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Forums > Music: Non-Prince > The White Album Or Physical Graffiti?
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Thread started 06/08/12 3:57pm

Gunsnhalen

The White Album Or Physical Graffiti?

Two of the ultimate classic rock double LP.

Which do you prefer?

In one corner we have the very experimental white album &in the other we have the also experimental but more RNR side to Physical Graffiti.

Which do you think was the better album? and why?

Pistols sounded like "Fuck off," wheras The Clash sounded like "Fuck Off, but here's why.."- Thedigitialgardener

Datdonkeydick- Asherfierce
Reply #1 posted 06/08/12 3:58pm

Gunsnhalen

And before some smartass come's in here and say's ''The Wall'' or ''London Calling'' or one of those. I get that there are other great classic rock LP but this one is specific on White album VS PG razz

Pistols sounded like "Fuck off," wheras The Clash sounded like "Fuck Off, but here's why.."- Thedigitialgardener

Datdonkeydick- Asherfierce
Reply #2 posted 06/08/12 4:01pm

silverchild

The White Album, just because it's messy and ambitious as hell. The Beatles' high point, IMO. Sorry Four Fab heads. music

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Reply #3 posted 06/08/12 6:44pm

Rococo

Sexy Sadie, is a cool song.

Reply #4 posted 06/08/12 7:42pm

JoeBala

The White Album because of "I Will".

Just Music-No Categories-Enjoy It!
Reply #5 posted 06/09/12 10:49am

rialb

Both albums are a bit patchy but I give the nod to The Beatles. Physical Graffiti is good but not as consistently good. For me it pales a bit when compared to the five albums that preceded it.

Reply #6 posted 06/09/12 11:17am

NDRU

Tough comparison, because I have known the White Album my whole life, and only got PG about five years ago.

They are both really fantastic albums. The White Album feels like more than a double album to me. Each disc has like 17 songs on it! It's a tougher listen for more conservative Beatles fans, but still full of classic tracks. It almost feels like a bootleg collection.

PG is less all over the place, and disc one is classic Zeppelin. Disc 2 is more experimental, but still quite easy to listen to IMO. When people dismiss Zeppelin as mere ripoffs of the real blues artists, I refer them to Night Flight, and ask which Willie Dixon song they stole that from. Kashmir is the essential Zeppelin sound. If they did nothing but covers & ripoffs, I would still call them one of the greatest bands of all time.

I would say that for range, and classic songs, I would go with the White Album. To think the same man sang Helter Skelter and I Will, and the same man wrote Good Night and Revolution 9, and that they are all on the same album is something I don't think we've ever seen the likes of before or since.

But I am biased. And in the end art is not a competition. Physical Graffiti is an awesome achievement.

Reply #7 posted 06/09/12 12:33pm

bigd74

rialb said:

Both albums are a bit patchy but I give the nod to The Beatles. Physical Graffiti is good but not as consistently good. For me it pales a bit when compared to the five albums that preceded it.

Exaxtly this^^^ the first 5 Zep albums are awesome, PG onwards they lost it IMO, The White Album is pretty good, when it's good it's amazing. It's better than Physical Graffiti.

cool

She Believed in Fairytales and Princes, He Believed the voices coming from his stereo

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Reply #8 posted 06/09/12 1:41pm

SPYZFAN1

Both are great...but I'm going with "The White Album". I used to lose myself in that record when I was a kid. The songs are great and I think the "free form" vibe set the way for many artists to just let loose and not worry about the "pop charts"...(even though there were some great hits off

of this record).

Everything from classic pop rock/acoustic ballads/blues/avant garde/prototype heavy metal/vaudville/children's songs....it's all here. And you can't beat the lyric poster and 4 solo portrait pictures.

I always dug the weirdness of "Wild Honey Pie". That's Paul playing everything.

Reply #9 posted 06/09/12 1:55pm

DiminutiveRocker

NDRU said:

Tough comparison, because I have known the White Album my whole life, and only got PG about five years ago.

They are both really fantastic albums. The White Album feels like more than a double album to me. Each disc has like 17 songs on it! It's a tougher listen for more conservative Beatles fans, but still full of classic tracks. It almost feels like a bootleg collection.

PG is less all over the place, and disc one is classic Zeppelin. Disc 2 is more experimental, but still quite easy to listen to IMO. When people dismiss Zeppelin as mere ripoffs of the real blues artists, I refer them to Night Flight, and ask which Willie Dixon song they stole that from. Kashmir is the essential Zeppelin sound. If they did nothing but covers & ripoffs, I would still call them one of the greatest bands of all time.

I would say that for range, and classic songs, I would go with the White Album. To think the same man sang Helter Skelter and I Will, and the same man wrote Good Night and Revolution 9, and that they are all on the same album is something I don't think we've ever seen the likes of before or since.

But I am biased. And in the end art is not a competition. Physical Graffiti is an awesome achievement.

Agree completely. PG is great to be sure, but The Whie Album is genius, IMO.

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~ John Wooden
Reply #10 posted 06/10/12 5:25am

Cloudbuster

Physical Graffiti.

Reply #11 posted 06/10/12 4:48pm

JoeTyler

THE WHITE ALBUM

Graffiti is the most overrated double-album of all time confused ; it has some big classics, but it just doesn't work as adouble album, is not ambitious/experimental/varied enough, in fact, it's full of filler, in my opinion

the White Album is what double-albums are supposed to be: madcap, varied, even schizophrenic, they have to justify the 18-28 different songs...otherwise it's just a big ass bunch of some good songs+filler...

for me, TWA , SITKOL (Stevie) and SOTT are the best double-albums of all time

tinkerbell
Reply #12 posted 06/10/12 4:55pm

silverchild

I tell you what would've been a hell of a challenge....

VS.

[Edited 6/10/12 16:56pm]

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Reply #13 posted 06/10/12 4:58pm

silverchild

JoeTyler said:

THE WHITE ALBUM

Graffiti is the most overrated double-album of all time confused ; it has some big classics, but it just doesn't work as adouble album, is not ambitious/experimental/varied enough, in fact, it's full of filler, in my opinion

the White Album is what double-albums are supposed to be: madcap, varied, even schizophrenic, they have to justify the 18-28 different songs...otherwise it's just a big ass bunch of some good songs+filler...

for me, TWA , SITKOL (Stevie) and SOTT are the best double-albums of all time

Never could get into Physical Graffiti. It just doesn't have that much variety on it. It does have its experimental and out there moments, but I don't get what the hype is about that album.

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Reply #14 posted 06/10/12 5:04pm

JoeTyler

silverchild said:

JoeTyler said:

THE WHITE ALBUM

Graffiti is the most overrated double-album of all time confused ; it has some big classics, but it just doesn't work as adouble album, is not ambitious/experimental/varied enough, in fact, it's full of filler, in my opinion

the White Album is what double-albums are supposed to be: madcap, varied, even schizophrenic, they have to justify the 18-28 different songs...otherwise it's just a big ass bunch of some good songs+filler...

for me, TWA , SITKOL (Stevie) and SOTT are the best double-albums of all time

Never could get into Physical Graffiti. It just doesn't have that much variety on it. It does have its experimental and out there moments, but I don't get what the hype is about that album.

the "double" album thing

the iconic front cover

some of the biggest songs of their career (Kashmir being the most popular)

but yeah, it's not an easy double-album to listen to, it doesn't flow, in my opinion, it could have been their ultimate 9 songs album...anyway who cares at this point?, lol the album is considered a classic, and sold very well, everybody loves Kashmir, ... lol

but I prefer II or IV...

[Edited 6/10/12 17:07pm]

tinkerbell
Reply #15 posted 06/10/12 5:06pm

JoeTyler

I also wanted to add that The White Album is probably the best-produced album of the 60s, it sounds TIMELESS.

tinkerbell
Reply #16 posted 06/10/12 5:07pm

silverchild

JoeTyler said:

silverchild said:

Never could get into Physical Graffiti. It just doesn't have that much variety on it. It does have its experimental and out there moments, but I don't get what the hype is about that album.

the "double" album thing

the iconic front cover

some of the biggest Zep songs of their career (Kashmir being the most popular)

but yeah, it's not an easy a double-album to listen to, it doesn't flow, in my opinion, it could have been their ultimate 9 songs album...anyway who cares at this point?, lol the album is considered a classic, and sold very well, everybody loves Kashmir, ... lol

but I prefer II or IV...

nod Yep, better yet...I rather listen to House of Holy than PG as that fits everything Led did effortlessly in a tight package, including ambitious moments...

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Reply #17 posted 06/10/12 5:13pm

JoeTyler

silverchild said:

JoeTyler said:

the "double" album thing

the iconic front cover

some of the biggest Zep songs of their career (Kashmir being the most popular)

but yeah, it's not an easy a double-album to listen to, it doesn't flow, in my opinion, it could have been their ultimate 9 songs album...anyway who cares at this point?, lol the album is considered a classic, and sold very well, everybody loves Kashmir, ... lol

but I prefer II or IV...

nod Yep, better yet...I rather listen to House of Holy than PG as that fits everything Led did effortlessly in a tight package, including ambitious moments...

nod Houses is a tremendous album cool , and a bit "underrated" (despite the 13 Diamond certifications eek )

but it's kinda odd that they wrote the (excellent) title-track for the next album falloff question lol

tinkerbell
Reply #18 posted 06/10/12 5:17pm

Timmy84

silverchild said:

I tell you what would've been a hell of a challenge....

VS.

[Edited 6/10/12 16:56pm]

yeahthat

Besides from Something/Anything, Here, My Dear, Songs in the Key of Life, Sign O' the Times and Life After Death, most double albums don't seem to do much to me, it depends on how good the music to hold on. I'm afraid Led Zeppelin and the Beatles would've both lost me midway through hearing their stuff on double albums.

[Edited 6/10/12 17:29pm]

Reply #19 posted 06/10/12 5:24pm

elmer

JoeTyler said:

silverchild said:

nod Yep, better yet...I rather listen to House of Holy than PG as that fits everything Led did effortlessly in a tight package, including ambitious moments...

nod Houses is a tremendous album cool , and a bit "underrated" (despite the 13 Diamond certifications eek )

but it's kinda odd that they wrote the (excellent) title-track for the next album falloff question lol

Shame about the silly Brown homage, The Crunge, wore thin after a few listens. Still my favourite Zep album though.

Reply #20 posted 06/10/12 5:25pm

NDRU

silverchild said:

I tell you what would've been a hell of a challenge....

VS.

[Edited 6/10/12 16:56pm]

I just picked up Something/Anything a couple of months ago. Damn if that is not a fine album! Incredible set of songs.

Given the mostly-solo nature of it however, I might compare it more to:

Reply #21 posted 06/10/12 5:29pm

Timmy84

NDRU said:

silverchild said:

I tell you what would've been a hell of a challenge....

VS.

[Edited 6/10/12 16:56pm]

I just picked up Something/Anything a couple of months ago. Damn if that is not a fine album! Incredible set of songs.

Given the mostly-solo nature of it however, I might compare it more to:

That's another double album that was a solid classic. Forgot to mention that one lol

Reply #22 posted 06/10/12 5:29pm

JoeTyler

elmer said:

JoeTyler said:

nod Houses is a tremendous album cool , and a bit "underrated" (despite the 13 Diamond certifications eek )

but it's kinda odd that they wrote the (excellent) title-track for the next album falloff question lol

Shame about the silly Brown homage, The Crunge, wore thin after a few listens. Still my favourite Zep album though.

yep, slighty lame attempt at "Plastic Funk", lol

tinkerbell
Reply #23 posted 06/11/12 12:19am

PurpleMusiq8

Physical Graffiti. Hands down. Led Zeppelin fucking rules.

The Beatles can suck a fat nut.

The Beatles are THE most overrated band ever, in my opinion. Their songs make absolutely no fucking sense, they're just a bunch of British dudes that got high as fuck off their asses and hit record. Maxwell's Silver Hammer and Yellow Submarine have the be the stupidest fucking songs I've heard in my life! I would much rather listen to Nicki Minaj's Stupid Hoe before those 2 songs.

Sorry, one of my co-workers has been talking about the Beatles all week and I had to get this off my chest. No offense or disrepect to anyone, this is purely my opinion, but goddamn do I fucking hate the Beatles.

smile

Anyway, yeah, Physical Graffiti is the shit, if not only for Trampled Under Foot alone.

I guess bold isn't <b></b> anymore edit.

[Edited 6/11/12 0:21am]

Reply #24 posted 06/11/12 12:49am

rialb

PurpleMusiq8 said:

Physical Graffiti. Hands down. Led Zeppelin fucking rules.

The Beatles can suck a fat nut.

The Beatles are THE most overrated band ever, in my opinion. Their songs make absolutely no fucking sense, they're just a bunch of British dudes that got high as fuck off their asses and hit record. Maxwell's Silver Hammer and Yellow Submarine have the be the stupidest fucking songs I've heard in my life! I would much rather listen to Nicki Minaj's Stupid Hoe before those 2 songs.

Sorry, one of my co-workers has been talking about the Beatles all week and I had to get this off my chest. No offense or disrepect to anyone, this is purely my opinion, but goddamn do I fucking hate the Beatles.

smile

Anyway, yeah, Physical Graffiti is the shit, if not only for Trampled Under Foot alone.

I guess bold isn't <b></b> anymore edit.

[Edited 6/11/12 0:21am]

No need to apologise for your dislike of The Beatles but do Led Zeppelin's songs, specifically the lyrics, make sense? A lot of their lyrics are just "borrowed" from old blues songs or fantasy type gibberish, particularly in the early years.

Reply #25 posted 06/11/12 12:12pm

bigd74

Timmy84 said:

NDRU said:

I just picked up Something/Anything a couple of months ago. Damn if that is not a fine album! Incredible set of songs.

Given the mostly-solo nature of it however, I might compare it more to:

That's another double album that was a solid classic. Forgot to mention that one lol

Just think how good Use Your Illusion could have been if it was cut down to just the 1 double album instead of the 2, that would've been up there with the greats.

cool

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Reply #26 posted 06/11/12 2:24pm

Timmy84

bigd74 said:

Timmy84 said:

That's another double album that was a solid classic. Forgot to mention that one lol

Just think how good Use Your Illusion could have been if it was cut down to just the 1 double album instead of the 2, that would've been up there with the greats.

cool

nod

Reply #27 posted 06/12/12 5:51am

mynameisnotsusan

I love both bands but just looking at the tracklist, I think I prefer Physical Graffiti. They gave a writing credit to Ritchie Valens mother on Boogie With Stu when they found out that she didn't receive any royalties from his music. Plus it's got In My Time Of Dying worship

Thirsty ass ho
Reply #28 posted 06/12/12 6:03am

thedance

Rococo said:

Sexy Sadie, is a cool song.

^

of course it is, and so is the rest.

White album / The Beatles....... is amazing and brilliant.

Much better than anything Led Zeppelin, (I am not a fan of them at all).

Let 2014 be purple:

I can't wait for the remaster! heart
Reply #29 posted 06/13/12 1:51am

mynameisnotsusan

Number 9, number 9, number 9 rolleyes

Thirsty ass ho
Reply #30 posted 06/13/12 2:17am

silverchild

mynameisnotsusan said:

Number 9, number 9, number 9 rolleyes

That one is a bit much, but it does grow on you. I just don't play it in the dark... lol

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Reply #31 posted 06/13/12 3:23am

rialb

silverchild said:

mynameisnotsusan said:

Number 9, number 9, number 9 rolleyes

That one is a bit much, but it does grow on you. I just don't play it in the dark... lol

Much like a boil grows on ones behind.

Reply #32 posted 06/13/12 10:08am

Timmy84

That #9 shit makes me go to sleep. yawn

Reply #33 posted 06/13/12 10:51am

silverchild

Timmy84 said:

That #9 shit makes me go to sleep. yawn



falloff It is a dud. But I've learned to take it for what it is. Just a long-winded sound collage interlude. But it does get boring after a while.
[Edited 6/13/12 10:51am]
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Reply #34 posted 06/13/12 10:54am

Timmy84

silverchild said:

Timmy84 said:

That #9 shit makes me go to sleep. yawn

falloff It is a dud. But I've learned to take it for what it is. Just a long-winded sound collage interlude. But it does get boring after a while. [Edited 6/13/12 10:51am]

I'm thinking the Beatles got bored with their music (and with each other) and just made up shit as they went along. It makes sense considering how quickly they broke up. lol That's why I never take much of their post-1966 music seriously (well I don't take some of their 1962-1966 work seriously either lol ). I always thought they were going through the motions and trying their way to figure out how to make albums high and this is the result of what happens when you're doped up on heroin, cocaine, acid, weed and LSD. lol

Reply #35 posted 06/13/12 11:15am

silverchild

Timmy84 said:

 



silverchild said:


Timmy84 said:

That #9 shit makes me go to sleep. yawn



falloff It is a dud. But I've learned to take it for what it is. Just a long-winded sound collage interlude. But it does get boring after a while. [Edited 6/13/12 10:51am]

I'm thinking the Beatles got bored with their music (and with each other) and just made up shit as they went along. It makes sense considering how quickly they broke up. lol That's why I never take much of their post-1966 music seriously (well I don't take some of their 1962-1966 work seriously either lol ). I always thought they were going through the motions and trying their way to figure out how to make albums high and this is the result of what happens when you're doped up on heroin, cocaine, acid, weed and LSD.  lol



True point. I do think something funny happened between Rubber Soul and Revolver in which they felt that they had to experiment to go to the next level musically, but what I do admire about their post-1966 albums is that they reinvented themselves and broke the sonic mold. The White Album is where I think they came back down to earth and figured that they had to get back to those guitar hooks and go to their roots because the whole Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band and Magical Mystery Tour trip was too overwhelming for them.
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Reply #36 posted 06/13/12 11:23am

Timmy84

silverchild said:

Timmy84 said:

I'm thinking the Beatles got bored with their music (and with each other) and just made up shit as they went along. It makes sense considering how quickly they broke up. lol That's why I never take much of their post-1966 music seriously (well I don't take some of their 1962-1966 work seriously either lol ). I always thought they were going through the motions and trying their way to figure out how to make albums high and this is the result of what happens when you're doped up on heroin, cocaine, acid, weed and LSD. lol

True point. I do think something funny happened between Rubber Soul and Revolver in which they felt that they had to experiment to go to the next level musically, but what I do admire about their post-1966 albums is that they reinvented themselves and broke the sonic mold. The White Album is where I think they came back down to earth and figured that they had to get back to those guitar hooks and go to their roots because the whole Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band and Magical Mystery Tour trip was too overwhelming for them.

I actually think their reinvention was the problem. They were getting tired of being called talentless pussies... lol so they felt "we gotta prove we ain't wusses"...

Reply #37 posted 06/13/12 11:48am

silverchild

Timmy84 said:

 



silverchild said:


Timmy84 said:

 


I'm thinking the Beatles got bored with their music (and with each other) and just made up shit as they went along. It makes sense considering how quickly they broke up. lol That's why I never take much of their post-1966 music seriously (well I don't take some of their 1962-1966 work seriously either lol ). I always thought they were going through the motions and trying their way to figure out how to make albums high and this is the result of what happens when you're doped up on heroin, cocaine, acid, weed and LSD.  lol



True point. I do think something funny happened between Rubber Soul and Revolver in which they felt that they had to experiment to go to the next level musically, but what I do admire about their post-1966 albums is that they reinvented themselves and broke the sonic mold. The White Album is where I think they came back down to earth and figured that they had to get back to those guitar hooks and go to their roots because the whole Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band and Magical Mystery Tour trip was too overwhelming for them.

I actually think their reinvention was the problem. They were getting tired of being called talentless pussies... lol so they felt "we gotta prove we ain't wusses"...



It advanced them and destroyed them in the end because individually, they could hold their own. They didn't really need to prove anything by experimenting or "pushing the envelope."
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Reply #38 posted 06/14/12 6:06am

thedance

just take that "Number 9" track and replace it with "Hey Jude"..

and then.. perfect.

the White Album.. excellent, masterpiece, no less. biggrin

.

[Edited 6/14/12 6:06am]

Let 2014 be purple:

I can't wait for the remaster! heart
Reply #39 posted 06/14/12 6:46am

ufoclub

although I think The Beatles were the greatest creative pop musical force EVER so far, I like the song Kashmir better than any one song on the White Album.

I do wish Hey Jude had actually been on the album.

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Reply #40 posted 06/14/12 8:44am

JoeTyler

ufoclub said:

although I think The Beatles were the greatest creative pop musical force EVER so far, I like the song Kashmir better than any one song on the White Album.

I do wish Hey Jude had actually been on the album.

the Beatles always had that problem. I don't know who's the one to blame (Epstein, Martin, Paul or John), but I've never understood why they didn't use the singles to "complete" the albums.

The White Album should have included Hey Jude and Lady Madonna...

tinkerbell
Reply #41 posted 06/14/12 8:48am

Timmy84

JoeTyler said:

ufoclub said:

although I think The Beatles were the greatest creative pop musical force EVER so far, I like the song Kashmir better than any one song on the White Album.

I do wish Hey Jude had actually been on the album.

the Beatles always had that problem. I don't know who's the one to blame (Epstein, Martin, Paul or John), but I've never understood why they didn't use the singles to "complete" the albums.

The White Album should have included Hey Jude and Lady Madonna...

I saw the tracklistings of "Sgt. Pepper's" and "The White Album" and couldn't believe how disorganized the albums seem to be. Like I said I think they were going through the moods. I was shocked when I found out "Hey Jude" wasn't even on The White Album! eek I can understood they didn't want people to think they were a singles act but goddamn, a hit single or two wouldn't have undermined the albums! Sheesh. They didn't put "I Am the Walrus" (as much as I can't stand that song), "All You Need is Love" or "Hello Goodbye" on Sgt. Pepper's either. The fuck? neutral "Abbey Road" by comparison was a better sequenced album.

Reply #42 posted 06/14/12 8:54am

MickyDolenz

thedance said:

just take that "Number 9" track and replace it with "Hey Jude"..

and then.. perfect.

the White Album.. excellent, masterpiece, no less. biggrin

I like Revolution 9, and don't think it needs to be replaced.

It's called show business for a reason. It’s 90% business and 10% show. If you don’t know your business…you’re in trouble! ~ Johnnie Taylor / Basically, music is nothing but prostitution anyway and managers are the pimps ~ Millie Jackson
Reply #43 posted 06/14/12 8:55am

rialb

I like the fact that not all of their singles were on the albums. Not only did you get a new b-side when you bought the single but you also often got an a-side that was unavailable elsewhere. Better value.

Reply #44 posted 06/14/12 8:58am

JoeTyler

Timmy84 said:

JoeTyler said:

the Beatles always had that problem. I don't know who's the one to blame (Epstein, Martin, Paul or John), but I've never understood why they didn't use the singles to "complete" the albums.

The White Album should have included Hey Jude and Lady Madonna...

I saw the tracklistings of "Sgt. Pepper's" and "The White Album" and couldn't believe how disorganized the albums seem to be. Like I said I think they were going through the moods. I was shocked when I found out "Hey Jude" wasn't even on The White Album! eek I can understood they didn't want people to think they were a singles act but goddamn, a hit single or two wouldn't have undermined the albums! Sheesh. They didn't put "I Am the Walrus" (as much as I can't stand that song), "All You Need is Love" or "Hello Goodbye" on Sgt. Pepper's either. The fuck? neutral "Abbey Road" by comparison was a better sequenced album.

I admire Sgt.Pepper because, for me, it has the best album-tracks of their entire carrer. I definitely think that songs like Hello Goodbye or Penny Lane would have been a distraction. I prefer dark/freaky/sad songs like She's Leaving Home or Benefit or Mr.Kite than Penny Lane, for example. That's why I also love Revolver, it does include the single Eleanor Rigby/Yellow Submarine but the rest of the album is cohesive, even a bit underrated. But I do agree that The White Album was just a bunch of (from excellent to just-ok) songs...

And yeah, despite the turmoil of the 69/70 era, Abbey Road and Let It Be actually sound like natural, cohesive albums, unlike The White Album or Magical Mystery Tour...

tinkerbell
Reply #45 posted 06/14/12 8:58am

MickyDolenz

rialb said:

I like the fact that not all of their singles were on the albums. Not only did you get a new b-side when you bought the single but you also often got an a-side that was unavailable elsewhere. Better value.

Johnnie Taylor also sometimes released non-album singles when he was on Stax. So did James Brown.

It's called show business for a reason. It’s 90% business and 10% show. If you don’t know your business…you’re in trouble! ~ Johnnie Taylor / Basically, music is nothing but prostitution anyway and managers are the pimps ~ Millie Jackson
Reply #46 posted 06/14/12 9:01am

JoeTyler

rialb said:

I like the fact that not all of their singles were on the albums. Not only did you get a new b-side when you bought the single but you also often got an a-side that was unavailable elsewhere. Better value.

ok, but it's kinda odd that popular songs like She Loves You, Wanna Hold Your Hand, From Me To You, Penny Lane, Hey Jude, Lady Madonna, Ballad of John and Yoko etc, are only available on compilations...

tinkerbell
Reply #47 posted 06/14/12 9:14am

MickyDolenz

JoeTyler said:

rialb said:

I like the fact that not all of their singles were on the albums. Not only did you get a new b-side when you bought the single but you also often got an a-side that was unavailable elsewhere. Better value.

ok, but it's kinda odd that popular songs like She Loves You, Wanna Hold Your Hand, From Me To You, Penny Lane, Hey Jude, Lady Madonna, Ballad of John and Yoko etc, are only available on compilations...

It was common at the time to release singles separate from albums. Many small labels released few albums or none at all. A lot of doo wop and girl groups were singles only. Albums wasn't really the focus, with some just being built around a song that became popular like Chubby Checker or Motown. 45 singles were cheap compared to albums, so good for teens. The LP was more of an adult market with jazz and showtunes, where singles weren't important. In the US though, The Beatles singles were on the albums. wink

[Edited 6/14/12 9:16am]

It's called show business for a reason. It’s 90% business and 10% show. If you don’t know your business…you’re in trouble! ~ Johnnie Taylor / Basically, music is nothing but prostitution anyway and managers are the pimps ~ Millie Jackson
Reply #48 posted 06/14/12 9:21am

JoeTyler

MickyDolenz said:

JoeTyler said:

ok, but it's kinda odd that popular songs like She Loves You, Wanna Hold Your Hand, From Me To You, Penny Lane, Hey Jude, Lady Madonna, Ballad of John and Yoko etc, are only available on compilations...

It was common at the time to release singles separate from albums. Many small labels released few albums or none at all. A lot of doo wop and girl groups were singles only. Albums wasn't really the focus, with some just being built around a song that became popular like Chubby Checker or Motown. 45 singles were cheap compared to albums, so good for teens. The LP was more of an adult market with jazz and showtunes, where singles weren't important.

yeah, that's true

I guess The Doors (perhaps unconsciously) changed the rules, at least in the US: hit singles released from strong LPs...

tinkerbell
Reply #49 posted 06/14/12 9:41am

Timmy84

JoeTyler said:

MickyDolenz said:

It was common at the time to release singles separate from albums. Many small labels released few albums or none at all. A lot of doo wop and girl groups were singles only. Albums wasn't really the focus, with some just being built around a song that became popular like Chubby Checker or Motown. 45 singles were cheap compared to albums, so good for teens. The LP was more of an adult market with jazz and showtunes, where singles weren't important.

yeah, that's true

I guess The Doors (perhaps unconsciously) changed the rules, at least in the US: hit singles released from strong LPs...

Not only the Doors but a lot of the Motown acts (Marvin Gaye, The Supremes, the Four Tops, the Miracles, The Temptations) and Aretha Franklin actually became the first acts to have more than two top 40 singles on one album. That was a rarity back then. Three was the most and the Supremes, Aretha Franklin, the Miracles and Marvin Gaye at the time were the only acts to have three or four singles hit the top 40 with three hitting the top 10 for some of their albums at the most part. Aretha had three top ten singles on Lady Soul and prior to that and afterwards, two top tens for every other album until 1972.

[Edited 6/14/12 9:41am]

Reply #50 posted 06/14/12 9:48am

JoeTyler

Timmy84 said:

JoeTyler said:

yeah, that's true

I guess The Doors (perhaps unconsciously) changed the rules, at least in the US: hit singles released from strong LPs...

Not only the Doors but a lot of the Motown acts (Marvin Gaye, The Supremes, the Four Tops, the Miracles, The Temptations) and Aretha Franklin actually became the first acts to have more than two top 40 singles on one album. That was a rarity back then. Three was the most and the Supremes, Aretha Franklin, the Miracles and Marvin Gaye at the time were the only acts to have three or four singles hit the top 40 with three hitting the top 10 for some of their albums at the most part. Aretha had three top ten singles on Lady Soul and prior to that and afterwards, two top tens for every other album until 1972.

[Edited 6/14/12 9:41am]

yeah, that's true, many people downplay the Motown LPs of the 60s thinking that they're full of filler, but acts The Temptations, Four Tops, Marvin Stevie, etc were releasing strong album-tracks ALREADY in the 60s. Aretha's I Never Loved a Man the Way I Love You is as strong as any great album of the 70s or 80s...

[Edited 6/14/12 9:49am]

tinkerbell
Reply #51 posted 06/14/12 9:54am

Timmy84

JoeTyler said:

Timmy84 said:

Not only the Doors but a lot of the Motown acts (Marvin Gaye, The Supremes, the Four Tops, the Miracles, The Temptations) and Aretha Franklin actually became the first acts to have more than two top 40 singles on one album. That was a rarity back then. Three was the most and the Supremes, Aretha Franklin, the Miracles and Marvin Gaye at the time were the only acts to have three or four singles hit the top 40 with three hitting the top 10 for some of their albums at the most part. Aretha had three top ten singles on Lady Soul and prior to that and afterwards, two top tens for every other album until 1972.

[Edited 6/14/12 9:41am]

yeah, that's true, many people downplay the Motown LPs of the 60s thinking that they're full of filler, but acts The Temptations, Four Tops, Marvin Stevie, etc were releasing strong album-tracks ALREADY in the 60s. Aretha's I Never Loved a Man the Way I Love You is as strong as any great album of the 70s or 80s...

[Edited 6/14/12 9:49am]

Exactly. Motown actually put out GREAT albums in the '60s and for the most part, you could tell with the original material, they all work hard to get that sound. I always loved Marvin's That Stubborn Kinda Fellow album for example because every song had strength and life, which Marvin brought to these songs. His M.P.G. album from '69 and In the Groove from '68 were also great albums and his first Tammi duet album, United, is a masterpiece. As for Aretha, man, lots of great albums, no filler on most of them especially the 1967-73 albums. I Never Loved a Man, Lady Soul and Aretha Now are probably three of the greatest soul albums of all time.

Reply #52 posted 06/14/12 9:55am

silverchild

JoeTyler said:

 



Timmy84 said:


 



JoeTyler said:


 


 yeah, that's true


 


I guess The Doors (perhaps unconsciously) changed the rules, at least in the US: hit singles released from strong LPs...


 


 


 


 



Not only the Doors but a lot of the Motown acts (Marvin Gaye, The Supremes, the Four Tops, the Miracles, The Temptations) and Aretha Franklin actually became the first acts to have more than two top 40 singles on one album. That was a rarity back then. Three was the most and the Supremes, Aretha Franklin, the Miracles and Marvin Gaye at the time were the only acts to have three or four singles hit the top 40 with three hitting the top 10 for some of their albums at the most part. Aretha had three top ten singles on Lady Soul and prior to that and afterwards, two top tens for every other album until 1972.


[Edited 6/14/12 9:41am]



yeah, that's true, many people downplay the Motown LPs of the 60s thinking that they're full of filler, but acts The Temptations, Four Tops, Marvin Stevie, etc were releasing strong album-tracks ALREADY in the 60s. Aretha's I Never Loved a Man the Way I Love You is as strong as any great album of the 70s or 80s...

[Edited 6/14/12 9:49am]



I'll even add Otis Redding, Sam Cooke, Isaac Hayes, and Curtis & The Impressions to that list as well.
Check me out and add me on:
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Reply #53 posted 06/14/12 9:57am

Timmy84

silverchild said:

JoeTyler said:

yeah, that's true, many people downplay the Motown LPs of the 60s thinking that they're full of filler, but acts The Temptations, Four Tops, Marvin Stevie, etc were releasing strong album-tracks ALREADY in the 60s. Aretha's I Never Loved a Man the Way I Love You is as strong as any great album of the 70s or 80s...

[Edited 6/14/12 9:49am]

I'll even add Otis Redding, Sam Cooke, Isaac Hayes, and Curtis & The Impressions to that list as well.

Yup! Otis Blue, Dictionary of Soul, Night Beat, Ain't That Good News, Hot Buttered Soul, Keep on Pushing... whew lol R&B artists were starting to get their niche then and not in the '70s as is often mentioned. nod

Reply #54 posted 06/14/12 10:03am

JoeTyler

Timmy84 said:

silverchild said:

JoeTyler said: I'll even add Otis Redding, Sam Cooke, Isaac Hayes, and Curtis & The Impressions to that list as well.

Yup! Otis Blue, Dictionary of Soul, Night Beat, Ain't That Good News, Hot Buttered Soul, Keep on Pushing... whew lol R&B artists were starting to get their niche then and not in the '70s as is often mentioned. nod

well, I didn't even mention Otis because I consider him to be the God of Soul,lol I consider that ANY song of Otis is basically GOOD, lol

and James Brown never released a bad song either, even his "lesser" songs flow perfectly, the guy always created a "groove" from start to finish...

tinkerbell
Reply #55 posted 06/14/12 10:07am

Timmy84

JoeTyler said:

Timmy84 said:

Yup! Otis Blue, Dictionary of Soul, Night Beat, Ain't That Good News, Hot Buttered Soul, Keep on Pushing... whew lol R&B artists were starting to get their niche then and not in the '70s as is often mentioned. nod

well, I didn't even mention Otis because I consider him to be the God of Soul,lol I consider that ANY song of Otis is basically GOOD, lol

and James Brown never released a bad song either, even his "lesser" songs flow perfectly, the guy always created a "groove" from start to finish...

lol yeah, you're right about Otis. As for James, as much great grooves he created, he couldn't create a decent album unless it was live (and even then, you wonder how much was "live"). lol Now that guy was truly all over the place. nod falloff

Reply #56 posted 06/14/12 10:13am

imago

NDRU said:

Tough comparison, because I have known the White Album my whole life, and only got PG about five years ago.

They are both really fantastic albums. The White Album feels like more than a double album to me. Each disc has like 17 songs on it! It's a tougher listen for more conservative Beatles fans, but still full of classic tracks. It almost feels like a bootleg collection.

PG is less all over the place, and disc one is classic Zeppelin. Disc 2 is more experimental, but still quite easy to listen to IMO. When people dismiss Zeppelin as mere ripoffs of the real blues artists, I refer them to Night Flight, and ask which Willie Dixon song they stole that from. Kashmir is the essential Zeppelin sound. If they did nothing but covers & ripoffs, I would still call them one of the greatest bands of all time.

I would say that for range, and classic songs, I would go with the White Album. To think the same man sang Helter Skelter and I Will, and the same man wrote Good Night and Revolution 9, and that they are all on the same album is something I don't think we've ever seen the likes of before or since.

But I am biased. And in the end art is not a competition. Physical Graffiti is an awesome achievement.

What? Have I been listening to an abridged version of the White album all these years, and just too much of a casual fan to know it? lol

Reply #57 posted 06/14/12 10:14am

MickyDolenz

Timmy84 said:

lol yeah, you're right about Otis. As for James, as much great grooves he created, he couldn't create a decent album unless it was live (and even then, you wonder how much was "live"). lol Now that guy was truly all over the place. nod falloff

Sydney Nathan wasn't interested in albums, so that wasn't the focus of King Records anyway. The equipment at King studio wasn't great either, so the records sound quality varied.

It's called show business for a reason. It’s 90% business and 10% show. If you don’t know your business…you’re in trouble! ~ Johnnie Taylor / Basically, music is nothing but prostitution anyway and managers are the pimps ~ Millie Jackson
Reply #58 posted 06/14/12 10:14am

JoeTyler

Timmy84 said:

JoeTyler said:

well, I didn't even mention Otis because I consider him to be the God of Soul,lol I consider that ANY song of Otis is basically GOOD, lol

and James Brown never released a bad song either, even his "lesser" songs flow perfectly, the guy always created a "groove" from start to finish...

lol yeah, you're right about Otis. As for James, as much great grooves he created, he couldn't create a decent album unless it was live (and even then, you wonder how much was "live"). lol Now that guy was truly all over the place. nod falloff

hmm, but the thing I like about Brown is that his personal/extreme take on soul/funk works very well because of the groove; I'll never be a TOTAL fan of genres like pop/rock/folk/country because the filler is boring AND you can't escape it due to the verse-chorus form, which FORCES you to "listen" the song, but a "bad" Brown song flows and you don't even notice it, it's not necessary to skip it, lol

I actually prefer artists focused on the "groove" and not the verse-chorus shit (Brown, Marley, Parliament-Funkadelic, etc). If you're a verse-chorus artist, you know that you're gonna release some crappy filler sooner or later (Bowie, Elton, the Stones, etc), hell that's why Exile on Main Street is their best album, it's their "groove" album, same with 1999, that's Prince's "groove" album...

[Edited 6/14/12 10:18am]

tinkerbell
Reply #59 posted 06/14/12 10:21am

Timmy84

JoeTyler said:

Timmy84 said:

lol yeah, you're right about Otis. As for James, as much great grooves he created, he couldn't create a decent album unless it was live (and even then, you wonder how much was "live"). lol Now that guy was truly all over the place. nod falloff

hmm, but the thing I like about Brown is that his personal/extreme take on soul/funk works very well because of the groove; I'll never be a TOTAL fan of genres like pop/rock/folk/country because the filler is boring AND you can't escape it due to the verse-chorus form, which FORCES you to "listen" the song, but a "bad" Brown song flows and you don't even notice it, it's not necessary to skip it, lol

I actually prefer artists focused on the "groove" and not the verse-chorus shit (Brown, Marley, Parliament-Funkadelic, etc). If you're a verse-chorus artist, you know that you're gonna release some crappy filler sooner or later (Bowie, Elton, the Stones, etc), hell that's why Exile on Main Street is their best album, it's their "groove" album, same with 1999, that's Prince's "groove" album...

[Edited 6/14/12 10:18am]

Well you got a point with that. nod

Reply #60 posted 06/14/12 10:22am

Timmy84

MickyDolenz said:

Timmy84 said:

lol yeah, you're right about Otis. As for James, as much great grooves he created, he couldn't create a decent album unless it was live (and even then, you wonder how much was "live"). lol Now that guy was truly all over the place. nod falloff

Sydney Nathan wasn't interested in albums, so that wasn't the focus of King Records anyway. The equipment at King studio wasn't great either, so the records sound quality varied.

Hmm interesting...

Reply #61 posted 06/14/12 10:24am

MickyDolenz

James didn't really make "albums", kinda like Sun Ra didn't. They just recorded a lot of songs and just stuck some together into a LP. Some of James albums have the same songs re-recorded with different arrangements.

It's called show business for a reason. It’s 90% business and 10% show. If you don’t know your business…you’re in trouble! ~ Johnnie Taylor / Basically, music is nothing but prostitution anyway and managers are the pimps ~ Millie Jackson
Reply #62 posted 06/14/12 10:27am

Timmy84

MickyDolenz said:

James didn't really make "albums", kinda like Sun Ra didn't. They just recorded a lot of songs and just stuck some together into a LP. Some of James albums have the same songs re-recorded with different arrangements.

Reminds me a lot of Ike Turner's catalog with and without Tina Turner...

Reply #63 posted 06/14/12 10:41am

MickyDolenz

Timmy84 said:

MickyDolenz said:

Sydney Nathan wasn't interested in albums, so that wasn't the focus of King Records anyway. The equipment at King studio wasn't great either, so the records sound quality varied.

Hmm interesting...

If you listen to the Tammi Terrell compilation, the songs she did with James sound "muddy" compared to the other songs on it. Some of the original records released by King were of poor quality and wore out quickly, because Sydney would just "recycle" old records that didn't sell and melt them down to print up new ones, because he didn't want to spend a lot of money. That's why Syd didn't care about albums, because he figured they didn't sell enough for the expense. Remember James spent his own money to record Live At The Apollo, because Syd told him nobody was going to buy songs they had already, and you couldn't make singles from live tracks.

[Edited 6/14/12 10:44am]

It's called show business for a reason. It’s 90% business and 10% show. If you don’t know your business…you’re in trouble! ~ Johnnie Taylor / Basically, music is nothing but prostitution anyway and managers are the pimps ~ Millie Jackson
Reply #64 posted 06/14/12 10:58am

Timmy84

MickyDolenz said:

Timmy84 said:

Hmm interesting...

If you listen to the Tammi Terrell compilation, the songs she did with James sound "muddy" compared to the other songs on it. Some of the original records released by King were of poor quality and wore out quickly, because Sydney would just "recycle" old records that didn't sell and melt them down to print up new ones, because he didn't want to spend a lot of money. That's why Syd didn't care about albums, because he figured they didn't sell enough for the expense. Remember James spent his own money to record Live At The Apollo, because Syd told him nobody was going to buy songs they had already, and you couldn't make singles from live tracks.

[Edited 6/14/12 10:44am]

That just makes the situation with James and production of the Apollo album even more interesting.

Reply #65 posted 06/14/12 3:17pm

MickyDolenz

Timmy84 said:

That just makes the situation with James and production of the Apollo album even more interesting.

Sometimes James did make an album with a purpose like Soul On Top or the Christmas records. James & Syd always seemed to disagree, so James put out stuff on other labels. Syd sued, saying James was breaking contract. Ben Bart found a loophole, that James could release albums on another label (Smash) as long as his voice wasn't on the records. So James released instrumental albums and albums with his other singers.

It's called show business for a reason. It’s 90% business and 10% show. If you don’t know your business…you’re in trouble! ~ Johnnie Taylor / Basically, music is nothing but prostitution anyway and managers are the pimps ~ Millie Jackson
Reply #66 posted 06/14/12 3:25pm

NDRU

thedance said:

just take that "Number 9" track and replace it with "Hey Jude"..

and then.. perfect.

the White Album.. excellent, masterpiece, no less. biggrin

I actually am one of the very few who likes Revolution 9. I generally don't even skip it when I am listening to the album. Plus the hype surrounding it just adds to their mystique. Pure John Lennon nuttiness (and insight into the acid mindset), but it's put together in a pretty artful way.

BUT...I do think the album might have been just that much stronger with Hey Jude instead. I'd put it in place of Julia and move Julia to where #9 is.

Reply #67 posted 06/14/12 3:27pm

NDRU

imago said:

NDRU said:

Tough comparison, because I have known the White Album my whole life, and only got PG about five years ago.

They are both really fantastic albums. The White Album feels like more than a double album to me. Each disc has like 17 songs on it! It's a tougher listen for more conservative Beatles fans, but still full of classic tracks. It almost feels like a bootleg collection.

PG is less all over the place, and disc one is classic Zeppelin. Disc 2 is more experimental, but still quite easy to listen to IMO. When people dismiss Zeppelin as mere ripoffs of the real blues artists, I refer them to Night Flight, and ask which Willie Dixon song they stole that from. Kashmir is the essential Zeppelin sound. If they did nothing but covers & ripoffs, I would still call them one of the greatest bands of all time.

I would say that for range, and classic songs, I would go with the White Album. To think the same man sang Helter Skelter and I Will, and the same man wrote Good Night and Revolution 9, and that they are all on the same album is something I don't think we've ever seen the likes of before or since.

But I am biased. And in the end art is not a competition. Physical Graffiti is an awesome achievement.

What? Have I been listening to an abridged version of the White album all these years, and just too much of a casual fan to know it? lol

http://www.amazon.com/The...B0025KVLU6

17 tracks on disc 1, and 14 tracks on disc 2

Reply #68 posted 06/14/12 3:37pm

Cloudbuster

NDRU said:

imago said:

What? Have I been listening to an abridged version of the White album all these years, and just too much of a casual fan to know it? lol

http://www.amazon.com/The...B0025KVLU6

17 tracks on disc 1, and 14 tracks on disc 2

13 on disc 2. The fourteenth track is a mini doc available only on the remasters.

Reply #69 posted 06/14/12 3:48pm

NDRU

Cloudbuster said:

NDRU said:

http://www.amazon.com/The...B0025KVLU6

17 tracks on disc 1, and 14 tracks on disc 2

13 on disc 2. The fourteenth track is a mini doc available only on the remasters.

ah, right you are!

Reply #70 posted 06/14/12 4:29pm

Timmy84

MickyDolenz said:

Timmy84 said:

That just makes the situation with James and production of the Apollo album even more interesting.

Sometimes James did make an album with a purpose like Soul On Top or the Christmas records. James & Syd always seemed to disagree, so James put out stuff on other labels. Syd sued, saying James was breaking contract. Ben Bart found a loophole, that James could release albums on another label (Smash) as long as his voice wasn't on the records. So James released instrumental albums and albums with his other singers.

I read about that...

Reply #71 posted 06/18/12 10:59pm

PurpleMusiq8

rialb said:

No need to apologise for your dislike of The Beatles but do Led Zeppelin's songs, specifically the lyrics, make sense? A lot of their lyrics are just "borrowed" from old blues songs or fantasy type gibberish, particularly in the early years.

Yeah, Zep pretty much stole a lot of blues songs, but the fantasy type gibberish you're talking about is borrowed a lot from ancient mythologies and world religions, I think anyway. Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds and about 98% of everything else the Beatles ever made was about drugs. At least it was original though.

Reply #72 posted 07/06/12 11:58am

bigd74

Timmy84 said:

bigd74 said:

Just think how good Use Your Illusion could have been if it was cut down to just the 1 double album instead of the 2, that would've been up there with the greats.

cool

nod

after having listened to both albums quite alot this is what my UYI tracklist would look like

1. Right Next Door To Hell

2. Live And Let Die

3. Dust N Bones

4. Double Talkin' Jive

5. November Rain

6. Garden Of Eden

7. Civil War

8. You Could Be Mine

9. Yesterdays

10. 14 Years

11. Breakdown

12. Pretty Tied Up

13. Locomotive

14. Estranged

it took a bit of juggling and i left off a few songs that i really do like. this just fits on a cd and it rocks. i burnt this yesterday and listened to it in the car today smile

She Believed in Fairytales and Princes, He Believed the voices coming from his stereo

If I Said You Had A Beautiful Body Would You Hold It Against Me?

URL: http://prince.org/msg/8/382483

Date printed: Wed 22nd Oct 2014 4:55pm PDT