Ok.

So my niece, Khalida, is 5 years old.




My sister called me last night and told me that she had been peeping in on Khalida in her room just to see what she was up to while watching her programme (sometimes she sees her doing some of the cutest things ever like playing with her baby doll, singing to it, etc.)

This time, my sister was shocked, horrified and just plain

Khalida was looking at herself in the mirror, with her little underwears hiked up her butt while checking it out in the mirror!

WHAT THE HELL. SHE'S FIVE.

Her mother does not wear thongs, and she never sees my underwear when I stay over... so how is she getting this idea?! what is she seeing at school? what is she LEARNING at school? from her friends? from the young mothers that parent her friends?

WHAT ON EARTH IS GOING ON HERE?!?!?!?!?


she's only five, i'm really upset because she's ONLY FIVE.


help. anyone. suggestions?

She wasn't scolded but my sister did eventually make her presence clear, and Khalida did feel a bit ashamed, although she had a sly smirk on her face while hanging her head.

jebus christ. help - anyone?

My nephews exhibitted frighteningly grownup vanity traits around 5-6 years of age.

It's scary, but I think their over-simplification of vanity is more mimicry than anything else.

Does your sister check herself out in front of her daughter? It's very easy to do it and not realize it.


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[Edited 7/17/08 8:11am]

Oh, and she is fucking adorable!

Welcome to the media and magazine portrayals of women in little or nothing at all!!! On tv, music vidoes and magazines on the stands. It is EVERYWHERE!! Little girls can't be kids they are prepping to be the next hoochie mama!!!

Oh my great niece is a doll a lil SammiJ!!!!!

Imago said:

ha thanks i parade her around like she's my own daughter


maybe my sister does check herself out, even if it's just to a quick check before she goes out

but she's not vain like khalida
that little girl got hold of some markers, and didn't she scrawl all over her face like it was makeup oh dear god.

she's just really a girly girl i guess, she likes frilly lacy things, we can't go by an underwear shop because little girl will be all OVER the lace teddies (she thinks they're dresses for girls her age )

i just hope it doesnt get any worse than this for now... she's five!

Ahhhhh....girl. Ain't nothing up with it. She may have seen a commercial or magazine. But she's fine.

She's adorable!

You have to watch these commercials now and days. I was watching TV the other day and lord and behold, a commercial came on about penis growth!

There were kids in the room and this was AMC!

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[Edited 7/17/08 8:16am]

sammij said:

Well as long as she's not writing "Slave" on her face and extolling the virtues of owning her own masters, you can pretty much assume she's just a normal girl going through a phase.

Don't freak out just yet.
I'm not sure I understand what the big deal is... She probably saw a video or a magazine or something. Little girls imitate big girls, play dress-up, put on make up, etc. all the time. And it's natural to be curious about your body at that age. I don't think she should feel ashamed. She was playing alone in her room. That's very different than parading around with no or little clothes on at school or on the playground.
I don't think it's anything to be alarmed about yet. But her mom may want to talk to her about it, ask her about it, etc.

rachel3 said:

isn't she just a pearl?

i know we try to keep her away from all of that - not shelter the poor child, but let her know it's not OK to look like that and that pretty dresses and little girls clothing are the nicest things for her to wear

it's hard for my sister being a single parent - and i try to help her too, just to give her that extra female presence..


the male gaze...

Imago said:

AlienX2050 said:

TV is plain EVIL i tells ya!
the kids aren't alright anymore - because they're not safe.

AlienX2050 said:

That's what I think too.
She'll be ok. Maybe it might be a good idea to remind her that "what's inside" is more important than what's outside.
That being said, she's just a little doll.

CarrieMpls said:

it's a big deal for both me and my sister
it's not that khalida even knows what thongs and gstrings are all about, but i mean if she's learned that they exist already, there's no telling what else she'll be learning soon.
we're conservative, and we value steady-paced learning, on all issues. i get the mimicking thing, but damn. it's too much.

we just gotta keep talking to her i guess.

applekisses said:

see that's what i'm saying.
she's too young to even understand that (don't question it - we've tried because she's been having issues about her blackness lately too.)
which is why i'm shocked that she's skipped over all that and went to this.
i guess because vanity is easy to mimic and do..
we're just telling her "it's not OK"
until we can further figure this shit out.

sammij said:

Your niece is beautiful, and perfectly normal.

I've worked with kids a lot over the years, most of which have been abused, but at times parents become so concerned because their children are exhibiting what they consider to be sexual activity, such as exploring their bodies. For the child it is not a sexual activity at all, but a basic attempt at trying to understand their bodies, what feels good and pleasurable, and has no sexual overtones to them. It is simply a way to get to know themselves. This is a natural and normal part of growing up. She is curious about her body. She may have saw a magazine in which a girl was wearing thong bikini or thong underwear and it made her curious. The important thing is to let her know that it's okay to be curious about her body, explain that there are guidelines, such as her body being very private, and belonging to her to take care of. Let her know that it's okay to ask questions and be willing to answer questions that she asks on her age level and cognitive understanding. But don't make her feel embarrassed or ashamed because how she feels now about her body, and the natural act of exploring how her body works, can translate (and often does) to her body image when she gets older. You don't want her thinking her body is something to be ashamed of, or something to be embarrassed about. Trust me, it can take years to work through self-esteem issues. Just let her know it's okay, set guidelines as to when and where it is appropriate to do so, and remain open to questions that she might have.

As a side note, I accidentally walked in on my 7 year old son the other day standing in front of the mirror in the bathroom naked, doing muscle poses. I backed out and when he got dressed and came out, he was embarrassed. I apologized for walking in on him and stated that he was really growing up, and that he needs his private time in the bathroom and that it's okay for him to lock the bathroom door when he needs that private time, so that no one walks in on him accidentally, and left it at that. Later he came and asked me, "Mommy was it bad for me doing that, looking in the mirror at myself like that?" I said, "Sweetie that's not bad at all! You're growing up and you are noticing that you are growing up. I think that's a good thing!" He smiled, hugged me and thanked me and went off to play with his Star Wars toys. So, it's just natural.

oh, she's been through learning about her body, we've helped her through that
we don't have magazines that exhibit that...that's what i don't get
i don't get how what she's doing now is seen as exploring her body.

Self discovery

Many little ones I have worked with will hike their undies up and prance round -look in the mirror - shake their booties

I can understand the concern as well

I do not see it ( at this point ) as something to really worry about - it seemed innocent enough

She is beautiful

sammij said:

She's explored it through touch, now she's exploring it through sight.

if you guys say so.

sammij said:

Hmmm...I see what you're saying. I wonder then, if she's picking up negative stuff about being black, I wonder if she's picking up vanity stuff in the same way. Just sort of seeing some people's (via media or in real life) reactions and then reacting herself as she thinks is appropriate (as she's seen other people do - could be anybody).
That poor baby. I totally understand you wanting to shelter her from all this. Growing up is hard.

sammij said:

I have a friend whos little girl used to masturbate all the time from around the age of 1 until ... she is now 12

The Mom was so so worried that the girl would NOT be normal and where in the hell did she learn that and all the normal concerns.

The beautiful 12 yr old girl is very normal still to this day

applekisses said:

it is...
i don't want her growing up the way i did.. that's all i want for her
i don't want her overwhelmed with images of "how to look"
i don't want her growing up hating herself for being black (not the point of the thread i know but it's another issue we're dealing with her)
i just don't want her to have the self-esteem issues i had growing up

sammij said:

Sammi, as a mom, if I was concerned, here's what I'd say, "Khalida, I'm sorry for walking in on you when you were looking at yourself in the mirror. You have a beautiful body. But I'm curious about something, where'd you learn to wear your underwear like that?" Don't push though if she doesn't want to answer. But she may come right out and say she saw it on TV or in a "book/magazine". And then take it from there. Explain that most girls don't wear their underwear like that, or however you want to explain it to her. Just really don't make too big of a deal out of it.

Mach said:

I have a friend who has a 3 year old girl...she is in a stage that she takes off all her clothes and looks at herself in a full-length mirror and yells "YAY!!!!!" and dances around. (I think I need to start doing that.)

Mach said:

masturbating or just playing around and seeing where everything is?

applekisses said:

see that is cute to me! (and yeh, i should try that out m'self)
i dunno, just the idea of a thong and wondering what she thinks of it, it freaks me out
she was just a baby. SHE IS STILL A BABY.

applekisses said:

OMG I am gonna start doing that as well so cute

WTF? Why hasn't this thread been jacked yet?
I demand to know what's going on??!!!??

Imago said:

stay back, heathen!

sammij said:

Real masturbation - consistant rubbing of her clit to what seemd almost ( and maybe was ) orgasm when the girl was 3 and begane to understand more her mom was able to teach her to go to her room when she wants "alone" time

Little boys will masturbate as they sit and play with their trucks or whatever. They rub and tug on their little erection almost to hard