JustErin said:

My parents were never 'trying' to hurt me when I got spanked and many times it didn't at all. Now of course there were times it did sting, but it wasn't injurious and they weren't rough with me. The purpose it serves is to discipline the child. I don't think spanking should be the first option of discipline. Or even the second or third. But as a last resort, with some kids its an effective deterrent for bad behavior. It sure worked for me. Moreover, I just think its improper to suggest that it automatically equates to physical violence or abuse.

Hell, you're 34 years old and you still respond well to rough treatment.

RodeoSchro said:

Loser.

meow85 said:

It's not proper to hit a child. I'm talking about spanking. And if you don't understand the distinction, you should look up the definitions.

violator said:

Of course, doesn't that get into the issue of teaching kids the reason for being good in the first place? What's the point in being good when it's only done to avoid pain or embarassment? Can it really said to be the same thing, or the same "level" of good as doing it for it's own sake? Or does it matter? I think it does. No doubt this sounds stupid to you, but remember the point in Clockwork Orange? "Is the man who does good because he is forced to really any better than the man who does evil of his own free will?"

Serious said:

No, I don't respect them. Respect is about deferential regard and esteem. I cannot esteem someone I do not know. I will not defer to someone who hasn't earned my trust.

That does not mean that I am not polite or considerate to people I meet for the first time. But that is not the same thing as respecting them.

violator said:

So you hit the kid with your hand, or....you hit the kid with your hand. There's a difference?

violator said:

I still don't follow because you still haven't explained how it disciplines a child. If it doesn't hurt them or if parents aren't trying to hurt them then why exactly do they do it? What makes it any different than other methods that do not involve striking their kid?

There is absolutely no way you can say that hitting a person - no matter what they reason may be - is not a violent act. None.

Plus, from what I have read, children coming from homes where they were spanked are no further ahead than children who weren't spanked in terms of staying out of trouble as an adult.

The difference is not in whether they were spanked or not, it was in whether they were shown love and respect and rules as a child.

So what I am saying is...if it doesn't make a difference, then why would anyone choose physically hurting their kid over finding other methods to teach them rules and right from wrong?

Btw, you can spank me any time you want. I like the pain.

meow85 said:

Spanking specifically speaks to an open hand to the butt. Hitting is more general. Of course, for your argument, I understand that words like hit and violence are more effective. So call it whatever you wish.

violator said:

Don, seriously. Come on now. Be real here.

You "hit" someone it hurts. You "spank" someone it hurts. That's it. The dictionary can try to make the two separate all they want. No matter what label you wanna put on it, they both have the exact same results.

JustErin said:

From - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spank

The American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) official policy statement [5] states that "Corporal punishment is of limited effectiveness and has potentially deleterious side effects. The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends that parents be encouraged and assisted in the development of methods other than spanking for managing undesired behavior." The AAP states that any corporal punishment methods other than open-hand spanking on the buttocks or extremities "are unacceptable" and "should never be used". Furthermore, they state that "The more children are spanked, the more anger they report as adults, the more likely they are to spank their own children, the more likely they are to approve of hitting a spouse, and the more marital conflict they experience as adults[15] Spanking has been associated with higher rates of physical aggression, more substance abuse, and increased risk of crime and violence when used with older children and adolescents."[16]

The American Psychological Association opposes the use of corporal punishment in schools, juvenile facilities, child care nurseries, and all other institutions, public or private, where children are cared for or educated (Conger, 1975). They state that corporal punishment is violent, unnecessary, may lower self-esteem, is likely to train children to use physical violence, and is liable to instill hostility and rage without reducing the undesired behavior.[17]

The Canadian Pediatrics Society policy on spanking states "The Psychosocial Paediatrics Committee of the Canadian Paediatric Society has carefully reviewed the available research in the controversial area of disciplinary spanking (7-15)... The research that is available supports the position that spanking and other forms of physical punishment are associated with negative child outcomes. The Canadian Paediatric Society, therefore, recommends that physicians strongly discourage disciplinary spanking and all other forms of physical punishment"[18]

England's Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health and Royal College of Psychiatrists have called for a complete ban on all corporal punishment, stating "We believe it is both wrong and impracticable to seek to define acceptable forms of corporal punishment of children. Such an exercise is unjust. Hitting children is a lesson in bad behaviour."[19] and that "it is never appropriate to hit or beat children"[20]

The Australian Psychological Society holds that physical punishment of children should not be used as it has very limited capacity to deter unwanted behavior, does not teach alternative desirable behavior, often promotes further undersirable behaviors such as defiance and attachment to "delinquent" peer groups, encourages an acceptance of aggression and violence as acceptable responses to conflicts and problems[21]

UNESCO states "During the Commission on Human Rights, UNESCO launched a new report entitled "Eliminating Corporal Punishment - The Way Forward to Constructive Child Discipline". The United Nations Committee on the Rights of the Child has consistently recommended States Parties to the Convention on the Rights of the Child to prohibit corporal punishment and other forms of violence against children in institutions, in schools, and in the homes...To discipline or punish through physical harm is clearly a violation of the most basic of human rights. Research on corporal punishment has found it to be counterproductive and relatively ineffective, as well as dangerous and harmful to physical, psychological and social well being. While many States have developed child protection laws and systems violence still continues to be inflicted upon children".[22]

The United Nations Committee on the Rights of the Child recommends that States Parties to the Convention on the Rights of the Child to prohibit corporal punishment in institutions, in schools, and in the home.[23] However, it should be noted that the Convention itself does not mention the words "corporal punishment" or any similar phrase.

TheMightyCelestial said:

LOL. Thanks for not ignoring me, though.

i knew a family once, when the mom got pissed and said she was going to spank her kids they would say back "beat me mama! beat me!" and laugh at her

I've seen some "talking to the child" discipline that was a helluva alot more abusive than some spankings......I truly see both sides of the arguement on this one...while I don't think it's cool to "hit" a child, a pop on the butt isn't what I would consider abuse...I understand that there are parents that take it too far...but I believe there is a distinction between discipline and abuse...and it's not a fine line either...there's a huge difference...yes, a spanking stings like hell...but it goes away...abuse does not go away, physical or verbal...
[Edited 2/25/08 13:53pm]

roodboi said:

Dude, shut the fuck up. I know that verbal abuse is very damaging as well. That's not what we are talking about. The options are not hit your kid or verbally destroy them. Jesus!

You are such a fucking idiot.

People who verbally abuse others are horrible people.

JustErin said:

losing friends left and right...

roodboi said:

Sorry, dude. I think that was meant for me. She called me "Don" and all.... and now Carrie's sic'd the shrinks on me...

You guys win.

violator said:

You used "Erin" first!

I still love lust you.

Let's make out.

horatio said:

My sweetie's mom broke a wooden spoon on him once. He was big enough (and tough enough) at that point that he was able to laugh about it - and got her to laugh, too.

She never whacked him again.

CarrieMpls said:

Bunch of busybody bureaucrats.

Genesia said:

You better be careful, with all that eye rolling you're gonna fuck up your eyes and the next time you go to beat your kid you're not gonna be able to see them enough to actually make contact.

JustErin said:

Don't worry. If I had a kid to beat, I'd find him just fine.

Genesia said:

I'm sure his shrieks of terror as you come raging after him all cross eyed and and shit would give away hiding spot he may find.

oops.
[Edited 2/25/08 15:33pm]

meow85 said:

You're comparing an adult woman to a child. Which I personally find offensive but that's okay. we'll have to agree to disagree there.

There is a difference between displeasure and discipline. I don't spank my kid because I am angry at him or because he does something that displeases me. Hell, if I did that I'd be spanking him all day.

Kids mess up, they make bad decisions, it's part of growing up and learning. You shouldn't haul off and pop the kids for every little thing they do. Buuuuut, there is a line that is not to be crossed and, despite some people's objections and attempts to infringe upon the rights of good parents to raise their kids they way they see fit, that line is to be determined by the parent.
When a spanking is called for, is entirely up to me. Whether you agree with that is of zero importance to me.
This is part of the shit that causes some parents to end up with kids like that fat little cuss who treats her mother like a goddamned servant. Her mother is afraid to raise that damned girl and discipline her in a manner that is clearly needed at this point in her life. She requires an ass whupping. My opinion will not change there.
[Edited 2/25/08 15:56pm]

alwayslate said:

I happen to agree with you. That kid is a brat, and needs to be punished for her disrespect, spanking or not.

I WANT TO WATCH THE SHOW!!!!

violator said:

If spanking isn't to cause pain, what is it for?

Anywho, it is not the child who needs her ass kicked, it's the mom.

Stymie said:

I don't know about you (or if you've even been spanked) but I had many spankings that didn't hurt me at all. Like I said before, they hurt my feelings more than anything else.

But understand that my parents never hit me with anything. No switches, belts, extension cords, hangers or anything like that. Swats on the butt. Sometimes they stung a little, sometimes they didn't.

violator said:

If my mom gave me a spanking, it was usually for something I didn't do. Never once did a spanking just hurt my feelings: they hurt me physically. My mom used switches, extension cords, belts, hangers, broomhandles, etc. on us. The effect it had on me as an adult now? I never do that shit to my kids.

They are 13, 18, and 21 this year and I got through their lives without spankings.

Not knockin' your hustle because every parent is different.

violator said:

when I was lil', my mom bought me a "Stretch Armstrong"...she gave it to me and specifically told me not to over stretch him 'cause he would break and all that jelly shit inside him would get on the carpet...the first thing I did was tie one of his ams to my door knob and another arm to my headboard, closed the door, he stretched, he broke, shit got on the carpet...my mom spanked me with Stretch's arm...

Stymie said:

i'm not a parent, but i feel the same. and no matter how snotty my kid is to me, i will never hit them across the face.