DexMSR said:

There is no such thing as inheirent roles. My relationship and how I am in that relationship has nothng to do with my vagina. I am a human being interacting with another human being and there is nothing I need to be appreciative or grateful about. He's not doing me a favor

I don't let anyone define who I am in this world. I define myself
[Edited 5/25/05 9:12am]

DexMSR said:

There is no such thing as inheirent roles. My relationship and how I am in that relationship has nothng to do with my vagina. I am a human being interacting with another human being and there is nothing I need to be appreciative or grateful about. He's not doing me a favor

I don't let anyone define who I am in this world. I define myself
[Edited 5/25/05 9:12am]

Janfriend said:

So very true!

DexMSR said:

Dex, honey, don't get yourself all riled up!!

You have started a thread that you admit generalizes just to get a rise out of people. You have literally giggled and accused women on this thread of either being unintelligent, illiterate, being lesbians or destined to be alone if they didn't agree with you. Yeah, I aimed my comments at YOU, rather than generalizing that "all black men who live in California" think like you.

And here we go on your frustration about your past and being alone (your words)

"When I was in my long term relationship, I would surprise her with a cd of her favorite artist...bought concert tickets to a show I had no intention on going, but bought it for her and her girl to go....little notes on the windshield for her to see on the way to work....but got none of that in return...she was a sensual and sexual abyss....there were no intimacies....but she did attempt to cook when it was something she was not used to...but I can cook."

"I think I will choose to not have an American woman in my midst when it is all said and done because they just are not (NOT ALL) fine tuned anymore as to what it means to nurture their man. This thread is great and has opened my eyes to alot, but I am pretty much done"

You're doin' a lot of talkin' and generalizing about how American women don't measure up. Instead of focusing on them and crying about it, pointing fingers, you go out there and be a "man" and get yourself that woman you want!! But recognize that your issues about American women are probably about YOU, honey bunny.

sag10 said:

Well sorry to let you in on this little tidbit, man and woman are not the same..never will be the same due to simple physiological makeups by God's grand design. Nature has it that you are indeed the matriarchs and nurtures, so when you have that child, you will see this. You don't have to cater to your man, or make him feel appreciated or anything if that is what moves you, but it still will not and can not take away the simple fact that men and women will never ever be the same.

thank you for a very good thread....

THANK YOU ALL FOR A VERY GOOD THREAD!!

quote]


But wait...this is the same guy talking about not being commited to a relationship.....that makes me wonder....why do you care, boo?

DexMSR said:

Well....

Do you think it would be fair to say that some of the perceptions with regard to women caring for their men in more traditional manners are perceived as lax due to to the growing of number of households where women are the sole and/or primary bread winners of the household?

Do you think that inferiority complexes and/or ego's may also generate some of this perception?

Do you think that men have encouraged this by enouraging women to go outside of the home to work? For as many men as there are that say that a feminist movement is behind the change of mindset...there are just as many men that say ..... if my woman wants to suport the household...I'll hold it down at home. And in those instances how do you view the nurturing distribution?

Don't get me wrong... I'm probably as old fashioned when it comes to home as a woman can get. . . .but by the same token I still see relationships as a two way street and a commitment. In a world where men are quick to cite rational for not marrying in a committed relationship it stills seems to be the perception that the lack of traditional values fall on the shoulders of the women. Isn't that a contradiction of sorts? Where do you see as starting point for the breakdown of traditional roles in a familial setting?

As for the women being alone.....sometimes alone allows you the opportunity to see what you value and what you expect a man to bring to the relationship as well. Alone isn't always a bad thing... there are many people in relationships today that feel more alone than those that physically are.

Such an interesting thread in so many ways . . . .

I contend that it's the lack of foundation building that allows relationships to get to the point of break-down .... communication..... truly is key. Because after the love and after the hellacious sex..... after the cuddling ...there has to be a means of communicating with regard to values, and ethics and morals and roles within the relationship.....

the bottom line for me is this... regardless of who cooks the meal on any particular day I believe its more important that you dine together.....not in passing as one enters and upon the others exodus.....

And no matter who wakes the other in the midst of sleep to say i need you and i want you.... the receptiveness of the other to respond to his/her partners needs supercedes the onset of foreplay and the focus on which gender initated it....

Mutual respect and communication ....and the man will know that he is respected and loved and important and so will his woman .....and knowing that without having to have those words uttered in my opinion is the starting point ..... its all about being clear on what you want in your union....but in all fairness.... unions are unique and not all inclusive on any level just as some men look to be nurtured ... many others love to generate it.....

my again

toffee said:

Solaris said:

wha? u want sum o' dis chris

American women, in as general a way as you are referring to them, have developed survival insticts that drive them to pursue their careers and goals with such voracity and diligence that, in many cases, leave their men feeling neglected and perhaps even a bit jealous. It's not a purposeful thing, but it stems from, IMO, having watched their mothers, sisters, aunts and friends be left (by American Men) with little or nothing. American woman have learned, from American Men, that they must be prepared to fend for themselves - they must be proactive in ensuring their OWN survival. For without them, there would be no children; there would be NO MEN.

Perhaps American women are spread too thin and their beloved counterparts should step up to the plate and offer more assistance. Perhaps AMERICAN MEN should stop playing the victim - stop moping and whining about what they are not getting and realize how precious, and UNselfish, their women truly are. Perhaps American men should give more of themselves and meet their women 1/2 way.

Quite possibly, if American women were not taxed with the responsibility of raising their children AND their husbands/mates (you call it "nurturing"), they would not be so emotionally and physically drained at the end of the day and could offer their American men the kind of attention they seem to miss so dearly.

What is it with American women?

Grab a mirror

American women, in as general a way as you are referring to them, have developed survival insticts that drive them to pursue their careers and goals with such voracity and diligence that, in many cases, leave their men feeling neglected and perhaps even a bit jealous. It's not a purposeful thing, but it stems from, IMO, having watched their mothers, sisters, aunts and friends be left (by American Men) with little or nothing. American woman have learned, from American Men, that they must be prepared to fend for themselves - they must be proactive in ensuring their OWN survival. For without them, there would be no children; there would be NO MEN.

Perhaps American women are spread too thin and their beloved counterparts should step up to the plate and offer more assistance. Perhaps AMERICAN MEN should stop playing the victim - stop moping and whining about what they are not getting and realize how precious, and UNselfish, their women truly are. Perhaps American men should give more of themselves and meet their women 1/2 way.

Quite possibly, if American women were not taxed with the responsibility of raising their children AND their husbands/mates (you call it "nurturing"), they would not be so emotionally and physically drained at the end of the day and could offer their American men the kind of attention they seem to miss so dearly.

What is it with American women?

Grab a mirror

American women, in as general a way as you are referring to them, have developed survival insticts that drive them to pursue their careers and goals with such voracity and diligence that, in many cases, leave their men feeling neglected and perhaps even a bit jealous. It's not a purposeful thing, but it stems from, IMO, having watched their mothers, sisters, aunts and friends be left (by American Men) with little or nothing. American woman have learned, from American Men, that they must be prepared to fend for themselves - they must be proactive in ensuring their OWN survival. For without them, there would be no children; there would be NO MEN.

Perhaps American women are spread too thin and their beloved counterparts should step up to the plate and offer more assistance. Perhaps AMERICAN MEN should stop playing the victim - stop moping and whining about what they are not getting and realize how precious, and UNselfish, their women truly are. Perhaps American men should give more of themselves and meet their women 1/2 way.

Quite possibly, if American women were not taxed with the responsibility of raising their children AND their husbands/mates (you call it "nurturing"), they would not be so emotionally and physically drained at the end of the day and could offer their American men the kind of attention they seem to miss so dearly.

What is it with American women?

Grab a mirror

In all of my travels I have come to the conclusion that American women just don't understand that while pursuing their careers and goals they must not abandon their role in actually "being" a woman to their men. I am all for equality from a societal standpoint; I'd never deny them what they should all have freely and unconditionally.

Somebody tell me how is it I can travel abroad to what has been at least 15 or so countries now and only here do our women not stand as firmly behind their men and do what is necessary for the relationship to thrive? American women are way too focussed on getting ahead in careers and doing it alone more than they are willing to do it for their male counterparts and being there for them.

Please understand if you have a deadbeat sorry ass man in your midst, then you must do what you have to do to get rid of that tired shit, but what about your thriving relationship? Are you really doing what a woman should do to keep your man?

I know for as well as I could explain this there will still be some of you that take this completely out of context...just know, if you are not answering the post as I stated it...I will just ignore it...I am not here for a war of words...just dialogue.

DexMSR said:

Women....always making a simple thing....COMPLEX!

And for the post that stated "I would never commit to a relationship"...Um...I never said that...I said I would never get married, but that is another thread that I have created already.

Gina, very excellent post on being the head of a single parent household, but the stats on our people with single moms is staggering, and for those of you holding it down within this "category"....much props. Sista...this thread was not created with Single Moms in mind.

It was simply created to make you all examine your "role" within your relationships, marriage, or whatever...plain and simple. And sorry to say, there "are" roles we all play in relationships, traditional or otherwise. Sorry to let you all in on that little tidbit.

DexMSR said:

Hmmmmm... not sure out of all the posts in this thread how I got singled out... but coming from you ...I'm honored Dex

Like you ... I love both views - it's a learning experience...and truthfully being an independent woman in today's world, I think it an advantage to know the broad scope of the male viewpoint and what their thoughts on roles, etc are.

I think you know from being at my home this past year that my ass probably nurtures more than I should... whether we're speaking in terms of my Mother, my Son...and/or Guests in my home. Having said that, I have also been on the other end of things where I nurtured too much in my relationship, and I believe in my heart that being too understanding and coddling too much is much of the reason that my marriage ended in divorce. See, while men love to be nurtured...sometimes it allows them to become lax... and there is a fine line (follow me)

Women have much to learn with regard to the workings of the male mind, and ego as is the case vice versa....but Dex .... don't you think that when two people embark upon a committed unity that all these things are expressed and that within itself is part of the determination of whom we choose to call partner...soulmate.... ? You don't find that in a country nor in a mindset ... you find that within yourself when you're clear on what you are looking for and when you select someone and they in return select you... and THAT differs from person to person.

It's interesting...but again... views are views and thoughts are thoughts.... my purpose in posting was not to change yours nor to validate myself in any way ...merely to share a view from the other vantage point.

but your post tells me that you hear me and that... is all i ever wanted and you never need to be sorry for "letting me in" on YOUR perspective dex.... just understand that your letting me in doesn't mean that's the philosophy I'll adopt as my own ... Damn I lubz me some you!!! _whap!_

STILL A GREAT AND WONDERFUL THREAD AND I PERSONALLY APPLAUD EACH AND EVERY BEAUTIFUL MIND THAT HAS POSTED!!!

DexMSR said:

What is THAT supposed to mean?






(only kidding )

Fleshofmyflesh said:

I'm really gonna have to FUCK YOU UP!!.....Whap whap whap!!

DexMSR said:

Ouch!
Wasn't two enough ?!?!

Fleshofmyflesh said:

Are you asking or telling?.....whap whap whap whap!!!

DexMSR said:

Telling!

Fleshofmyflesh said:

OK!

Whap...just one then....

DexMSR said:

Turns out you were right.
Three felt better.