but seriously. by September 11, 2003, 2004, 2005... will September 11 be little more than, say, a day off work? a hallmark holiday? a clearance sale? it's already happening. the endless commemmorations a week in advance. the handwringing and touchy-feely remembrances. why, suddenly, are we trying to recapture that feeling of goodwill toward one another for this day when last year, after it actually happened, we were back to the same old bullshit by Jan 1?

how long do you all give it before September 11 loses all its meaning?
[This message was edited Tue Sep 10 15:31:42 PDT 2002 by Aaron]

Aaron said:

If there isn't another terrorist attack soon...perhaps by the end of 2002...then I think 9/11 will not be as overdone as it has been this week and tomorrow. It will always be a day of rememberance though.

I just find it funny with all these color-coded warnings and terror alerts that obviously the adminsitration is as scared today as they were a year ago, when George W. hightailed it out of town and headed for the hills.

Damn! I've never seen anybody run like that!

Aaron, I can't picture this day as a holiday. A day of remembrance, yes. A day to give back what was given to us, yes. There are those that will never forget what was learned on Sept. 11, 2001. There are those that look at their children and know they will grow up without a mom or dad due to the events of Sept. 11th. And there are those who have closed their hearts so much that if it doesn't directly involve them, then they see it as just another day. Truth be told, it is just another day, and the past is passed, but tomorrow lives in hope and today is now. It is what you do today that will shape the direction your life takes. It's all about choices.

Do you choose to remember? Do you choose to be happy? Do you choose to go on and rise above adversity? What you choose shapes your now.

No one can say what will occur in 2003, 2004, 2005, etc. Live today not what has already occured, nor what will occur. All you can do is live your life to its fullest. You make choices, life is and your life reflects the choices you make.

To me, Sept. 11th will always signify a day in which I learned a valueable lesson. Love as deeply and as greatly as you can right now, because no one knows what tomorrow brings.
[This message was edited Tue Sep 10 15:51:48 PDT 2002 by LittleRedCorvette]

2the9s said:

Yeah, I had new found respect for the Queen Mum after this..The fact that she refused to leave her Palace back then..and we, with all our modern toys and defences had a President running around like the b*tch he is...

sad...

will we have blue light specials for 9/11? Probably, after all, this is the country that made Jerry Springer and American Idol hit shows... :O

Aaron said:

I dont think we saw the "same old bullshit" by January 1st of last year. In fact we were more changed than ever January 1st because it was New Year's and we were made even more nervous around New Year's!!


I see renewed patriotism. Not blind patriotism, but learned patriotism. I see people my age who would have laughed at some1 with an American flag on the wall, but who now have more respect for what it represents.

Patriotism, or simply finding some pride in ur country, used 2 b 4 old people in parades, now it's 4 every1.

I think my generation in particular, has grown up distrusting the government. Our parents witnessed Vietnam and Nixon, we witnessed Bill Clinton and how he lied 2 us. We've seen Enron. In our 18-some-odd years we have lived we have seen plenty of reasons not 2 trust our government. Yet now, we have plenty of reasons 2 go out there and change it, and not just wear "anarchy" shirts
and sit around whining about it with a guitar in hand like we're Nirvana or something.

So I think ur wrong, Aaron, I think shit has changed. Yes, certain things we'll never get rid of (Hugh Hefner ) because of certain people who r way too liberal and wish 2 set us back, but...it's not hopeless.

.
[This message was edited Tue Sep 10 16:57:24 PDT 2002 by Nep2nes]

let me preface this response by saying that at times during this post, i've gotten off on a rant that really has nothing to do with you, Nep2nes. but please, bare with me.

Nep2nes said:

what you see phonies that think putting the flag out makes them a great american. that giving up civil rights to John Ashcroft under the guise of the "war on terror" will make us safer. what you see is the winner of American Idol performing at a 9/11 ceremony.



is it? or do you just think it is? the other day you said that you'd heard that the number of people going into the military was up after September 11 and the year since. it hasn't. so are you seeing these things or do you just think that you see them? are you experiencing this yourself, or do you just think you are? if you are, i'm glad for you. that's great.

as for me, for the months following September 11th, i had that new sense of pride. but in the early months of 2002, i came off that buzz. it's like when i got back from Xenophobia. Prince could do no wrong. but you know, that great positive idealism fades once a person pulls their head out of their ass and sees what's actually going on around them again. last summer, it was shark attacks. this summer, it's child abductions. both minor stories that are fairly infrequent, but it's the story that the media's latched onto. does this really serve us? nothing has changed. we become desensitized to what we see over and over. shark attacks, kidnapped children, this week it'll be the world trade center. nothing has changed. we sensationalize a story for a few weeks, get our jollies off of it, and move on to something else. the feeding-frenzy this week is nothing more. they're saying that they're doing it to remember the day and what happened. question: who could forget? the story is STILL ON THE FRONT PAGE a year later. for many many weeks after 9/11/01, we were told that we need to move on with our lives, go about our business, remember the dead, remember what happened, but keep on living. that's what i've done anyway. it's only been a year. did they really expect us to forget? so soon? you know, a couple of weeks ago, there were some specials on to remember the day Princess Diana died 5 years ago. THAT i understand. time has passed. there is perspective on it 5 years later. the date of her death is soemthing people might forget. and may need to take a moment of pause to reflect on all that went on at that time. the media-frenzy, the loss of life, the sense of loss by millions of people around the world who didn't even know her. maybe 5 years from now, some of this might be needed. when we have a clearer picture. when the memory *might* have faded. as it is, we are simultaneously of two minds, collectively. 1) the need to wallow in the moment this week and tomorrow and 2) getting back to regular life, focusing on the bullshit that always catches our attention.

and that is what bothers me about this week. we're turning into bullshit like the frenzy over American Idol. shark attacks. Gary Condit. Monica Lewinsky. Susan Smith. JonBenet Ramsey. we're cheapening it. i understand the need for people to relive that grief. but wall-to-wall coverage on every channel? it's nauseating. yes, i'll watch some of it. and i cannot stand people that say "i don't want to see this anymore!" there are so many of them. on the radio, on tv, in the papers and magazines saying they just don't want to relive that day. fuck those people. that's bullshit. they better damn well face up to it. remember what happened. relive the day they saw that. poor pitiful people, so fragile that they're sick of it. those people need to butch up.

that said, the way that things are happening are taking this moment that we NEED to remember and DO remember (as i said, it's only been a year... who's forgotten?) and it's turning into the story of the week. do you know how many networks are going to avoid showing the actual event? they're tip-toeing around it. not showing the planes going into the buildings, the towers falling, the people running through the street as a cloud of soot chases them through a chasm of buildings. THAT is what we need to see tomorrow. we don't need to see umpteen shows remembering the dead, people holding hands, candle-light vigils. all of that is bullshit. WE REMEMBER THEM! what we need to remember is what was done to us. what we have to do. how this event has changed and shaped us. did it bring us together? yes. for a time. but i'm much happier since we've become splintered again. democracy is never strong when the people are blinded by a sense of patriotism. and the most shallow, superficial kinds of patriotism at that.




what exactly are YOU doing? everyone does their own thing, Nep2nes. for you to criticize people who wear those shirts or play a guitar to express themselves is completely out of line. we're all our own people. not all of us are goose-stepping in line with this patriotism thing. people have real concerns. and people use what they've got (their music) to express them. what do you expect the Nirvana-kids to do? what are YOU doing?



look up the word "liberal" little girl.

and what's wrong with Hef?

twonabomber said:

He gives us naked ladies, for fuck's sake! There's nothing wrong with that.

Everyone seems pretty split on how to acknowledge Sep 11. I guess something is better than nothing. It would seem pretty cold if we let it pass by this year like any other day.

We can't have freedom if we're always living in fear.

Aaron I lost a treasured family member on 9/11 and i find your treatment of the subject to be saddening and disrespectful to the victims and their families...9/11 will never be a holiday...thousands of people dead is nothing to celebrate...at least not to me

Christ i understand flaming, jockeying, and hijacking threads but this fucking insane...



At least respect the fact that men and women jumped from the towers out of fear and terror because a culture of hate decided to take action for "GOD".


I attended a wedding in Manhatten 11 months befor the attacks. My friend lost her husband 1 month shy of their year anniversary.


Two of my families life long friends went down in the rubble never to be found.


The memory of Sept 11, will be honored by me today by sitting atop a peak alone.


Try to atleast be respectful of the loss and pain caused to thousands.

There was a woman on tv this morning who said it's nice that we are remembering 9/11, but after this just let the victim's families move on. They don't want to go through this every year.

I think it's a good idea if they all feel this way. That way we won't feel bad if we don't make a big thing out of it. It's one of those "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situations. The whole thing just sucks

AprilMichelle said:

as you may or may not guess, Aaron really doesn't care. however, the media at the time were treating it as such. his comment was about that. not that we shouldn't remember.