applekisses said:

But if they qualified for stamps, would you think less of them for getting them? Why SHOULD they go without? If a few more dollars a month were available to them for buying food for their families, why shouldn't they try to get it?

Nikster said:

terrance stamp gotta eat too!

FunkMistress said:

Of course I wouldn't think less of them for getting the stamps...if they really needed them...I would, however, think less of them if they got foodstamps and had a $350 purse, diamond earrings, designer clothing, a new computer, a cell phone, and a brand-new car.

FunkMistress said:

exactly. i know people got their pride and all but damn if you got kids and they got to eat then....and just because some mothers get foodstamps does not mean they don't sacrifice for their kids. i've gone many of winters without a decent coat.

apples sweetie, I see your point but speaking as someone who has been in that boat let me give you some insight.

it's hard, yes to be a single ( no matter how you got that way)parent. I worked, I had a job and I went to school.
my parents were old and they bought me things....clothing for me and my child, appliances etc. I remember working with someone who felt the way you did. she said I don't have a decent car and you are on WIC and foodstamps why you got a car. I asked her why she was so mad at me....why did my having something nice threaten her so, why did it seem like I was cheating her--personally when she didn't know my circumstances.
yes i know I boasted in a post above about food stamp fraud. But I tried it the right way working hard not making it student loans due, papers served and then I found out that I could get the help, the limited help. There are rules and time limits on the qualification. It is called AFDC Aid for Families with Dependent children. I got free medical care for my daughter, not me I was indigent, I got WIC and foodstamps for my daughter, we ate very well, but I had no money for clothing, shoes etc...my mother bought that stuff for me, what little money I made went to bills, rent, electric gas etc..they bought me my car while I was in high school. I was raised middle class, but I didn't hate the people who were on assistance. I didn't get mad at them for having some nice things, why can't they have nice things? I know the mental hardache and the tears. My mom bought me things that I sold so I could pay a bill, I am not proud of that but I did it. she saw the struggle so she bought me nice things beautiful things that I kept and I wore to the store using my WIC and foodstamps.

...please try and understand that everyone deserves luxuries sometimes. don't take it personal.

butterfli25 said:

Thanks for taking the time to explain this...and being so kind to me even though I lost my temper.
I guess I just was raised to be more practical...there were times when I was in college and collecting cans and bottles on campus (we have a deposit on them in Michigan) and returning them for money so I could have gas for my old, raggedy car and there were times when my relatives who were better off would give me things that were a little more expensive...but, if I had the opportunity, I returned them either for the money (if I could) or for lesser expensive neccessities.
Being raised working-class puts a work-ethic from hell into you...I think that's where this is coming from. Plus, my parents are older than most people's my age and they lived during the Great Depression...that also shapes the way I see things. My Italian grandmother raised 10 kids during the depression by herself (after my grandfather was killed) and didn't even speak English. She took in washing.
I don't know...I guess I come from stubborn stock.

Wow. This thread got really fucked up.

Where to begin.....


It is possible that the people seen spending stamps with a 350 dollar purse bought those stamps from someone who was on welfare. Not that it makes it right, but still.

It is possible that the person who has nice things might of fell down on their luck and had to get on welfare and had nice things before it happened. Would it make people feel better if they sold those nice things?

I have been fortunate enough to not have to depend on government assistance for the last fifteen years. My tax dollars go to fund social programs including welfare and I don't give a moment's thought to whether or not people are abusing the system. My bigger concern is what the government wastes my money on like unjust wars and a totally unnecessary space program.

If it comforts anyone, the government is cutting federal spending on Medicare and Medicaid. I wouldn't expect anyone's taxes to drop though.

Stymie said:

yes, these things are possible...and I will say again, I am not against government aid for those who really need it. I just think people should live within their means. Here's another example...my work is non-profit hospital system and we do A LOT of work for the uninsured and people who are down on their luck. We have a holiday party every year and adopt families (it was 70 this year) and our employees buy and donate enough basic foods and enough for a holiday dinner as well as clothes and toys for each family. I know how to make a dollar stretch, so I collected and shopped for our department's family this year. I had about $200 for a family of five and got them all nice things, but at a discount.
There is another department across the hall from us who adopted a family from our domestic abuse shelter...the mother of the family wrote a "want/need list" and put things like -- a manicure and pedicure for her 15-year-old daughter and a laptop computer and lessons for another daughter and a bike for her son. Give me a break!

applekisses said:

Maybe those are the things her kids asked for. Sometimes kids don't ask for what they need but what they want. I think that's the one time of year where kids should something they want, not just what they need.

We don't agree on this issue and some of it makes me sad but I still respect what you have to say.

Stymie said:

My point exactly! There was an old man (an amputee) who was sitting in front of a grocery store trying to get people to sign a petition to stop madicaid/medicare cuts. But, my city has found the money to build a new stadium! It seems like the government helps fuel classism buy pitting worker against worker when we are all in the same crab pot. My sister gets food stamps (and yeah, I buy em' so she can have the money for her car payment!), and goes to school for nursing, but she works for FedEx making 10 dollars an hour and 15hrs a week. I make 10 dollars an hr but I clock 40 hrs a week. I don't get paid day care, I don't get food stamps I don't even get insurance that I can afford and my son is on (the soon to be cut) Medicaid. We are still struggling. For the things I don't get for free, I pay for and live frugally. For the things my sister gets for "free" she has to make almost no income to keep those things. Crabs in a barrel ya'll...

Welfare is no longer allowed to be a lifestyle as it once was (if that's what people are afraid of). I appreciate all who commented. This is a real issue.
[Edited 1/21/06 13:33pm]

DON'T
GET
ME
STARTED
ON
FOOD
STAMPS
PLEASE.

Stymie said:

(thanks for the hug )
Hon...in most respects, we do agree...people who need help should get it...and I understand giving kids things they "want" during the holidays...the family I shopped for got lots of toys...a little cd player and an x-mas cd and some other fun things...however, I'm a 34-year-old woman with a college education and a job and I've never had a manicure or pedicure or a laptop computer (and I don't own a bike at the moment) because I know I can't afford these things and spend my money on practical things. I'm not getting down on people for being poor or down on their luck (God knows I've been both) I'm getting down on them for their choices...their failure to give up materialism and expensive, un-necessary luxuries while they're struggling to feed themselves and their families.

DynamicSavior said:

DynamicSavior said:

Rant pending!

DynamicSavior said:

START! START!

AnotherLoverToo said:

*cracks knuckles*
The other night at my job, this man had a $34 order, and proceeded to pay with 4 different Access cards. That shit bothered me for real. And he uses them ALL the time. When the time came for him to pay, he looked at me and said:
"Okay, so how do I use this machine?"
Muthafucka, use cash. I hate that shit. People use those damn cards 890109326509281908750931857480932458 times a day and then wanna act fucking stupid. Either they "don't know how to use the machine." or they "don't know how much is on my card." And wanna ask me. NO go*dammit. Then when they don't have any money on their card, they run out to their Mercedes/Porshce/Lamborghini and get the money, or they'll hold my line up trying to use their broke ass card, then say "okay, I'll just pay with cash." and pull out a fucking WAD of $20's. What the fuck is going on?

DynamicSavior said:

So, is there a rule where you are only allowed to accept one foodstamp/ACCESS card per customer or you check ID or something when this happens? If a cashier suspects fraud, is there a number to call?

well, i read the thread... and its sad.


its sad that there are people in this community that would rather talk down to a person who needs some help than to understand how THAT person must feel. do you think a person who gets food stamps is actually HAPPY about it ???? do you think they ENJOY where their life is at that moment ???? have you ever heard a child say, "when i grow up, i wanna be on food stamps." of course you havent. maybe instead of passing judgement, or saying we dont have time to deal with them in a checkout line... we should just respect the fact that that person is doing what they can for now, and let them lead their own life. i bet if someone came and peeked into YOUR personal life, they could dig up things to talk shit on you about..... and you dont want that, now do you ?


try to understand that a womans purse, the foodstamp card shes carrying, the wad of 20's in their pocket, or the car they drive does not define a person. but the attitude you have DOES check yourself... and work it out, and God help you if you ever find yourself in that position
[Edited 1/20/06 16:56pm]

AnotherLoverToo said:

Nope. Only with credit cards.

XxAxX said:

sorry that reply was really cut short. i'm sorry i didn't make myself clearer about what i mean. i don't at all disrespect you and your partner and i misread your particular situation. although i do think single women who can't afford to raise a child should not have chhildren until they can afford them, i think there is nothing wrong with being down on one's luck and i would be willing to pay more taxes knowing the money would be going to programs that help people in need. the only taxes i really mind paying are war dollars. and that pisses me off big time. but that's another issue entirely.

what i don't like is when money intended for food is traded for 'luxury' items -- that is non necessities - at a devalued rate. when someone sells a food access card worth 25$ for a cash consideration of 15-20$, that's a shame. and if the cash is used for something like designer clothes that seems inappropriate to me. maybe it's me. there's a good chance i'm turning into an irritable crank in my old age

XxAxX said:

This is the part I don't understand, X. What did you misread about her situation? What difference would it have made if she was an unwed mother or if she planned her kids? It has nothing to do with what is being talked about here and sounds like a generalization to me.

FunkMistress said:

Really, though, if someone can't afford to feed their family and they have to go on assistance to do so, perhaps giving up the luxury of a cell phone, cable, etc., would better assist them in providing for their family on their own or, at the very least, without having to ask for as much assistance.

I have been down and out and I never went on assistance, by choice and, instead, I went without because I was capable of giving up certain luxuries to just get by. I had the foil wrapped rabbit ears to get all of two stations in, I ate next to nothing and when I did have money I lived on egg noodles and jam, peanut butter sandwiches on cheap bread, and Ramen Noodles, until eating that shit made you want to vomit. I sold anything of value to pay my utilites. I know many people who've done this.

I've also known many people who are so down and out that there is nothing else to give up and they really need the assistance. These people aren't sporting cell phones and can't get MTV and the Food Network. They aren't carrying a Coach bag on their arm and they don't have brand name clothing and aren't carrying their groceries out to a vehicle that can actually run without sputtering.

The unfortunate thing is there are many people out there trying to make it on their own, working and barely scraping by, and do need the assistance, but, because they're working they make too much and they system can't help them. These are the people standing in the checkout line purchasing Ramen Noodles with their last dime to feed their family something while the person in front of them is using their Bridge Card out of their Coach purse, flashing the gold hanging from their fingers, because they were gifts, and buying steak and shrimp for dinner.

If the cell phone is a gift, tell the giver you'd rather have the cash to make ends meet.

I didn't even know people bought food stamps off of people like that.

CinisterCee said:

It's really big with the druggies.

I used to be friends with this guy a couple of years ago until he decided to dabble in heroin and got hooked. Just after the holidays he called me (thanks to a friend having his head up his ass and giving out my number) and asked me if I wanted to buy an $83 Bridge card off of him for $20. Thought of me, ya know, wanted to help me out because I had children, it was all about helping me. I said no.

About three hours later he calls and asks me if I want to buy some speakers off of him. You know, 'cause I like music.

Luckily, he's going to jail soon for check forgery.

Mazurack said:

The old pull-yourself-up-by-the-bootstraps, I-did-it-so-anyone-can argument. This thread has, at the very least, started screaming of classism.

Who does things like your scenario? 1 to maybe 5% of the people on welfare. Once again, these people who have this card may not even be on welfare, just buying the use of the card. some folks sell part of the value of the card to add on to the rent payment.

Anybody with an argument on the thread ever been on assistance? Do you guys know how much these people even get?

Stymie said:

That wasn't what I was saying. A lot of people are more capable than what they'd like to admit.


Decided to make it quite a bit shorter in length.
[Edited 1/20/06 21:16pm]
[Edited 1/20/06 21:17pm]

Stymie said:

I don't think that was their point, tho...welfare is a goverment system that can be easily manipulated by those who have the desire to do so. It can also be seen as a source of income...that's a very easy mindset to fall into, no matter what. The amount you get doesn't matter...

And probably one of the worst things we could ever do to any human being is help them believe that they can not control their own lives, no matter how destitute they become. And yes, I've been on food stamps before, and I've been at the point of eviction before and literally tearing apart my 12 year old Honda just to find spare change for a gallon of gas, and yes, I've worked 19 hour work days six days a week where I had to walk an hour and a half between jobs because I couldn't afford bus fare...and once I became manager I had next to no sympathy for my employees who couldn't show up on time because of one "Thing" or another, not when I used to walk 5 miles to work in the rain and still showed up for my shift with 10 minutes to spare.

I know all about being ridiculously poor, and I know how much your mindset determines what you do and the decisions you make. It doesn't do anybody any good to pretend otherwise.

Byron said:

I'm sorry, but that reminded me of those stories that Bill Cosby used to tell his kids on the Cosby Show.

DynamicSavior said:

I never mentioned walking to school in a blizzard..uphill...both ways...

Byron said:

What about your grandfather who built a 12 room house made of sticks and twigs on the swamp, and he didn't even want it.