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PrintableChristaro said: Why are we here?
I am here to create the next grandest version of the greatest vision I will ever have about who I really am. | |
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eikonoklastes said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: Do you really think he was applying that philosophy to that kind of tragedy?  Fact is life isn't what you make of it for the majority of the global population. I still think it is. For the most part, regardless of circumstances, you can choose your happiness. You can choose your purpose. |
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CarrieMpls said: eikonoklastes said: Fact is life isn't what you make of it for the majority of the global population. I still think it is. For the most part, regardless of circumstances, you can choose your happiness. You can choose your purpose. Sorry but I think that's both naive and wrong. 
Naive because you underestimate how much dire circumstances can affect a person's life (it's way too easy for us in the western world who have all our basic needs met to say that circumstances don't matter) and wrong because you don't "choose your happiness", at least not if you mean that you can simply choose to be happy. You can choose to pursue happiness, but that's another thing altogether. | |
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retina said: CarrieMpls said: I still think it is. For the most part, regardless of circumstances, you can choose your happiness. You can choose your purpose. Sorry but I think that's both naive and wrong.
Naive because you underestimate how much dire circumstances can affect a person's life (it's way too easy for us in the western world who have all our basic needs met to say that circumstances don't matter) and wrong because you don't "choose your happiness", at least not if you mean that you can simply choose to be happy. You can choose to pursue happiness, but that's another thing altogether. It's probably arrogant too. |
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We are but a small, infinitesimal small chapter in the history and life of this planet... we are a part of IT'S cycle of life as were the dinosaurs. Our "purpose" is to get this planet to the next chapter of it's life cycle.... ours will end.....
Damn that's a heavy perspective.....  My spirits are low today....so my perspective is dark.... my apologies....
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retina said: CarrieMpls said: I still think it is. For the most part, regardless of circumstances, you can choose your happiness. You can choose your purpose. Sorry but I think that's both naive and wrong.
Naive because you underestimate how much dire circumstances can affect a person's life (it's way too easy for us in the western world who have all our basic needs met to say that circumstances don't matter) and wrong because you don't "choose your happiness", at least not if you mean that you can simply choose to be happy. You can choose to pursue happiness, but that's another thing altogether. PS - Other than chemical imbalance, diagnosed depression, etc. for the most part I think you can "choose" happiness. At least, you can certainly choose how to look at things. You can choose to wallow in despair (and hey, nothing wrong with that. I do it all the time.) or you can choose to move on from whatever caused it. Certainly, a life like mine I have many advantages and it is immeasurably easier for me than many in the world. And that doesn't mean we shouldn't seek to correct the injustices of the world, that we shouldn't seek to stop pain, abuse, neglect, what have you. Nor am I making light of the plight of those less fortunate than myself. But even in the most dire of circumstances you can find those who are able to rise above and be happy in their day to day lives. Thousands of times more difficult to? Oh yes. But that's life. It's not fair. |
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retina said: CarrieMpls said: I still think it is. For the most part, regardless of circumstances, you can choose your happiness. You can choose your purpose. Sorry but I think that's both naive and wrong.
Naive because you underestimate how much dire circumstances can affect a person's life (it's way too easy for us in the western world who have all our basic needs met to say that circumstances don't matter) and wrong because you don't "choose your happiness", at least not if you mean that you can simply choose to be happy. You can choose to pursue happiness, but that's another thing altogether. That's all too true. I do believe most naturally choose to pursue happiness, and often surely find their own happiness even amongst the most terrible hardship. Those such people don't so much choose their purpose or 'make of life what they will' but rather find the best of what they have, even if that is in fact only 'enjoying' the relief of something which may be the least of all evils in their life. It's relative, of course, and I think human beings have, on the whole, an incredible ability to endure and find scraps of happiness even in the most dire of circumstances. I think that so many do live with such hardship therefore proves how great the desire to be happy truly is. So many people do endure hardship but they do carry on. However, happiness is clearly very different for different people. It's tough on some to toss out the phrase 'you can choose your purpose' when someone's idea of happiness might be not getting raped today or for the first time in several days being able to feed their children properly. The purpose for many people is survival and so there's really very little choice involved. Circumstances, in my opinion, are way more influential than whatever drive or ambition may be alluded to in phrases like 'life is what you make of it'. To me, in the context that it's said a phrase like that comes with the understanding that drive or ambition are luxuries, and I think that's pretty much true for most of us. Try hard or don't, we're still getting by ok all the same. That's a luxury not afforded to more people than I think we'd like to believe. ... [Edited 6/14/07 4:44am] | |
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CarrieMpls said: retina said: Sorry but I think that's both naive and wrong.
Naive because you underestimate how much dire circumstances can affect a person's life (it's way too easy for us in the western world who have all our basic needs met to say that circumstances don't matter) and wrong because you don't "choose your happiness", at least not if you mean that you can simply choose to be happy. You can choose to pursue happiness, but that's another thing altogether. PS - Other than chemical imbalance, diagnosed depression, etc. for the most part I think you can "choose" happiness. At least, you can certainly choose how to look at things. You can choose to wallow in despair (and hey, nothing wrong with that. I do it all the time.) or you can choose to move on from whatever caused it. Certainly, a life like mine I have many advantages and it is immeasurably easier for me than many in the world. And that doesn't mean we shouldn't seek to correct the injustices of the world, that we shouldn't seek to stop pain, abuse, neglect, what have you. Nor am I making light of the plight of those less fortunate than myself. But even in the most dire of circumstances you can find those who are able to rise above and be happy in their day to day lives. Thousands of times more difficult to? Oh yes. But that's life. It's not fair. 
People with clinical depression can choose happiness, as well. There are all sorts of wonderful therapists and medications out there now that can help them turn their lives around. | |
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Fauxie said: retina said: Sorry but I think that's both naive and wrong.
Naive because you underestimate how much dire circumstances can affect a person's life (it's way too easy for us in the western world who have all our basic needs met to say that circumstances don't matter) and wrong because you don't "choose your happiness", at least not if you mean that you can simply choose to be happy. You can choose to pursue happiness, but that's another thing altogether. That's all too true. I do believe most naturally choose to pursue happiness, and often surely find their own happiness even amongst the most terrible hardship. Those such people don't so much choose their purpose or 'make of life what they will' but rather find the best of what they have, even if that is in fact only 'enjoying' the relief of something which may be the least of all evils in their life. It's relative, of course, and I think human beings have, on the whole, an incredible ability to endure and find scraps of happiness even in the most dire of circumstances. I think that so many do live with such hardship therefore proves how great the desire to be happy truly is. So many people do endure hardship but they do carry on. However, happiness is clearly very different for different people. It's tough on some to toss out the phrase 'you can choose your purpose' when someone's idea of happiness might be not getting raped today or for the first time in several days being able to feed their children properly. The purpose for many people is survival and so there's really very little choice involved. Circumstances, in my opinion, are way more influential than whatever drive or ambition may be alluded to in phrases like 'life is what you make of it'. To me, in the context that it's said a phrase like that comes with the understanding that drive or ambition are luxuries, and I think that's pretty much true for most of us. Try hard or don't, we're still getting by ok all the same. That's a luxury not afforded to more people than I think we'd like to believe. ... [Edited 6/14/07 4:44am] But I feel like you're suggesting that happiness has a set value, or measuring stick by which all people have to achieve a certain level to call themselves "happy". I don't think that's true. Happiness is in the eye of the beholder, so to speak. I don't think saying that diminishes the plight of, say, starving children of prostitutes in India. And of course it's unfair to measure their struggles against anothers. But, as you say, we all try hard to be happy, no matter the circumstances. I just think it's also achieveable no matter the circumstances. |
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Ace said: CarrieMpls said: PS - Other than chemical imbalance, diagnosed depression, etc. for the most part I think you can "choose" happiness. At least, you can certainly choose how to look at things. You can choose to wallow in despair (and hey, nothing wrong with that. I do it all the time.) or you can choose to move on from whatever caused it. Certainly, a life like mine I have many advantages and it is immeasurably easier for me than many in the world. And that doesn't mean we shouldn't seek to correct the injustices of the world, that we shouldn't seek to stop pain, abuse, neglect, what have you. Nor am I making light of the plight of those less fortunate than myself. But even in the most dire of circumstances you can find those who are able to rise above and be happy in their day to day lives. Thousands of times more difficult to? Oh yes. But that's life. It's not fair.
People with clinical depression can choose happiness, as well. There are all sorts of wonderful therapists and medications out there now that can help them turn their lives around. In the long term, yes. And I suppose that is the same as we're talking about. |
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CarrieMpls said: Fauxie said: That's all too true. I do believe most naturally choose to pursue happiness, and often surely find their own happiness even amongst the most terrible hardship. Those such people don't so much choose their purpose or 'make of life what they will' but rather find the best of what they have, even if that is in fact only 'enjoying' the relief of something which may be the least of all evils in their life. It's relative, of course, and I think human beings have, on the whole, an incredible ability to endure and find scraps of happiness even in the most dire of circumstances. I think that so many do live with such hardship therefore proves how great the desire to be happy truly is. So many people do endure hardship but they do carry on. However, happiness is clearly very different for different people. It's tough on some to toss out the phrase 'you can choose your purpose' when someone's idea of happiness might be not getting raped today or for the first time in several days being able to feed their children properly. The purpose for many people is survival and so there's really very little choice involved. Circumstances, in my opinion, are way more influential than whatever drive or ambition may be alluded to in phrases like 'life is what you make of it'. To me, in the context that it's said a phrase like that comes with the understanding that drive or ambition are luxuries, and I think that's pretty much true for most of us. Try hard or don't, we're still getting by ok all the same. That's a luxury not afforded to more people than I think we'd like to believe. ... [Edited 6/14/07 4:44am] But I feel like you're suggesting that happiness has a set value, or measuring stick by which all people have to achieve a certain level to call themselves "happy". I don't think that's true. Happiness is in the eye of the beholder, so to speak. I don't think saying that diminishes the plight of, say, starving children of prostitutes in India. And of course it's unfair to measure their struggles against anothers. But, as you say, we all try hard to be happy, no matter the circumstances. I just think it's also achieveable no matter the circumstances. Well, I'm saying it's relative, and so in that sense you're right to say it's in the eye of the beholder, and for example maybe it's possible you can't truly know a happiness you've never had, but it still feels hard to say someone is happy when their idea of happiness is so vastly different. What means happiness for them may be no less happy given the context, to put it simplistically, but I can't help thinking that people under such strain and hardship are still all too aware of the relativity of it and what they could have as far as happiness under different circumstances. That they make the best of their situation doesn't convince me their happiness is completely the same as mine or that they truly have the same chance of achieving the happiness they desire that I do. What are we arguing about? It's the word happiness that causes it. In my first post I said 'it's up to you' and that fits with the word 'purpose'. Happiness brings in so many other issues. . [Edited 6/14/07 5:10am] | |
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Christaro said: Christaro said: Why are we here?
I am here to create the next grandest version of the greatest vision I will ever have about who I really am.  
  | |
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Fauxie said: CarrieMpls said: But I feel like you're suggesting that happiness has a set value, or measuring stick by which all people have to achieve a certain level to call themselves "happy". I don't think that's true. Happiness is in the eye of the beholder, so to speak. I don't think saying that diminishes the plight of, say, starving children of prostitutes in India. And of course it's unfair to measure their struggles against anothers. But, as you say, we all try hard to be happy, no matter the circumstances. I just think it's also achieveable no matter the circumstances. Well, I'm saying it's relative, and so in that sense you're right to say it's in the eye of the beholder, and for example maybe it's possible you can't truly know a happiness you've never had, but it still feels hard to say someone is happy when their idea of happiness is so vastly different. What means happiness for them may be no less happy given the context, to put it simplistically, but I can't help thinking that people under such strain and hardship are still all too aware of the relativity of it and what they could have as far as happiness under different circumstances. That they make the best of their situation doesn't convince me their happiness is completely the same as mine or that they truly have the same chance of achieving the happiness they desire that I do. What are we arguing about? It's the word happiness that causes it. In my first post I said 'it's up to you' and that fits with the word 'purpose'. Happiness brings in so many other issues. . [Edited 6/14/07 5:10am] It came from "life is what you make of it". And you said "it's up to you". And I said "whatever you want it to be". I think these are all fundamentally the same statements. So we all agree anyway, so nevermind. |
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CarrieMpls said: Fauxie said: Well, I'm saying it's relative, and so in that sense you're right to say it's in the eye of the beholder, and for example maybe it's possible you can't truly know a happiness you've never had, but it still feels hard to say someone is happy when their idea of happiness is so vastly different. What means happiness for them may be no less happy given the context, to put it simplistically, but I can't help thinking that people under such strain and hardship are still all too aware of the relativity of it and what they could have as far as happiness under different circumstances. That they make the best of their situation doesn't convince me their happiness is completely the same as mine or that they truly have the same chance of achieving the happiness they desire that I do. What are we arguing about? It's the word happiness that causes it. In my first post I said 'it's up to you' and that fits with the word 'purpose'. Happiness brings in so many other issues. . [Edited 6/14/07 5:10am] It came from "life is what you make of it". And you said "it's up to you". And I said "whatever you want it to be". I think these are all fundamentally the same statements. So we all agree anyway, so nevermind. They're all very similar, no doubt. I think 'whatever you want it to be' suggests more choice than what I said, 'it's up to you', but I think I'm just coming from an understanding of my own general thinking rather than just those few words read by anybody else.
I suppose it comes down to how much afforded choice is implied. And 'happiness'. That word makes all the difference. 'Purpose' is a word that allows more for circumstances and individuals, and I think we agree on that. Given a person's circumstances the purpose of life is whatever they believe it is. Damn you 'happiness'. I still want to kiss your cheek, Carrie.  | |
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Fauxie said: CarrieMpls said: It came from "life is what you make of it". And you said "it's up to you". And I said "whatever you want it to be". I think these are all fundamentally the same statements. So we all agree anyway, so nevermind. They're all very similar, no doubt. I think 'whatever you want it to be' suggests more choice than what I said, 'it's up to you', but I think I'm just coming from an understanding of my own general thinking rather than just those few words read by anybody else.
I suppose it comes down to how much afforded choice is implied. And 'happiness'. That word makes all the difference. 'Purpose' is a word that allows more for circumstances and individuals, and I think we agree on that. Given a person's circumstances the purpose of life is whatever they believe it is. Damn you 'happiness'. I still want to kiss your cheek, Carrie. Talk about happiness! You can kiss my cheek any time, fauxie. |
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CarrieMpls said: Fauxie said: They're all very similar, no doubt. I think 'whatever you want it to be' suggests more choice than what I said, 'it's up to you', but I think I'm just coming from an understanding of my own general thinking rather than just those few words read by anybody else.
I suppose it comes down to how much afforded choice is implied. And 'happiness'. That word makes all the difference. 'Purpose' is a word that allows more for circumstances and individuals, and I think we agree on that. Given a person's circumstances the purpose of life is whatever they believe it is. Damn you 'happiness'. I still want to kiss your cheek, Carrie. Talk about happiness! You can kiss my cheek any time, fauxie. I'm a sucker for the cheeks. Just ask Rhondab.
Or the other Rhonda for that matter.  Damn different names from yahoo to prince.org confusing me!   | |
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Before I go on, did my previous posts on 'the purpose of life' make any sense? 'Cause if they did, fair play to me, because I am wasted. 
How's my grammar? Dial 09-666-1234 | |
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Fauxie said: Before I go on, did my previous posts on 'the purpose of life' make any sense? 'Cause if they did, fair play to me, because I am wasted.
How's my grammar? Dial 09-666-1234
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 [Edited 6/14/07 6:05am] | |
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CarrieMpls said: Fauxie said: Before I go on, did my previous posts on 'the purpose of life' make any sense? 'Cause if they did, fair play to me, because I am wasted.
How's my grammar? Dial 09-666-1234
Gotta run to the corner to get more beer. Back in a bit. I'll bounce the basketball there so I'm being sporty and exercising. While I smoke a cigarette on the way.  | |
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the purpose of life in three words:
OM. NOM. NOM.  | |
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To live it. | |
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Anxiety said: the purpose of life in three words:
OM. NOM. NOM. You've got it!
Please reply to this post. Please reply to this post.  It'll save us all from a future thread that nobody here wants.
. [Edited 6/14/07 6:40am] | |
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Fauxie said: Anxiety said: the purpose of life in three words:
OM. NOM. NOM. You've got it!
Please reply to this post. Please reply to this post. It'll save us all from a future thread that nobody here wants.
. [Edited 6/14/07 6:40am] what? | |
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JustErin said: Who cares?
No, really. Why do people feel we need a reason or purpose? In my case, I would feel empty without one. | |
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Anxiety said: Fauxie said: You've got it!
Please reply to this post. Please reply to this post. It'll save us all from a future thread that nobody here wants.
. [Edited 6/14/07 6:40am] what? I was getting a complex.  | |
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Christaro said: RodeoSchro said: To make other people happy.
What about yourself? Making other people happy makes me feel better than anything else I can do. Plus, if other people are trying to make me as happy as I'm trying to make them, then we're all happy. | |
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I'm just about convinced mine is to piss people off. I do have one or two other gifts/skills to balance that out but I'm pretty sure that's what my purpose is for being here. | |
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RodeoSchro said: JustErin said: Who cares?
No, really. Why do people feel we need a reason or purpose? In my case, I would feel empty without one. What is your purpose then? | |
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JustErin said: RodeoSchro said: In my case, I would feel empty without one. What is your purpose then? To make other people happy. | |
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