Ok, this docu is shocking and not for the weak of heart ... I consider myself
being weak of heart, but I sat through it. It is disgusting that this kind
of stuff can happen in a EU member state. The people responsible for this
should end up in jail for a looong looong time ...



For Heaven's sake, take care of our children.

video is no longer available.....

It's available in 5 parts :

http://www.youtube.com/wa...CCZgYNvXTQ

http://www.youtube.com/wa...re=related

http://www.youtube.com/wa...re=related

http://www.youtube.com/wa...re=related

http://www.youtube.com/wa...ature=user

Hey, aren't you proud of all the people who pay great money to manipulate their reproductive systems and create oodles of unwanted embryos so that they can have their own blood children?! I mean why would you ever care about a child from someone else's womb!

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

I have a personal opinion on IVF and other treatments. Me and my wife were lucky because our 3 boys came easily, but I would never ever have gone for
fertility treatment if it hadn't worked. My personal belief is that if nature
hasn't given it to me, it must be for a reason and I should find peace with
that. I probably would have adopted.

The true nature of people will always be rotten and vile, wether it manifests like this or in many other ways, there will never be an end to such cruelty. I don't know the facts well enough to confirm, but aren't Bulgaria and Romania the poorest of all the EU Nations? Are there organizations that one can contribute to that helps out in any way to give assistance to these children?

UncleGrandpa said:

This docu was aired a week and a half ago on Belgian television and was aired
again tonight ... Reaction was massive and questions are being asked in
parliament and our representatives at the European Union. In the mean time
people are rallying up for donations and the like, mostly supported by
local celebs pulling the wagon ... I'll keep the org informed on these actions.

One4All4Ever said:

Question. What is are the reproductive rights like in that country?

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

you mean, can people be restricted from having children ?
I don't have a clue ... What I learned from the docu is that most children
that you see had minor disabilities (blind, mute, deaf or light forms of
autism), their current condition is a result from not treating them right.
Parents in Bulgaria can apparently drop children in orphanages for no specific
reason other than 'I can't take care of them'.

What or who can be held accountable for this atrocity? Is it the poverty of the country itself, the parents or the apathy of wealthier nations? Can blame ever really be assessed when conditions are this awful? In my opinion, once a child is as old as nine and has lived like this for all his life, he or she has no chance of recovery or development, they will have to be cared for for as long as they live, its such a shame to see this.

One4All4Ever said:

No, more like is abortion restricted or banned? There are consequences with forcing women to term with pregnancies they do not want to continue. But people won't see that.

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

I don't think abortion is banned there. There is one part in the docu where
the English lady asks the director of the institution what happens when girls
get pregnant, but she doesn't answer it directly.

did they talk about how in the past they had kept the kids in the orphanages in the dark (easier to deal with them if they spent most of the time asleep, I guess) and how they went blind because of it?

I can't watch these links right now.

http://www.eugenics-watch.com/

"The Eugenicists

The eugenicists, as I see them, are the men behind Hitler, the men behind Josef Mengele, the men behind apartheid, the men behind segregation, the men behind the Rumanian orphanages. Nazism, apartheid, segregation and Ceaucescu's "orphanages" were all eugenically based schemes for social salvation. The failure of these schemes has discredited eugenics but not the eugenicists. This is because no one really knew who they are. But since they are professors, journalists, economists, gynecologists, psychiatrists and sociologists and since they have been left in place, they have continued to mold society. The difference is that in the Thirties they worked openly whereas now they work in obscurity."

"Eugenics is dedicated to the proposition that all men are created unequal and the food is running short; that, in the struggle for food, those who have an inherited advantage prevail and pass the advantage on to their children who prevail even more; that this is how evolution, Yale and the English aristocracy happened. A further belief is that, at this point in evolution, the more evolved must take destiny and the less evolved in hand. Selection must not be left to chance for chance is cruel, capricious and, all too often, expensive but must instead be led by the kindly elite - Harvard professors, British aristocrats, Serbian psychiatrists, Aryans and so on. But death control, which has been the main method used by natural selection or chance, for termination of useless populations, must be replaced by birth control which is cheaper, and, as Charles Darwin pointed out in The Descent of Man, more effective."

Jesus

i have not watched all but a few seconds of the bulgarian clip, but it reminded me of this which i read a few weeks ago

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/h...181854.stm

for one, this thread is a P&R issue, but if it can be discussed here all the better, the issues involved are deep rooted and found in every generation and nation. The post Zkitten has just posted is very relevant, and is an idealism that lives amongst us. In the country, in which i grew up in, these dark moments are not far behind us, and in the other two countries I live and have lived in. The only thing that has changed, is the political view, for the sake of looking good, I sadly must say.

Whitnail said:

oh that is awful

though I admit many times when my kids started climbing out of their cots 15 times each night, I thought of putting the cot upside down, and effectively making them a cage bed

I'm reading a book about population control (fiction, but raising interesting points) which is giving me the heebie-geebies.