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Thread started 01/31/12 8:57pm

Cinnamon234

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Female Musical Geniuses?

I've noticed on this site and many other sites as well that when people refer to music geniuses, they often point to male artists or groups such as Marvin Gaye, The Beatles, Prince (of course), Stevie Wonder,etc. but never mention women.

What about Female artists? Is it a case of sexism or do you really feel that female musical geniuses are few and far in between?

Are there any women in the industry any of you consider to be musical geniuses?

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Reply #1 posted 01/31/12 9:02pm

mjscarousal

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Cinnamon234 said:

I've noticed on this site and many other sites as well that when people refer to music geniuses, they often point to male artists or groups such as Marvin Gaye, The Beatles, Prince (of course), Stevie Wonder,etc. but never mention women.

What about Female artists? Is it a case of sexism or do you really feel that female musical geniuses are few and far in between?

Are there any women in the industry any of you consider to be musical geniuses?

I dont think it is a case of sexism... There arent really alot of female musical geniuses for that matter it really isnt an abundance of musical geniuses in general... that title "musical genius" is a title that is carelessly thrown around and given to.. I think the few that you mentioned are a handful when it comes to real well known singers that are also musical geniuses..

Like right now I can not think of one at the top of my head that is a female singer that I would classify as a musical genius...thats something I would have to give a little more thought into..

Stand, you`ve been sitting much too long, there`s a permanent crease in your right or wrong.~Sly Stone
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Reply #2 posted 01/31/12 9:50pm

Dren5

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There's all the obvious ones which I know people will come in and rattle off soon.

But we probably haven't seen more because if you think about it, women aren't really encouraged towards instrumentation and being real musicians the way guys are. I bet a lot of the female artists out here are way more talented than they initially appear, but instead of the record companies supporting them going a more artistic route and developing as artists, they shove them into skimpy outfits, discourage them from writing their own stuff, and dumb down their lyrics and give them shitty choreography - in a nutshell, that basically to some extent, females are kind of stunted and held back in that respect.

The same thing is definitely true in K-Pop (Korean pop music) where a lot of the female artists are wayyyy more talented than they appear but seem to always be discouraged from really utilizing the talent they were given to the fullest.

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Reply #3 posted 01/31/12 10:00pm

JabarR74

There's only one female musical genius I know and she's

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Reply #4 posted 01/31/12 10:10pm

Pomade

Bjork, Jonatha Brooke, Erykah Badu, Meshell

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Reply #5 posted 01/31/12 10:17pm

Terrib3Towel

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"musical genius" is such a worthless title. What is a "musical genius" anyway? Somebody who can read music? I can read music, does that make me one? People here are always on Madonna's clit for "staying relevant for 30 years" is she a "musical genius?"

Somebody help me understand. lol

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Reply #6 posted 01/31/12 10:24pm

Dren5

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Terrib3Towel said:

"musical genius" is such a worthless title. What is a "musical genius" anyway? Somebody who can read music? I can read music, does that make me one? People here are always on Madonna's clit for "staying relevant for 30 years" is she a "musical genius?"

Somebody help me understand. lol

Okay, imagine Prince, but without a peener, and with titties.

That's a female musical genius.

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Reply #7 posted 01/31/12 10:26pm

Timmy84

Angela Winbush is an obvious one.

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Reply #8 posted 01/31/12 10:37pm

PlayboyOrigina
l

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Chaka Khan

Sade

Minnie Riperton

Ella Fitzgerald

Etta James

Dionne Warwick

Natalie Cole

LaBelle

Stevie Wonder = EARTH
Prince = WIND
Chaka Khan = FIRE
Sade = WATER
the ELEMENTS of MUSIC
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Reply #9 posted 01/31/12 10:40pm

PlayboyOrigina
l

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Twinkie Clark

CeCe Winans

Stevie Wonder = EARTH
Prince = WIND
Chaka Khan = FIRE
Sade = WATER
the ELEMENTS of MUSIC
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Reply #10 posted 01/31/12 10:45pm

silverchild

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Teena Marie has to be in the top tier, along with the others people have mentioned.

Aretha is another one.
[Edited 1/31/12 22:46pm]
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Reply #11 posted 01/31/12 11:02pm

Dren5

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Nobody mentioned Fiona Apple or Patrice Rushen or Sheila E.

lurking

Editing to add Stevie Nicks.

[Edited 1/31/12 23:02pm]

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Reply #12 posted 01/31/12 11:03pm

WaterInYourBat
h

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Timmy84 said:

Angela Winbush is an obvious one.

And Patrice Rushen.

"You put water into a cup, it becomes the cup...Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend." - Bruce Lee
"Water can nourish me, but water can also carry me. Water has magic laws." - JCVD
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Reply #13 posted 01/31/12 11:35pm

kenkamken

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Billie Holiday
Betty Carter
Annie Lennox
Aretha Franklin

I suppose these ladies are more vocalists, but genius at what they do.

Kate Bush has a distinct musical vision.

Karen Dalton I love.
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Reply #14 posted 01/31/12 11:42pm

scriptgirl

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LOVE Sade, but I don't think she is a musical genius as much as she is unique.

"Lack of home training crosses all boundaries."
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Reply #15 posted 02/01/12 2:49am

kevinpnb

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Joni!

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Reply #16 posted 02/01/12 3:56am

smoothcriminal
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Joni Mitchell?

Aretha?

Teena?

Ella?

Sexism....right.

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Reply #17 posted 02/01/12 4:36am

mjscarousal

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But are they really musical geniuses though??

There are some female singers that are good musicians but I wouldnt necessary call them a genius at it... Why should the title be given so easily JUST because its a handfull of women that play instruments? The bar and criteria should be held the same...

Joni is good.. Erykah is good to... their exacty some of my favorites but I wouldnt call them genius either. What is the title based on? Is it based on how many instruments they play in their music? Ability to read and compose music? How well they can play each instrument? I think people are just giving suggestions of what female singers can also play instruments as welll not really looking at the entire spectrum..

Stand, you`ve been sitting much too long, there`s a permanent crease in your right or wrong.~Sly Stone
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Reply #18 posted 02/01/12 4:45am

SoulAlive

Alot of people use the phrase "musical genuis" without really defining what that means.What exactly is a "musical genuis" and what makes an artist one?

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Reply #19 posted 02/01/12 5:48am

SpookyElektrix

Patrice Rushen

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Reply #20 posted 02/01/12 6:07am

duccichucka

Cinnamon234 said:

I've noticed on this site and many other sites as well that when people refer to music geniuses, they often point to male artists or groups such as Marvin Gaye, The Beatles, Prince (of course), Stevie Wonder,etc. but never mention women.

What about Female artists? Is it a case of sexism or do you really feel that female musical geniuses are few and far in between?

Are there any women in the industry any of you consider to be musical geniuses?

The problem is that that word, "genius," has lost its original meaning. Today it is

simply used to express what the word "exemplary" means. Marvin Gaye, The Beatles,

Prince and Stevie Wonder aren't geniuses in the true sense of the word. What you

really mean to say is that those artists are "extraordinary."

True genius as understood by psychologists is rare and therefore, not only will it be

hard to find an example of it inhabited in a female, but in a male as well.

But you're right. The problem here isn't that genius is relegated mostly to men; it's the

fact that history and the human narrative is told mostly by men! Therefore, you'll

see more examples of male excellence (and genius) before you'll see/read about female examples. It's totally sexist how the human story gets told or is celebrated.

An honest religious thinker is like a tightrope walker. He almost looks as though he were walking on nothing but air. His support is the slenderest imaginable. And yet it really is possible to walk on it.

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Reply #21 posted 02/01/12 6:25am

Militant

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I would say, definitely:

Joni Mitchell

Patrice Rushen

Sade

Kate Bush

Angela Winbush

Chaka Khan

Bjork

Tori Amos

Patti Smith

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Reply #22 posted 02/01/12 6:39am

mjscarousal

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duccichucka said:

Cinnamon234 said:

I've noticed on this site and many other sites as well that when people refer to music geniuses, they often point to male artists or groups such as Marvin Gaye, The Beatles, Prince (of course), Stevie Wonder,etc. but never mention women.

What about Female artists? Is it a case of sexism or do you really feel that female musical geniuses are few and far in between?

Are there any women in the industry any of you consider to be musical geniuses?

The problem is that that word, "genius," has lost its original meaning. Today it is

simply used to express what the word "exemplary" means. Marvin Gaye, The Beatles,

Prince and Stevie Wonder aren't geniuses in the true sense of the word. What you

really mean to say is that those artists are "extraordinary."

True genius as understood by psychologists is rare and therefore, not only will it be

hard to find an example of it inhabited in a female, but in a male as well.

But you're right. The problem here isn't that genius is relegated mostly to men; it's the

fact that history and the human narrative is told mostly by men! Therefore, you'll

see more examples of male excellence (and genius) before you'll see/read about female examples. It's totally sexist how the human story gets told or is celebrated.

I agree with this but I disagree with the sexist portion. In reality their arent alot of female singers that are also musicians that have had a major profound influence on music such as Prince and Stevie Wonder. I am not saying they arent but I am suggesting that is a major reason as to why female musicians get looked over. If their are more men then women in a certain field.. then yes of course their will be more men telling the story of music and portrayels so in a sense it is slightly biased but I think if their were more women that were musicians as well that had the same influence they would get talked about as well....

If you look at current entertainers now... MORE women are celebrated more then men.. NOT necessarily because its a biased but currently their are more mainstream popular female entertainers then males.. not saying their arent any males but their are more females on a bigger level so their going to be talked about more...

Stand, you`ve been sitting much too long, there`s a permanent crease in your right or wrong.~Sly Stone
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Reply #23 posted 02/01/12 8:26am

Graycap23

Genius? I can't think of a single one.

Hell..........I can OLNY think of a few men in that catagory. That word is seriously over used.

The folks listed so far in this thread come no where near Genius level.

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Reply #24 posted 02/01/12 8:42am

smoothcriminal
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Graycap23 said:

Genius? I can't think of a single one.

Hell..........I can OLNY think of a few men in that catagory. That word is seriously over used.

The folks listed so far in this thread come no where near Genius level.

Joni Mitchell?

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Reply #25 posted 02/01/12 8:44am

Dren5

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smoothcriminal12 said:

Graycap23 said:

Genius? I can't think of a single one.

Hell..........I can OLNY think of a few men in that catagory. That word is seriously over used.

The folks listed so far in this thread come no where near Genius level.

Joni Mitchell?

His entire post had me doing the "Who Farted?" face.

While I don't agree with every name listed in here either, you have to be tone-deaf and all-around-not-that-bright to say that none of the women mentioned in here, are geniuses.

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Reply #26 posted 02/01/12 8:57am

Graycap23

Musical Genius:

Prince

Stevie Wonder

Ray Charles

Bootsy

Donny Hathaway

Quincy Jones (maybe)

................................that is it 4 human existence.

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Reply #27 posted 02/01/12 8:58am

smoothcriminal
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Dren5 said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

Joni Mitchell?

His entire post had me doing the "Who Farted?" face.

While I don't agree with every name listed in here either, you have to be tone-deaf and all-around-not-that-bright to say that none of the women mentioned in here, are geniuses.

Joni Mitchell...

Aretha Franklin...

Ella Fitzgerald...

It's not a stretch at all to say any of the above are geniuses.

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Reply #28 posted 02/01/12 9:07am

TD3

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Graycap23 said:

Genius? I can't think of a single one.

Hell..........I can OLNY think of a few men in that catagory. That word is seriously over used.

The folks listed so far in this thread come no where near Genius level.

That's very true and its not a word I'd like to think I don't throw lightly.

I prefer to use the word brilliant, though in another thread I did say Ms. Billie Holiday was a genius and I'm standing beyhind that because it's true. Ms. Holiday, she tore up the concept of singing the melody straight out and in time. If you ever get to see the sheet music of the songwriters from"The Great American Songbook" you'll get a fully understand and appreciation of what she did to rearranged their songs. Basically she introduced new notes while disregarding others, in the melody. She developed the whole conept of singing behind the beat.... delaying the start of a line (the rhythm of the melodic line) and catching up later. Nobody was doing this before she came on the scene but almost ever singer of the twenty- century incorporated this technique into their singing more or less.

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Reply #29 posted 02/01/12 9:34am

Dren5

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Graycap23 said:

Musical Genius:

Prince

Stevie Wonder

Ray Charles

Bootsy

Donny Hathaway

Quincy Jones (maybe)

................................that is it 4 human existence.

It's wild to me the way you always try to pass your subjective opinions off as absolute law. lol

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