/nivlekbrad | |
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daPrettyman said: I have never been a fan of the Pontiac brand. The designs never appealed to me. The only Pontiac I have liked in recent years has been the 2 seater sports car.
I do like GM products, though. I have owned 3 and I have never had any major issues with them. I really love their trucks and Cadillac line. I also like the Hummer line. I was listening to the TJMS this morning and Sheryl Underwood made some great comments regarding Pontiac. http://v3.player.abacast....diainc.asx I love me some Cheryl! She's gonna be at the Improv next month. | |
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They call this.....foreshadowing. | |
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Market saturation. That combined with GM's idea of building across Models with the same basic design (Traverse, Outlook, Acadia for example)
The G8 is a legit auto, however, and might end up being the basis for the new Impala. The G6 was popular because it was a spacious car for a great price. Men could fit in it and not look less masculine. There is a place for a retro Olds and a Pontiac, though. It would be cool if GM could out fit an old plant to build limited run autos. The thing that kills me is that they have pretty much abandoned the Mini-Van market. Granted, their Venture was horrible compared to the Sienna or the Oddessy, but the Saturn Relay was pretty slick. If they build a Mini-Van with performance and All Wheel Drive, they could have a sleeper hit on their hands. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Still it's nice to know, when our bodies wear out, we can get another -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- | |
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Shitty management plain and simple... an inbred belief that the American consumer would buy a car JUST because it's American... Although they had a few one hit wonders with the Solstice...
and the Corvette powered GTO... this is also the car company that brought you the world ugliest, most useless car EVER!! The Pontiac Aztek...
and don't get me started on the G3...
Car companies will fail if they refuse to keep up with the times. GM had it's call to arms with the high gas prices of last year and they didn't budge. Too bad it's an American company... A working class Hero is something to be ~ Lennon |
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They didn't budge because people were STILL buying Gas Guzzlers. F-Series Trucks, Silverados, and Rams were all in the top ten in 2007. Similar in 2008. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Still it's nice to know, when our bodies wear out, we can get another -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- | |
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They generally made cars widely regarded as ugly clunkers (true or not), and they charged way too much for their decent cars.
I looked at their G6 a couple of years ago because I wanted to buy American and help stanch the domestic implosion. But the price I was quoted was laughable. And, it was, in my opinion, a mediocre car. ![]() | |
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ThreadBare said: They generally made cars widely regarded as ugly clunkers (true or not), and they charged way too much for their decent cars.
I looked at their G6 a couple of years ago because I wanted to buy American and help stanch the domestic implosion. But the price I was quoted was laughable. And, it was, in my opinion, a mediocre car. ![]() Why are there hoods soooo fucking ugly??? I find that design of the front ends of American cars are absolutely horrid, even on the sport cars the front is not agreesive enough. | |
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SCNDLS said: ThreadBare said: They generally made cars widely regarded as ugly clunkers (true or not), and they charged way too much for their decent cars.
I looked at their G6 a couple of years ago because I wanted to buy American and help stanch the domestic implosion. But the price I was quoted was laughable. And, it was, in my opinion, a mediocre car. ![]() Why are there hoods soooo fucking ugly??? I find that design of the front ends of American cars are absolutely horrid, even on the sport cars the front is not agreesive enough. Add to that Pontiac's insistence on ugly spoilers and you can appreciate my utter aversion to their designs. | |
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ThreadBare said: SCNDLS said: Why are there hoods soooo fucking ugly??? I find that design of the front ends of American cars are absolutely horrid, even on the sport cars the front is not agreesive enough. Add to that Pontiac's insistence on ugly spoilers and you can appreciate my utter aversion to their designs. | |
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SCNDLS said: ThreadBare said: Add to that Pontiac's insistence on ugly spoilers and you can appreciate my utter aversion to their designs. Exactly. I couldn't tell you the number of times I've seen a gorgeous BMW swerve past me... | |
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ThreadBare said: SCNDLS said: Exactly. I couldn't tell you the number of times I've seen a gorgeous BMW swerve past me... Well, honey I adores mine and even though it's 8 years old it still wants to run. The responsiveness is CARAZAY!!! It's like I'm trynta drive the speed limit and the car is like ![]() | |
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SCNDLS said: ThreadBare said: Exactly. I couldn't tell you the number of times I've seen a gorgeous BMW swerve past me... Well, honey I adores mine and even though it's 8 years old it still wants to run. The responsiveness is CARAZAY!!! It's like I'm trynta drive the speed limit and the car is like ![]() That M6 is looking mighty tasty..... | |
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when they are trying to phase in hybrid/electric cars to the mainstream, it seems that this would be the class of car (pontiac/saturn) that they would phase out.
it seems more of a planned strategy to introduce a new line of cars forcing American consumers to think in a different direct, and the throwing away of the brand is all dramatics. To make a thief, make an owner; to create crime, create laws. | |
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Graycap23 said: SCNDLS said: Well, honey I adores mine and even though it's 8 years old it still wants to run. The responsiveness is CARAZAY!!! It's like I'm trynta drive the speed limit and the car is like ![]() That M6 is looking mighty tasty..... Yeah, but there's just something wrong with that price tag with that ho hum body. I mean it's nice but I expect more for that price. It's a beast under the hood but the design is very underwhelming IMO. OMG I saw the new X6 at the mall on Sunday. Stopped me in my tracks and I walked around it for a while. Totally radical design especially for BMW. ![]() [Edited 4/28/09 6:46am] | |
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My grandfather and uncle both had Pontiacs back in the day and they loved them. When I was looking for a car, I looked at some Pontiacs but the style didn't appeal to me. In 2005, I went to a GM-sponsored Auto Show In Motion that they had in California and I was able to test drive the G6 when it was brand new. They asked me what I had thought about the car and I told them that the car ran nice but the interior was bland. They needed to put more color into the interior and make it more sporty than it was, inside and out. 4 years later, this happens. It's a shame that this happened but at the same time, it's not shocking either. I just hope that there won't be anymore losses from the GM camp cause I like GM cars. My grandfather has a 2009 Buick Lucerne and it's the bomb. I'm not a fan of "old Prince". I'm not a fan of "new Prince". I'm just a fan of Prince. Simple as that | |
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They need to bring back this car:
The 1974 SD 455 Trans Am. No, this is not an homage to "Smokey and the Bandit". This is a REAL Trans Am; in fact, it was the LAST real Trans Am. My brother had one in high school, and then he bought one a few years ago. What a GREAT car. Drives about as well as anything out there today. And fast? My brother's cars were automatics, and you could smoke the tires all the way through the gears. What a great car. I think I'm going to buy one. | |
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I hate this news.
Here's my car: ![]() | |
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![]() | |
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A working class Hero is something to be ~ Lennon |
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GM for the last ten year has been living on the goodwill of a previous generation.
I cannot think any car or truck i would own from them, the Corvette is nice, but not my thing. Ford has the f-150 pickup and thats about it, but at least ists a great enough seller that it can keep the entire company afloat on just that one product. Chrysler, poor Chrysler has better products in my opinion than GM with the Jeep Wrangler being my favorite of theirs but with such limited demographics. Styling wise i think they were passable compared to GM. [Edited 4/28/09 17:53pm] | |
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daPrettyman said:
The Solstice GXP is the funkiest American roadster out there right now in its price range. (And frankly, I prefer them designwise to even the higher-end 2-seater Corvettes out there.) With its demise, hopefully Saturn -- if it escapes its own axing -- will simplify the front-end design of its nearly identical Sky models to look more like this. If Saturn does that and tweaks some of the storage issues common to both cars, the brand could have the domestic roadster market locked up for years... something that no one would have expected. [Edited 4/29/09 7:25am] Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.” | |
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I always trip off how different it is living in California and then going to the midwestern states. You see 90% American made cars in the midwest but out here in Cali it's all about Japanese cars for the middle class, and BMW's and Benzo's for those that can afford them. | |
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bobsteezy said: I always trip off how different it is living in California and then going to the midwestern states. You see 90% American made cars in the midwest but out here in Cali it's all about Japanese cars for the middle class, and BMW's and Benzo's for those that can afford them.
I think that's a testament to the underappreciation of aesthetic by American automakers. Everyone generally wants good handling and efficiency, but folk in warmer climates don't have quite the same concerns as Midwesterners with ruggedness. They can afford to splurge on rolling fabulous, and they go with imports because... well... American cars -- and even the culture around them -- are just Ford particularly should be flogged for this... especially after they watched GM's Oldsmobile brand die. These two elder American labels should have long since established themselves as world-class engineers and designers on par with, say, Mercedes-Benz. I'd imagine Ford somewhat benefits in the import market from the mystique of things "other." But given their legacy, even domestically, folk should aspire to drive a Ford or Olds. Instead, they seem to settle on Ford as an affordable standard; and Olds isn't even an option anymore. [Edited 4/29/09 7:52am] Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.” | |
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bobsteezy said: I always trip off how different it is living in California and then going to the midwestern states. You see 90% American made cars in the midwest but out here in Cali it's all about Japanese cars for the middle class, and BMW's and Benzo's for those that can afford them.
oh? i dont think its much different. middle class is driving mostly toyota acura and lexus- HONDA, mostly toyota and honda. those with different taste and more cash drive european cars. those who can't afford new cars who purchase <10 grand drive pretty much anything. In the country yeah, people tend to buy chevy and ford TRUCKS, but as of recent i have been noticing more Toyota trucks being driven by lawn/landscape service people and farm/ranch owners. To make a thief, make an owner; to create crime, create laws. | |
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