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Printablebillyjackbitch said: JoweeCoco said: Then the question still remains, why not get married? If it's true love and you have a good relationship you can only benefit from a marriage...right? What benefit is there that puts MORE value on the relationship? And I thought this forum was about "Why we marry?" and not "Why we don't get married"? I find it very interesting that people say that in a relationship between two people all that really matters is how they feel about eachother. As if we human beings are not influenced by those close to us or even society in general. The question why not get married I thought was only fair. If you state you have a certain preference I don't see what's wrong with asking why that is. Either marriage does matter or it doesn't. You can't say it doesn't matter, but then also add to that you'd rather not get married. That to me sounds like it would be a burden to the two of you. In that case marriage would obviously matter very much. | |
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Byron said: CalhounSq said: I hear you Byron  But the everyday living situation isn't to be ignored in my book. That kinda shit eats away @ you over time when you're constantly getting on each others nerves...I guess I see finding true love as being different than "falling in love"...all sorts of variables can make you feel like you've fallen in love, but only the most profound and deepest of feelings/connectons lead to the type of love I think is required to enter into marriage and guarantee it's health... Think of it this way...imagine you just got hired for the perfect job for you...one that deals in an area that is your passion and obsession...the type of field that you'd gladly work in for free, even would pay someone to do this work...yet here you are, being paid (and paid well) to do what you love, something that makes time fly and literally makes you happy and eager to wake up and head into work...Wonderful company, great co-workers, and a boss who seems fair, intelligent and reasonable... Now...if you were to find that type of job...would you REALLY fear taking that job because, well, the lunch hours aren't long enough??...Because the yearly raises aren't high enough...because the Xmas bonus isn't big enough??...Would you find yourself wanting to quit because the drive into work is too long?? The things you worry about are indeed valid...but they tend to only be valid when there's other, more important and profound things missing from the love and connection we have with the person we're thinking of committing to...Trust me, if you find that deep and real of a connection with someone, you won't be bothered one iota if they clip their toenails in the livingroom...lol...the things you fear will start to get on your nerves will no longer exist within your being...you'll realize just how little they really matter when you're within what you consider your "greatest love"... Well said as always Byron I'm not convinced a love like THAT is in the cards for me though. I hope it is, but then reality sets in & I know I may either be alone for the rest of it OR settle if I'm desperate enough. Hopefully, neither of those will end up being the case. We'll see...  I never met you, but I LOVE you & I will forever!! Thank you for being YOU - my little Princey, the best to EVER do it | |
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JoweeCoco said: billyjackbitch said: What benefit is there that puts MORE value on the relationship? And I thought this forum was about "Why we marry?" and not "Why we don't get married"? I find it very interesting that people say that in a relationship between two people all that really matters is how they feel about eachother. As if we human beings are not influenced by those close to us or even society in general. The question why not get married I thought was only fair. If you state you have a certain preference I don't see what's wrong with asking why that is. Either marriage does matter or it doesn't. You can't say it doesn't matter, but then also add to that you'd rather not get married. That to me sounds like it would be a burden to the two of you. In that case marriage would obviously matter very much. No you see, that is you putting words in my mouth. Just because I can name all kinds of reasons why I don't want to go to Afganistan for my holiday, doesn't mean I am also obligated to state all the reasons why should go there. I am sorry that you think that we as human beings are influenced by those close to us. Don't get me wrong. I think we all are, but that doesn't count for all subjects. And it is not a burden. It just doesn't make any sense. It is not a burden for me to drive a mercedes either, but you don't see me pay huge amounts of money for a Mercedes, just because some people just so happen to drive it. That is like having kids. Many women have kids...and still there are women who choose not to have kids. Simple. It is THAT simple. So again: let's agree to disagree  | |
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I married my greatest love, at least I think so. He is my best friend.
With him I can be myself and he doesn't feel I should change and I don't want him to change. I mean we both can grow together. I don't tell him everything what's on my mind and I don't expect him to tell me every thought he has. Next spring we'll have been together 14 years and I'm expecting we'll have more years together to come. Time flies like an arrow
Fruit flies like bananas | |
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CalhounSq said: Well said as always Byron I'm not convinced a love like THAT is in the cards for me though. I hope it is, but then reality sets in & I know I may either be alone for the rest of it OR settle if I'm desperate enough. Hopefully, neither of those will end up being the case. We'll see...I don't think any of us are ever convinced it is...until it happens.  | |
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billyjackbitch said: JoweeCoco said: I find it very interesting that people say that in a relationship between two people all that really matters is how they feel about eachother. As if we human beings are not influenced by those close to us or even society in general. The question why not get married I thought was only fair. If you state you have a certain preference I don't see what's wrong with asking why that is. Either marriage does matter or it doesn't. You can't say it doesn't matter, but then also add to that you'd rather not get married. That to me sounds like it would be a burden to the two of you. In that case marriage would obviously matter very much. No you see, that is you putting words in my mouth. Just because I can name all kinds of reasons why I don't want to go to Afganistan for my holiday, doesn't mean I am also obligated to state all the reasons why should go there. I am sorry that you think that we as human beings are influenced by those close to us. Don't get me wrong. I think we all are, but that doesn't count for all subjects. And it is not a burden. It just doesn't make any sense. It is not a burden for me to drive a mercedes either, but you don't see me pay huge amounts of money for a Mercedes, just because some people just so happen to drive it. That is like having kids. Many women have kids...and still there are women who choose not to have kids. Simple. It is THAT simple. So again: let's agree to disagree Out of curiousity, though, what do you think would happen if you did get married??...I understand your viewpoint that it's unnecessary, especially within a relationship between two people who truly do connect in a profound way...but do you think that if they DID get married, it would somehow harm the relationship??...I kinda see it as, in a case like that getting married would only bring benefits to their relationship (in terms of tax breaks, health insurance, spouse can't testify against you in court..lol), and wouldn't harm or diminish that connection one iota...Do you feel it would put a different mindset into the couple??... | |
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Kayleigh said: I married my greatest love, at least I think so. He is my best friend.
With him I can be myself and he doesn't feel I should change and I don't want him to change. I mean we both can grow together. I don't tell him everything what's on my mind and I don't expect him to tell me every thought he has. Next spring we'll have been together 14 years and I'm expecting we'll have more years together to come.  | |
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Byron said: billyjackbitch said: No you see, that is you putting words in my mouth. Just because I can name all kinds of reasons why I don't want to go to Afganistan for my holiday, doesn't mean I am also obligated to state all the reasons why should go there. I am sorry that you think that we as human beings are influenced by those close to us. Don't get me wrong. I think we all are, but that doesn't count for all subjects. And it is not a burden. It just doesn't make any sense. It is not a burden for me to drive a mercedes either, but you don't see me pay huge amounts of money for a Mercedes, just because some people just so happen to drive it. That is like having kids. Many women have kids...and still there are women who choose not to have kids. Simple. It is THAT simple. So again: let's agree to disagree Out of curiousity, though, what do you think would happen if you did get married??...I understand your viewpoint that it's unnecessary, especially within a relationship between two people who truly do connect in a profound way...but do you think that if they DID get married, it would somehow harm the relationship??...I kinda see it as, in a case like that getting married would only bring benefits to their relationship (in terms of tax breaks, health insurance, spouse can't testify against you in court..lol), and wouldn't harm or diminish that connection one iota...Do you feel it would put a different mindset into the couple??... If I did get married, it would make no difference to me. Yesterday I was unmarried in a solid relationship, today I am married in a solid relationship. Please don't get me wrong. I do c the point of taxbreaks and it being easier law-wise if we'd have kids etc,... but it makes no difference to the bond we already share. That is all I am saying. Really...that is all. | |
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billyjackbitch said: Byron said: Out of curiousity, though, what do you think would happen if you did get married??...I understand your viewpoint that it's unnecessary, especially within a relationship between two people who truly do connect in a profound way...but do you think that if they DID get married, it would somehow harm the relationship??...I kinda see it as, in a case like that getting married would only bring benefits to their relationship (in terms of tax breaks, health insurance, spouse can't testify against you in court..lol), and wouldn't harm or diminish that connection one iota...Do you feel it would put a different mindset into the couple??... If I did get married, it would make no difference to me. Yesterday I was unmarried in a solid relationship, today I am married in a solid relationship. Please don't get me wrong. I do c the point of taxbreaks and it being easier law-wise if we'd have kids etc,... but it makes no difference to the bond we already share. That is all I am saying. Really...that is all. So, you don't have anything against marriage...??
Um..not that I'm asking..lol  | |
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Byron said: billyjackbitch said: I hear what you're saying and I see your point, but then why not celebrate that you've been in love and together for 25 years and hope for it to last for another 25 years in good health? That is what I find so fascinating too... People spend thousands of dollars on their weddingday. But never that much on their 25th anniversary. I guess 25 years of being together in good and less good times counts for a big celebration  AGain,.. in my humble opinion...I just see so many people spending such extravagant amounts of money and then don't even last a year into the marriage. Often I think: "is it the lady, who's been dreaming of this fairytale-day,... finally thought she found prince charming... and then after that one incredible extraordinary day,..whe wakes up a few months later and finds herself wondering why she isn't getting the flowers from her prince charming anymore...and that life in fact is just what you make of it, and not that fairy tale. I guess perhaps I don't see the point in the WEDDING. The ceremony... why is it we need a ceremony to "celebrate" we start life together? Where were we before the ceremony then? in an "unstarted" life? Is it now "real?" I just don't get it. It started the minute your heart skipped when you first saw him... (or her) and for as long as you feel the love for the other.I don't think I disagree with you too much.. I'm gonna be riduculed for saying this (and Sweeny's gonna revoke my "Best Friend" status..lol), but you know that scene in the "Call My Name" video towards the end, where a young couple are taking part in some ceremony outdoors, both dressed in sparkling white??...
To me, that's romantic.. ...It came across as more sincere and spiritual, and made me think I'd love taking part in a ceremony that was less traditional and celebrated my connection both with the woman I loved and with nature. While I wouldn't be doing backflips like they are in the video (lol), I still thought the idea of a ceremony such as that one to celebrate the beginning of a life together seemed beautiful.That part of that video is totally romantic. I cried the first time I saw it.
Partly, they were mushy tears. Partly, they were sad tears because, as of right now, society doesn't recognize my family. As of right now, I can't marry one of my partners. I didn't think marriage really mattered until I couldn't have it. Marriage didn't change the relationship with the partner I am married to. It wasn't different the next day. But people definately act as though my marriage is my 'real' partnership and the other is some sort of freaky fling. My husband and my boytoy. For example, a recent aquaintance (who knew that I'm in a polyamorous relationship), asked, "so, you're married?" And I said, "yes, to one of my partners" (or something close to that; I basically made the point that there are two of them) and she says, "what does your husband do?" and I tell her, and. . .end of conversation. My other partner doesn't really matter, I guess. It doesn't feel good, for "boytoy" (hi boytoy  ) or for me.
NOT to mention all of the legal benefits to marriage. It matters. | |
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Byron said: billyjackbitch said: If I did get married, it would make no difference to me. Yesterday I was unmarried in a solid relationship, today I am married in a solid relationship. Please don't get me wrong. I do c the point of taxbreaks and it being easier law-wise if we'd have kids etc,... but it makes no difference to the bond we already share. That is all I am saying. Really...that is all. So, you don't have anything against marriage...??
Um..not that I'm asking..lol Exactly. I never said I was against marriage. I just questionned what the added value is of marriage when the bond you share with your partner is already strong and solid. By all means, get married I just don't see myself do it. | |
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Byron said: CalhounSq said: Well said as always Byron I'm not convinced a love like THAT is in the cards for me though. I hope it is, but then reality sets in & I know I may either be alone for the rest of it OR settle if I'm desperate enough. Hopefully, neither of those will end up being the case. We'll see...I don't think any of us are ever convinced it is...until it happens. Bloody optimists...  I never met you, but I LOVE you & I will forever!! Thank you for being YOU - my little Princey, the best to EVER do it | |
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RocknRollDave said:  If you have to think about it this long and hard, the fact is that you ain't met the right person yet, so you shouldn't be thinking of getting married anyways.
"Love" doesn't make any sense, it's not reasonable or sensible. When you think too hard about it, it seems to >poof< into thin air. Like I say, if you gotta ask, the answer's "no". you finally said something i agree with  |
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lollyp0p said: RocknRollDave said: If you have to think about it this long and hard, the fact is that you ain't met the right person yet, so you shouldn't be thinking of getting married anyways.
"Love" doesn't make any sense, it's not reasonable or sensible. When you think too hard about it, it seems to >poof< into thin air. Like I say, if you gotta ask, the answer's "no". you finally said something i agree with Common Sense, something I accidentally, but fortunately very rarely, lapse into when I am in the middle of my normal talking cack.  | |
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Hotlegs said: Sweeny79 said: When you enter into any "life long"relationship, a child, a husband etc, part of or all of you is tied to that other person, you have to then put that other ahead of yourself and your own personal needs and desires. Like the song says "freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose" and I agree with that with my whole heart, if you have something or someone you are not free because you have to behave in a certain way as not to lose that someone or something.I definitely see where MarySharon is coming from.
I was thinking about thread this afternoon and I really examined my own desire to be married. I think it is fear that motivates me to want to find someone and settle down. The fear of being alone, the fear of being looked at as an outcast, or as less than other women. Not sure how it works for men, but women who are unwed seem to be looked down upon. We constantly hear "When are you going to get married???" from our mothers, our co workers, complete freaking strangers!!! There is a lot of pressure for us to "bag a man" before we get "too old" My own personal views on marriage are muddled. I do fall victim to societies terms of normalcy and expectancy when it comes to matrimony, but ultimately in my heart I doubt I ever will wed. Much like my decision to not have children, I feel (fear?) that having another person saddled to me for the rest of my life would end up a disaster.  From a single womans perspective, I must say that being in your 30's and unmarried presents some interesting societal stereotypes in which I have to be confronted with on daily bases. One thing is for sure, I would damned if I settled and just married whom ever just to be married and beat the clock(have kids). Without a Doubt, I definitely won't play the Star Jones desperation rule just to get married and appease society and family.
 " I'm living the single life."
[Edited 11/20/04 16:44pm]  Amen to that! The reasons you stated are exactly why I'm in no hurry to marry. Besides, the divorce rate scares the shit out of me, and I don't want to be part of that statistic. When and if I do marry, it will be to my best friend/confidant, and it will be for life (at least that's what I'm hoping for).RIP, mom. I will forever miss and love you. | |
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RocknRollDave said: If you have to think about it this long and hard, the fact is that you ain't met the right person yet, so you shouldn't be thinking of getting married anyways.
"Love" doesn't make any sense, it's not reasonable or sensible. When you think too hard about it, it seems to >poof< into thin air. Like I say, if you gotta ask, the answer's "no". I guess that's why I'm single because the shit's got to make since for me to be with you | |
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