Having said that, music wise, Bob Dylan can't hold a candle to Stevie.

heathilly said:

214 said:

Bob Dylan's impact is way beyond Stevie's impact, wider and greater and lyrically is superior as well,not musicallyand vocally, though.

No idea about Joni, the only song i have listened from her, is A Case Of U and i didn't like it a bit.

I would argue stevies impact on the world of rnb is as great as dylans in the rock world. Not to make this a race thing but there is a huge over analyzation and lauding for rock artist/white artist music as more worthy of intellectual study and more important more impactful. When in actuality there just written about more. (Theres more books on elvis than there is count bassie, michael jackson, prince, miles davis, duke ellington, chuck berry, stevie wonder, marvin gaye , ray charles combined that is alarming and a problem bigger than music its a reflection of society.) There was whole scene before and after elvis, there was alot going on before and after the beatles arrived the world did not change when dylan plugged in. (perhaps the most ridiclous one) Im not saying these artist arn't important because they are but alot the strides in black music tends to be put on back burner as less than when compared to their white counterpart. With that being said I agree bobs better lyrically he's very influential not much of a singer or genius musically as stevie though.

I see what are you talkin about, fair enough, agree with you. There's nothing in Dylan's legacy so beautiful as "As", wonderful and moving masterpiece opf a song.

214 said:

heathilly said:

214 said:

I see what are you talkin about, fair enough, agree with you. There's nothing in Dylan's legacy so beautiful as "As", wonderful and moving masterpiece opf a song.

Your a big girl now is pretty beautiful and 4th time around.

One of my very favorites, such a painful song.

214 said:

I see what are you talkin about, fair enough, agree with you. There's nothing in Dylan's legacy so beautiful as "As", wonderful and moving masterpiece opf a song.

.

Ever heard "Ring Them Bells" (1989)?

heathilly said:

MotownSubdivision said:

heathilly said:

I would argue stevies impact on the world of rnb is as great as dylans in the rock world. Not to make this a race thing but there is a huge over analyzation and lauding for rock artist/white artist music as more worthy of intellectual study and more important more impactful. When in actuality there just written about more. (Theres more books on elvis than there is count bassie, michael jackson, prince, miles davis, duke ellington, chuck berry, stevie wonder, marvin gaye , ray charles combined that is alarming and a problem bigger than music its a reflection of society.) There was whole scene before and after elvis, there was alot going on before and after the beatles arrived the world did not change when dylan plugged in. (perhaps the most ridiclous one) Im not saying these artist arn't important because they are but alot the strides in black music tends to be put on back burner as less than when compared to their white counterpart. With that being said I agree bobs better lyrically he's very influential not much of a singer or genius musically as stevie though.

Thank you. Same reason why the average rock album receives a remaster yet many R&B albums of the past go out of print.

True its the cause of alot of things from remasters to how much publicity they recieve in the "rock press" Brittany spears been on rollingstones more times than prince and mj combined. Yes I know shes selling sex appeal but really? Geez But once again this is just a microcosm of society and it permeates everything tv magazines movies literature everything.

Stevie 70-80

Prince 78-89

MJ 79-88

214 said:

Having said that, music wise, Bob Dylan can't hold a candle to Stevie.

co-sign. Dylan has "written" tons of of songs, which have 500 verses and no melody at all.
not my cup of tea

I think joni mitchell may be musics most sophisticated lyricist.

Then lenoard cohen than Bob Dylan.

[Edited 1/12/17 10:02am]

heathilly said:

214 said:

heathilly said:

I would argue stevies impact on the world of rnb is as great as dylans in the rock world. Not to make this a race thing but there is a huge over analyzation and lauding for rock artist/white artist music as more worthy of intellectual study and more important more impactful. When in actuality there just written about more. (Theres more books on elvis than there is count bassie, michael jackson, prince, miles davis, duke ellington, chuck berry, stevie wonder, marvin gaye , ray charles combined that is alarming and a problem bigger than music its a reflection of society.) There was whole scene before and after elvis, there was alot going on before and after the beatles arrived the world did not change when dylan plugged in. (perhaps the most ridiclous one) Im not saying these artist arn't important because they are but alot the strides in black music tends to be put on back burner as less than when compared to their white counterpart. With that being said I agree bobs better lyrically he's very influential not much of a singer or genius musically as stevie though.

I see what are you talkin about, fair enough, agree with you. There's nothing in Dylan's legacy so beautiful as "As", wonderful and moving masterpiece opf a song.

As mentioned (sadly), there are few books out there chronicling Stevie's impact on music as a whole, but as I said earlier, and as both of you indicated, Stevie's impact on music was broader than Dylan's. But not by a whole lot.

Several R&B artists - and if you want to call him a rock artist, Jimi -- covered Dylan's songs. Culturally, Dylan was an icon of the 60's, and really was admired by a lot of white and black Americans during that time. Still is. But sonically and commercially, Stevie's run seems to have made the bigger impact on audiences across racial lines.

That said, you're a bad man when artists from Brooke Benton to Patti Labelle to the O'Jays and Isleys are covering your songs. And though I agree with the OP, Dylan is that bad man.

BombSquad said:

NorthC said:

BombSquad said:

co-sign. Dylan has "written" tons of of songs, which have 500 verses and no melody at all.
not my cup of tea

Another man who has written tons of songs with no melody at all is James Brown. Yet I love them both. Whether you write lyrics that win the Nobel Prize or you're just screaming and hollering and begging and moaning, at the end of the day, music is about "how does it feeeel": "I feel good!"

James had a little more going for him than that, with songs like "Say It Loud," "I Don't Want Nobody . . ." and "Man's World" (famously performed in later years with Pavarotti).

That said, I see your point.

James Brown's Melodies were in the instruments!

NorthC said:

BombSquad said:

co-sign. Dylan has "written" tons of of songs, which have 500 verses and no melody at all.
not my cup of tea

Another man who has written tons of songs with no melody at all is James Brown. Yet I love them both. Whether you write lyrics that win the Nobel Prize or you're just screaming and hollering and begging and moaning, at the end of the day, music is about "how does it feeeel": "I feel good!"

ThePanther said:

214 said:

I see what are you talkin about, fair enough, agree with you. There's nothing in Dylan's legacy so beautiful as "As", wonderful and moving masterpiece opf a song.

.

Ever heard "Ring Them Bells" (1989)?

Of course, is great but to my taste is not at the same level.

BombSquad said:

214 said:

Having said that, music wise, Bob Dylan can't hold a candle to Stevie.

co-sign. Dylan has "written" tons of of songs, which have 500 verses and no melody at all.
not my cup of tea

I do not agree, is true he is not a master melody maker as Stevie Wonder, but lots of his melodies are good and go very well with the lyrics.

namepeace said:

NorthC said:

BombSquad said: Another man who has written tons of songs with no melody at all is James Brown. Yet I love them both. Whether you write lyrics that win the Nobel Prize or you're just screaming and hollering and begging and moaning, at the end of the day, music is about "how does it feeeel": "I feel good!"

James had a little more going for him than that, with songs like "Say It Loud," "I Don't Want Nobody . . ." and "Man's World" (famously performed in later years with Pavarotti).

That said, I see your point.

-

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Never heard/saw this before....Thanks for the lead namepeace.

Bob is an acquired taste if you get past his voice you can find enjoyment in his music

Bob is an acquired taste if you get past his voice you can find enjoyment in his music

heathilly said:

Bob is an acquired taste if you get past his voice you can find enjoyment in his music

Fortunately, some 9 years ago i got past his voice and now i love that voice, his lyrics and his music.

For me, Stevie Wonder was more the 'acquired taste', since I didn't get into his music until I was in my mid-20s. On the other hand, I'd been listening to Dylan since I was (literally) in the womb, and from when I was a toddler I always thought he had a great voice.

.

Then again, I grew up in a very white household...

ThePanther said:

For me, Stevie Wonder was more the 'acquired taste', since I didn't get into his music until I was in my mid-20s. On the other hand, I'd been listening to Dylan since I was (literally) in the womb, and from when I was a toddler I always thought he had a great voice.

.

Then again, I grew up in a very white household...

Well culture has alot to do with it. I had to grow to like bob dylans voice john lennon voice jimi hendrix voice. I have more rnb roots where singers really can saaang by you know the typical belting from the chest stay in tune soul church voices with some jazzy arragements syncopated rhythms. Coming from that to bob dylan was like going to planet where people breathed ammonia. I just didnt get it. But now Ive come to appreciate that style of music its good to broaden your horizions. Still trying to get into bruce springsteen and Im failing.

The Isley Brothers should be all over this list.

Graycap23 said:

The Isley Brothers should be all over this list.

i started to put "Go All The Way", but theres only 6 songs on that album ...and half of those are ballads or mid-tempo soul ("Here We Go Again" & "Dont Say Goodnight" & "Say You Will")... but the rest is good funk... no argument from me, i BEEN an Isley's fan..

Musicslave said:

namepeace said:

James had a little more going for him than that, with songs like "Say It Loud," "I Don't Want Nobody . . ." and "Man's World" (famously performed in later years with Pavarotti).

That said, I see your point.

-

-

Never heard/saw this before....Thanks for the lead namepeace.

To me one of the greatest live performances ever, by anyone.

I think we need to be clear about what a 'creative run' is. To me that's a span of music that the individual created themselves, ie. wrote, played and recorded.

That being the case, do we have to discount individuals like MJ and Madonna because not all of the hits that made up their run were created by them? They had a hand in them, for sure, but created? That's where someone like Prince or Stevie has a much better shout.

DaveT said:

I think we need to be clear about what a 'creative run' is. To me that's a span of music that the individual created themselves, ie. wrote, played and recorded.

That being the case, do we have to discount individuals like MJ and Madonna because not all of the hits that made up their run were created by them? They had a hand in them, for sure, but created? That's where someone like Prince or Stevie has a much better shout.

That's fair. I tend to agree with you, but some will say that the Madonnas and MJs of the world brought others' songs to their most fully realized state.

namepeace said:

DaveT said:

I think we need to be clear about what a 'creative run' is. To me that's a span of music that the individual created themselves, ie. wrote, played and recorded.

That being the case, do we have to discount individuals like MJ and Madonna because not all of the hits that made up their run were created by them? They had a hand in them, for sure, but created? That's where someone like Prince or Stevie has a much better shout.

That's fair. I tend to agree with you, but some will say that the Madonnas and MJs of the world brought others' songs to their most fully realized state.

Well I think by those standards people do not include mj and madonna. I cant speak for madonna but Mj had a good creative period from destiny with his brothers to bad. No he didnt write everything or play everything and no he did not release as frequently as others but the productuin of material of that period is beyond legendary, But did he have a creative run of releasing album yearly writing playing everything doing artistic things and changes no. He wasnt that type of artist.

RJOrion said:

Graycap23 said:

The Isley Brothers should be all over this list.

i started to put "Go All The Way", but theres only 6 songs on that album ...and half of those are ballads or mid-tempo soul ("Here We Go Again" & "Dont Say Goodnight" & "Say You Will")... but the rest is good funk... no argument from me, i BEEN an Isley's fan..

my mistake...i thought i was in "the greatest funk albums of all time" thread...smh...