oui

No.

I don´t believe in the death penalty.

I can completely understand the desire of vengeance of the victims´ families and friends but the State should be above that.

In this case and others the murders are so hideous that you cant not help but thinking that these people do not have any right to live among us but again the State can´t not solve this with more deaths. It is just wrong.

finally I think that the families of the victims have to word their minds first, only them could forgive
[This message was edited Thu Oct 24 13:55:10 PDT 2002 by jnoel]

Public stoning would be nice. Firing squad would be fitting. But the gas chamber or lethal injecttion will do.

kisscamille said:

Exactly my point! With the flawed systems in place, these killers sometimes have the opportunity to get out of prison whether it be because of good behaviour or legal technicality that lawyers can use to get them off.

SkletonKee said:

YES! But that too would be considered "cruel and unusual" punishment. That's being way to fucking kind if you ask me.

And before anybody keeps chiming in about the prisons not being posh hotels...did you see the prison's that the Iraqis were being held in? The treatment and facilities certainly are posh compared to many places around the world.

violett said:

Read my comment again. I'm not advocating to stop caring about eachother in the least.

if there's a 100% proof that they're guilty, then death penalty is not enough.
I believe most crimes deserve a similar punishment.
Murderors should die (the same way they killed)
Rapists should be castrated, or thrown in a cell with some very horny cell mates.
and wife beaters should be beaten the same way.

In Egypt for example they still kill by hanging...
the only punishments that I fell were too harsh, were the Talibans. cutting off hands of thieves, who mostly stole food to survive...that's not right.

About the sniper? I hope they'll throw that/those snipers in a cage full of hungry lions.

Having unprotective sex with bubba until the ripe age of 70 is a nice thought

DORA said:

What if they started to enjoy it???

I'm against the death penalty I must say.

Listen, i couldnt give a fuck if these fuckers died but that's not the point.

As a society, we have to be better than the criminals of the world. Taking their lives is just revenge. Stooping to the level of the criminals is not a good idea imho.

Let them rot in jail and if anything horrible should happen to them in there, so be it.

bkw said:

I agree with ya!

bkw said:

I don't understand why people equate a legitimate punishment as the same thing as raping and strangling a child. It's simply not the same thing.

IceNine said:

Then take Bubba away if they start to enjoy it

yes a new LARGER

not so nice bubba will show up

i am completely PRO-Capitol Punishment...

in this case i think torture beforehand is fairplay, then a lil healing and the long walk off a short pier...if these are the two that are solely responsible HELL yes and God I hope I get called in for Jury Duty...


sorry there is no help for people like this and they value human life so little why should i value theirs... i refuse to pay taxes supporting people like that... ask the IRS...$33000.00 a yr to support an inmate living better than most of the people out in the world - ah nah.. do what'cha wanna, but as long as the law books say we have that right i will use it to its fullest Xtreme...

The death penalty, as it is currently applied, is wrong. I hold this opinion for a variety of reasons. Here are a few:

• It's disproportionately imposed on the poor, minorities, and males.
  
• There are too many errors in forensic science - there are innocents who have been condemned to die.
  
• We can afford the alternative - e.g. life in prison without the possibility of parole. In fact, the death penalty is often more expensive to society.
  
• I don't believe in taking another life, except in self-defense.
  
• It doesn't seem to deter crime.
  

I think they have caught the sniper(s). If so, they should spend the rest of their miserable lives in jail. For the 17 year-old, it may amount to 60 or 70 years of confinement. Now that's what I call punishment.

Personally… I have never been in support of the death penalty, and therefore wouldn’t advocate its implementation in this case, or any case for that matter.

In my opinion it shouldn’t even be an option… it disturbs me that it still is in various places. One would of hoped we would of moved on from "an eye for an eye" mentality. I don’t know how one finds a justification or rationalization for it… I know I can’t… You don't have to kill off your citizens who pose a danger to society in order to protect the wider community from them, that's what life sentances are meant to do.

But each to their own, we all have our reasons for believing what we do… However it amazes me that so many in positions of power will preach that those who murder or terrorize have no respect for life… yet in turn will happily sign someone’s death warrant, (ok, maybe not happily in all cases, but they’ll sign it all the same) I guess the term lethal injection has become so sanitized and is truly such a medical term, that it maybe enables many to feel more detached from what they’re really doing…. and that is killing another human being… I just can’t comprehend how anyone could feel comfortable in doing that. I wouldn’t want that on my conscience… no thank you.

But that’s just me…. I know many other feel differently about it… as I said, we all have our reasons for believing what we do… one has to be true to their feelings on the matter.

"The big day has come the bell is sounding
I run my hands through my hair one last time
Outside the prison walls the town is gathering
People are trading crime for crime
Everyone needs to see the prisoner
They need to make it even easier.
They see me as a symbol, and not a human being
That way they can kill me, say it's not murder, it's a metaphor.
We are killing off our own failure and starting clean "

Ani Difranco

TheMax said:

Well said.

They should get the death penalty those poor people didn't desereve 2 die that way they had their whole lives ahead of them. Eye especially feel sorry 4 the victims families, eye know what it like 2 have a family member killed, some1 shot and killed my grandfather back in 1980, beieve me the pain never goes away.

Diva said:

We have pretty similar views.

If one of my family or someone I knew died as a result of these madmen I would want to see them dead, however, in that case I would not be the right person to determine their fate. We all want revenge at times but is that how we want to live our lives?


[This message was edited Thu Oct 24 23:22:11 PDT 2002 by bkw]

I'm against the death penalty.

I'm also human and have mixed emotions about the death penalty.

If one of the victims was a member of my family or a close friend I'd want him dead. I really don't have any tolerance for people who repeatedly show no conscience and/or value for human life by continuously taking the lives of innocent people.

If I had any kids and David Westerfield did to mine what he did to Danielle Van Dam out in Southern California, there's a very good chance I'd want him to be put to death - if I didn't get to his sorry ass first and make him suffer before killing him. And don't think that many parents don't feel the same way, regardless of their feelings of the death penalty.

Since these type of things (meaning any type of cold blooded murder) can happen to anyone I try and put myself into the surviving family members' shoes. Someone's mother's/father's/sister's/brother's/son's/daughter's/cousin's/husband's/wife's brains were blown out and they were killed in cold blood. Someone doesn't plan to stop, is planning to kill more kids, and is telling the world about it in letters to the cops. This person is an animal in my eyes. Sure, this may be an emotion of pure anger and revenge, but as humans we've all felt extreme emotions at one time or another about certain things.

Since I do not generally agree with the death penalty, I also find myself in the shoes of the opposite mentality. The justice system is deeply flawed and always has been. Since I am distanced from the victims in more ways than just geography, maybe my emotions also don't allow me to condone capital punishment in general.

About 10 or 11 years ago there was a high profile death penalty case about to come to a close with the death a man who shot two teenagers for no other reason than to shoot them, while they were at a fast food joint. The fact that he also took one of the victim's hamburgers after shooting him seemed to add insult to injury for many folks. I wish I could remember his name, but he had committed the crime about 12 or 13 years prior to being put to death. Since this was the first death penalty case so close to home for me (it happened not too far from my city) that I could remember, it had an effect on me. I was just a kid when I had first heard of the murders he committed, and had basically forgotten about it til his time on earth was coming to a close.

The day it happened it didn't make me feel good. At all. It made me feel worse because it was a death penalty case about to come to fruition closer to home than any other case that I could remember.

Maybe my feelings about the kids he killed weren't as cognizant because I was so young when it happened...as an adult, maybe the fact that they weren't related to me also had something to do with the fact that I didn't like the way the killers death made me feel. Since members of the news media, law enforcement agencies, and surviving family members were/are allowed to watch while it happens and report it in detail to the world afterward sickened me more.

Maybe my feelings about someone like Westerfield are heightened because I'm older now, definitely more cognizant, and can mentally process these things differently.

But you know another side of the Westerfield case for me is this; he's someone's son/grandson/brother/father too. Though the outcome of his case didn't surprise me in the least bit, I feel bad for his relatives too. I don't know if his parents are still around, but I do think of how a murderer's parents feel when the murderer is on death row. And it's not always a case of negligent upbringing, a la the kids who went on a shooting spree at Columbine.

I didn't feel anything when Tim McVeigh was put to death. But that doesn't mean I'm in favor of the death penalty. I'm still against it, although I do obviously feel like I'd have revenge on my mind if what he did happened to someone close to me. I believe revenge is a natural emotion considering the subject we're talking about, but I don't think it's a healthy emotion. And I don't feel the government should hold the keys to the ultimate revenge tactic.

But I DO want the asshole(s) who shot 14 people and killed 10 to suffer in some way.

Some things are complex for me.

Heavenly said:

Heavenly, your statements dont surprise me, the "eye for an eye" -idea is part of your religion and I respect that. however, eye for an eye leaves both blind. nothing accomplished.

TheMax said:

TheMax and I agree on all points... now that should be celebrated

bkw said:

Indeed… one can only have compassion and feel sadness for the families and friends of those who died… My position on the death penalty truly doesn’t stem from having sympathy for the people who commit such deplorable crimes…. Nothing justifies what they did… and naturally there should be consequences for their behaviour…. They shouldn’t get anything less than life in jail. But killing them wouldn’t bring an end to the pain the victims and their families have gone through and will go through, it won’t bring their loved ones back… Capital punishment to me is just as senseless as the murders committed by these serial killers… what purpose does it really fulfill? Does it ever really bring closure, is there such a thing? Can it really ever be justified? Does it ever fill the void? Do we (or the government) really have the right? Not in my eyes.

I can understand why people have mixed feelings about it… but I just don’t have it in me to support the killing of anyone quite frankly, despite the horrendous crimes that are committed. Is killing another human being only wrong when it isn’t legislated? Legislated killing of prisoners doesn't appeal to me anymore than any other kind of murder.
.
[This message was edited Fri Oct 25 1:44:44 PDT 2002 by Diva]

soulpower said:

wow... that is quite amazing! It was bound to happen eventually

I must say I agree with what he wrote too, except perhaps on one aspect... he wrote "The death penalty, as it is currently applied, is wrong" , and that is true, but I feel that it doesn't matter how it was applied, it would always feel wrong to me.

SOLITARY CONFINEMENT for the rest of their lives. Let's put Muhammad in a MILITARY prison in SOLITARY CONFINEMENT. That would most likely piss him off, don't you think. I know we can't actually do that, but I'd like to see that done.
[This message was edited Fri Oct 25 2:08:42 PDT 2002 by TongueBox]

Diva said:

I second that. I didnt read it careful enough. Now give me that beer bottle back, TheMax!

Fry em'---slowly