matt said:

I remember that. It almost sounds noble -except for PETA stating that the idea was to de-glamourize fur; to make it unappealing by associating it with homelessness. The results may have been good, but some of the ideals behind that move left me with a bad taste in my mouth.
[Edited 11/5/05 20:40pm]

meow85 said:

I wasn't aware of the "de-glamourize" thing... but it makes sense. That's par for the course for PeTA.

matt said:

I don't waste my time on anything they do. Just a bunch of stupid, reactionary tactics. God forbid they approach the cause with a bit of maturity and tact. Who knows? They might even change a few minds that way.

Anxiety said:

Or sanity. Unless you want to restrict yourself to the "vegetarian ghetto" of foods and restaurants that explicitly claim to be vegetarian, sometimes you have to let things slide. For instance, when I was reading ingredient labels, I'd often find "mystery ingredients." I was able to memorize a few that are always or sometimes animal-derived, but sometimes I'd have no clue, shrug my shoulders, and throw it in the shopping cart. And I have no idea what can be described as "natural flavors."

Also, restaurants can be a bit of a challenge. My job occasionally involves business meals, and I was careful not to do or say anything that could make the other person(s) uncomfortable or defensive. This was especially true in the case of clients... they were paying a lot of money for my services, and I didn't think it was appropriate to give unsolicited ethical advice. (I am convinced that not a single author of a "How to Live a Vegetarian Life" book has been vegetarian while holding down a white-collar job.)

Ultimately I gave it up for the sake of my physical health. However, it wasn't good for my mental health either... sometimes it felt like having an eating disorder. Perhaps this wouldn't have been a problem if I let things slide more often, but it was (and is) hard for me to do that. To quote Prince, "I always take a simple thing and push it way too far."

meow85 said:

PeTA seems to take the position that their publicity stunts are necessary to call attention to the issues that concern them. And I'm sure they've "converted" some people that way. But I wonder... how many people have they alienated? In the end, are they doing more harm than good?

On a somewhat related note, I found the following in their FAQ, and I think it's a total cop-out:

“Where does the animal rights movement stand on abortion?”

There are people on both sides of the abortion issue in the animal rights movement, just as there are people on both sides of animal rights issues in the pro-life movement. And just as the pro-life movement has no official position on animal rights, the animal rights movement has no official position on abortion.

Sorry, but if they're going to take the position that "[a]nimals should have the right to equal consideration of their interests," then I'd like to know why a fetus doesn't deserve equal consideration of its interests.

(For the record, I guess you could call me pro-choice. I have no problem with aborting a clump of cells. And as a matter of policy, I think it's best to have legal abortion available. However, I submit that there are ethical issues that come into play when aborting a late-term fetus.)

meow85 said:

It would only be "deglamorizing" to shallow fashionistas... It makes me think of Neanderthals living in caves - needing fur to keep warm and survive. Homeless people are living on that very basic subsistence level, so that makes good sense to look after them in that way.

I find it kind. Who cares about the aesthetics of the whole issue.

matt said:

I know what you're saying. I certainly have to make some concessions here in meat and dairy-obsessed France. I can't be rude to people at meals, most friends know my habits and are willing to compromise somewhat so I meet them half-way.

Heiress said:

I decided I'm going to start out slow with the veggie thing. Test the waters, so to speak.

I never ate pork to begin with, so that was easy enough. And I don't eat much red meat, either. I'll start with cutting out poultry and see how I can work it from there. Start taking supplements and eating more protein alternatives to make up for it.

I'm not giving up dairy for anything though. I need ice cream to surive. Kinda like oxygen.

meow85 said:

Beans will give you a lot of calcium and protein.

Mexicans rarely have bone problems as a result.

matt said:

so there would be nothing wrong with eating road kill either?

nilegettolrahc said:

some people do that!

Heiress said:

SOME people eat their own placentas too

nilegettolrahc said:

yeah, i've done all kinds of things that people call "crunchy..." but that was a bit extreme for me.

Heiress said:

deep fried tarantula looks very crunchy

nilegettolrahc said:

"crunchy" is in reference to "crunchy granola..." eating your placenta is kind of a hippy thing.

Heiress said:

oh. we don't have granola here. we only got cheerios 2 months ago

nilegettolrahc said:

ah, so you're not a real hippy... because if you were, you'd make your OWN granola. my mom used to.

Heiress said:

I am not a hippy in ANY sense of the word

Heiress said:

Improves your musical skills too.

nilegettolrahc said:

And there you go.

meow85 said:

That's a white person problem.

Heiress said:

Glad I only look white then.

meow85 said:

So you're like the reverse of a chestnut?

Heiress said:

Well that's one way to put it.