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Reply #30 posted 01/26/19 10:28am

bonatoc

avatar

luvsexy4all said:

no sense of Prince humour....same with GB


GB was humour?
AH, OK!
I knew I wasn't reading it properly.

UTCM is so great a concept.
Y'all don't get it.

"Woman overboard!"

Miles Davis was right.
He's hilarious. No star has been as funny.
Maybe in the fifties, when the world seemed
an alright place to live.

Or was it 'a better place 2 die'?

[Edited 1/26/19 10:32am]

The Colors R brighter, the Bond is much tighter
No Child's a failure
Until the Blue Sailboat sails him away from his dreams
Don't Ever Lose, Don't Ever Lose
Don't Ever Lose Your Dreams
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Reply #31 posted 01/26/19 10:50am

luvsexy4all

bonatoc said:

luvsexy4all said:

no sense of Prince humour....same with GB


GB was humour?
AH, OK!
I knew I wasn't reading it properly.

UTCM is so great a concept.
Y'all don't get it.

"Woman overboard!"

Miles Davis was right.
He's hilarious. No star has been as funny.
Maybe in the fifties, when the world seemed
an alright place to live.

Or was it 'a better place 2 die'?

[Edited 1/26/19 10:32am]

the humour IN GB...not the theme

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Reply #32 posted 01/26/19 12:46pm

bonatoc

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http://prince.org/msg/7/451309?fbclid=IwAR0Fx4lOWWR_QJvoHNbOFIPjLu5VJk9lUcR-a2_22bzaiosa0HIR9La0cP4

[Edited 1/26/19 12:47pm]

The Colors R brighter, the Bond is much tighter
No Child's a failure
Until the Blue Sailboat sails him away from his dreams
Don't Ever Lose, Don't Ever Lose
Don't Ever Lose Your Dreams
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Reply #33 posted 01/26/19 1:32pm

SoulAlive

herb4 said:

You know what could have really improved this film? Casting Prince as an open mic/street musician instead of lounge pianist. This way they could have worked in some more musical numbers and made the character more believable.

nod I also think the movie would have worked better if it had been in color.

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Reply #34 posted 01/26/19 2:35pm

PeteSilas

SoulAlive said:

herb4 said:

You know what could have really improved this film? Casting Prince as an open mic/street musician instead of lounge pianist. This way they could have worked in some more musical numbers and made the character more believable.

nod I also think the movie would have worked better if it had been in color.

it wasn't all that bad in retrospect, Prince obviously felt a bit like the character, a man who is used by women for money. some interesting tells of how color struck Prince was in those days, how he was distancing himself from his own blackness, the previously mentioned scenes between him and jerome and also the scene with the older black lady who said she missed him, prince was terrified and was running away from blackness, good scene. like i say, he showed some promise, he should have turned his ego down and worked with a real filmaker where he maybe could have had input but not the only or final word. why he didn't learn from this and made the same mistake with GB I'll never know.

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Reply #35 posted 01/26/19 2:41pm

violetcrush

PeteSilas said:

SoulAlive said:

nod I also think the movie would have worked better if it had been in color.

it wasn't all that bad in retrospect, Prince obviously felt a bit like the character, a man who is used by women for money. some interesting tells of how color struck Prince was in those days, how he was distancing himself from his own blackness, the previously mentioned scenes between him and jerome and also the scene with the older black lady who said she missed him, prince was terrified and was running away from blackness, good scene. like i say, he showed some promise, he should have turned his ego down and worked with a real filmaker where he maybe could have had input but not the only or final word. why he didn't learn from this and made the same mistake with GB I'll never know.

Control....had to have complete control. His way, only.

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Reply #36 posted 01/26/19 2:53pm

SoulAlive

PeteSilas said:

it wasn't all that bad in retrospect, Prince obviously felt a bit like the character, a man who is used by women for money. some interesting tells of how color struck Prince was in those days, how he was distancing himself from his own blackness, the previously mentioned scenes between him and jerome and also the scene with the older black lady who said she missed him, prince was terrified and was running away from blackness, good scene. like i say, he showed some promise, he should have turned his ego down and worked with a real filmaker where he maybe could have had input but not the only or final word. why he didn't learn from this and made the same mistake with GB I'll never know.

hmmm

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Reply #37 posted 01/26/19 3:08pm

PeteSilas

violetcrush said:

PeteSilas said:

it wasn't all that bad in retrospect, Prince obviously felt a bit like the character, a man who is used by women for money. some interesting tells of how color struck Prince was in those days, how he was distancing himself from his own blackness, the previously mentioned scenes between him and jerome and also the scene with the older black lady who said she missed him, prince was terrified and was running away from blackness, good scene. like i say, he showed some promise, he should have turned his ego down and worked with a real filmaker where he maybe could have had input but not the only or final word. why he didn't learn from this and made the same mistake with GB I'll never know.

Control....had to have complete control. His way, only.

i know, but he did ok with sott, not successful financially but pretty good artistically. this topic has been brought up before and i've brought up how the bad said "he directs quite well" steven berkoff said that. He could have been better had he just given it time. He obviously loved film, old films particularly and was a true buff. I'm thankful we have the movies, whatever their drawbacks are.

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Reply #38 posted 01/26/19 3:17pm

violetcrush

PeteSilas said:

violetcrush said:

Control....had to have complete control. His way, only.

i know, but he did ok with sott, not successful financially but pretty good artistically. this topic has been brought up before and i've brought up how the bad said "he directs quite well" steven berkoff said that. He could have been better had he just given it time. He obviously loved film, old films particularly and was a true buff. I'm thankful we have the movies, whatever their drawbacks are.

SOTT was more performance and a few "vingnettes" to give the songs a storyline. Not a whole lot to direct there. I agree, he certainly made the effort for UTCM, but I think he just needed an experienced Director to at least give suggestions or advice. It's been written that Prince was very controlling with the PR filming - pulling things, adding things - but Magnoli was an experienced film editor, which was a huge benefit to that film. What he did with the montages and how he edited that film was a huge part of its appeal. Prince needed that for UTCM.

*

For GB, I think he was just forcing that film to happen. He was sitting on that for several years, and it went through numerous story revisions. I think the fact that at least a few celebrity names backed out of it should have been a signal for him. I read that he refused to alter or add to his script (which WB thought was just an intial draft) in any way, so he lost support for the film early on.

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Reply #39 posted 01/26/19 3:17pm

SoulAlive

Movie Review : A Misbegotten 'Moon' From Prince

July 04, 1986|PATRICK GOLDSTEIN (Los Angeles Times)

Prince is one of pop music's most gifted and enigmatic figures. But talent and mystery are just two of the many key ingredients missing from "Under the Cherry Moon" (citywide), a dismal flop that will probably be Exhibit A for years to come in any debate over the wisdom of letting pop stars make their own vanity Hollywood projects.

Prince both stars in and directs the film, which was shot in black and white and (thanks to crack cinematographer Michael Ballhaus) has a sultry, film noirlook that seems designed to recapture some of the glamour and romance of the pop idol's favorite 1940s dramas. Unfortunately, none of this drama or romance ever manages to surface, even for a moment, in this misbegotten film. Most of the scenes are so awkward, so hopelessly inept that the whole affair looks like a student film that somehow inherited a multimillion-dollar budget.

Even with a sound track full of dazzling Prince originals, the movie has no real passion or fireworks. If "Purple Rain" gave us the thrill of seeing a film star born, then "Cherry Moon" has the dreary air of a star vehicle born under a bad sign--it might well be called "Under the Cherry Bomb."

Prince is Christopher Tracy, an itinerant American piano player who does double duty as a gigolo, entertaining affluent vacationers along the French Riviera. The movie opens with Tracy at the piano, trying to seduce a rich divorcee (Francesca Annis), aided by Tricky (Jerome Benton), who slips his pal helpful hints on cocktail napkins. Tracy is a hustler who's ready to reform and he meets his match in Mary Sharon (newcomer Kristin Scott-Thomas), a spoiled young heiress with a real sense of style--she greets her guests at her gala 21st birthday party clad only in a towel.

The rest might be straight out of the chapter of movie history titled "Addicted to Love." Tracy turns up the heat and our ice princess' heart melts. The only thing keeping these angels apart is Mary's dastardly dad (Steven Berkoff), who'll do anything to ruin their romance. In theory, with a dandy like Prince, who dwells in the land of erotic dreams, this could have been the start of a magnificent obsession. Instead, it's the beginning of a resoundingly dull fashion parade.

Prince and his screenwriter, Becky Johnston, don't have a clue on how to construct a compelling story line, much less a tragic love affair. (At one point, Mary actually sighs, "Christopher, I'm afraid." Of what? "Of us.") Worse still, there's absolutely no chemistry between the love-struck pair. Watching them tango on a balcony over the sea, cooing woefully lame words of love, you find yourself more intrigued by Prince's paisley outfit--you wonder which set of buttons really work, the ones on the front of the jacket, at the back or along his pants leg.

The film attempts to emphasize the gulf between this idle rich girl and her scruffy suitor, but Tracy is so pampered, self-absorbed and sleekly feline that it's hard for the audience to imagine any rigid social barriers between them. Anyway, it's hard to take a gigolo seriously who wears frilly, white threads that look as though they were made out of leftover material from Ginger Rogers' feathery gown in "Top Hat."

In "Purple Rain," Prince played to his strengths, not only showing off his Stagger Lee stage magic, but revealing a glimpse of a troubled, vulnerable man-child, tormented as much by his rakish charms as by his adolescent fury. Here, Prince clumsily tries to show another side, the exuberant imp. But without anyone on the set to provide a fresh perspective (the film's original director, Mary Lambert, was fired early in the shooting), Prince falters badly.

His comedy scenes with Benton play like bad improv sketches, with Prince coming off like a second-rate Morris Day and Benton like a loutish buffoon. Coated with thick makeup, a spit-curl positioned over his left eye, Prince often appears more prissy than paramour. He's so full of twitchy, self-conscious gestures that you never feel any jolt of sexual tension--it's as if he studied the art of movie seduction by watching old Paul Lynde movies.

Prince clearly has more enchanting heroes--he makes a point of showing us that Tracy keeps a Miles Davis album propped up by his bed. But none of Davis' sensuous cool rubs off on this ponderously dull picture. "Under the Cherry Moon" (MPAA-rated PG-13) doesn't show us a star falling in love, just a guy who's fallen in love with his act.

'UNDER THE CHERRY MOON'

A Warner Bros. Film presentation. Producers Bob Cavallo, Joe Ruffalo & Steve Fargnoli. Director Prince. Writer Becky Johnston. Camera Michael Ballhaus. Music Prince & the Revolution. Editor Eva Gardos. Production Design Richard Sylbert. Costume Design Marie France. Creative Consultant Mary Lambert. With Prince, Jerome Benton, Steven Berkoff, Emmanuelle Sallet, Alexandra Stewart, Francesca Annis and Kristin Scott-Thomas.

Running time: 1 hour 38 minutes.

MPAA rating: PG-13 (Parents are strongly cautioned. Some material may be inappropriate for children under 13.)

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Reply #40 posted 01/26/19 3:24pm

violetcrush

"His comedy scenes with Benton play like bad improv sketches, with Prince coming off like a second-rate Morris Day and Benton like a loutish buffoon. Coated with thick makeup, a spit-curl positioned over his left eye, Prince often appears more prissy than paramour. He's so full of twitchy, self-conscious gestures that you never feel any jolt of sexual tension--it's as if he studied the art of movie seduction by watching old Paul Lynde movies."

*

Ouch!! No wonder Prince had an emotional breakdown after the film was done confused

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Reply #41 posted 01/26/19 3:27pm

PeteSilas

violetcrush said:

PeteSilas said:

i know, but he did ok with sott, not successful financially but pretty good artistically. this topic has been brought up before and i've brought up how the bad said "he directs quite well" steven berkoff said that. He could have been better had he just given it time. He obviously loved film, old films particularly and was a true buff. I'm thankful we have the movies, whatever their drawbacks are.

SOTT was more performance and a few "vingnettes" to give the songs a storyline. Not a whole lot to direct there. I agree, he certainly made the effort for UTCM, but I think he just needed an experienced Director to at least give suggestions or advice. It's been written that Prince was very controlling with the PR filming - pulling things, adding things - but Magnoli was an experienced film editor, which was a huge benefit to that film. What he did with the montages and how he edited that film was a huge part of its appeal. Prince needed that for UTCM.

*

For GB, I think he was just forcing that film to happen. He was sitting on that for several years, and it went through numerous story revisions. I think the fact that at least a few celebrity names backed out of it should have been a signal for him. I read that he refused to alter or add to his script (which WB thought was just an intial draft) in any way, so he lost support for the film early on.

I mentioned "timing" before, purple rain wasn't that good, from my personal perspective it was perfect, some of the things that are common to many adolescents (being a misfit for one) but the biggest was having this largely mysterious, bizarre man who we'd been kinda watching with interest for years, who hardly spoke so when he did, it was rivetting, that was a big part of that movie's success, his mystique. then he tries the morris character and it doesn't really work, i preferred the isolated, lean, hungry genius over the silly manwhore.

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Reply #42 posted 01/26/19 3:41pm

violetcrush

PeteSilas said:

violetcrush said:

SOTT was more performance and a few "vingnettes" to give the songs a storyline. Not a whole lot to direct there. I agree, he certainly made the effort for UTCM, but I think he just needed an experienced Director to at least give suggestions or advice. It's been written that Prince was very controlling with the PR filming - pulling things, adding things - but Magnoli was an experienced film editor, which was a huge benefit to that film. What he did with the montages and how he edited that film was a huge part of its appeal. Prince needed that for UTCM.

*

For GB, I think he was just forcing that film to happen. He was sitting on that for several years, and it went through numerous story revisions. I think the fact that at least a few celebrity names backed out of it should have been a signal for him. I read that he refused to alter or add to his script (which WB thought was just an intial draft) in any way, so he lost support for the film early on.

I mentioned "timing" before, purple rain wasn't that good, from my personal perspective it was perfect, some of the things that are common to many adolescents (being a misfit for one) but the biggest was having this largely mysterious, bizarre man who we'd been kinda watching with interest for years, who hardly spoke so when he did, it was rivetting, that was a big part of that movie's success, his mystique. then he tries the morris character and it doesn't really work, i preferred the isolated, lean, hungry genius over the silly manwhore.

Right, for the fans, his look and that role were a complete 180 from his character in PR. Of course, we know he was trying to distance himself from that project and expand artistically, but the public wasn't ready for that switch. I think overall UTCM was too over-the-top, and as most of the critics said, just not believable as a legitimate storyline.

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Reply #43 posted 01/26/19 3:54pm

onlyforaminute

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PeteSilas said:



onlyforaminute said:


What did the critics themselves say? I never read them back then so don't remember.



they killed it, were brutal as some of these other posters show. I don't think it was that bad, and prince never looked better, never, the wardrobe was on point, the music was brilliant and i've thought prince could have been a good filmaker, he showed good cinemetography here, it falls short because of his ego. as a fan, lots of it was just embarrassing at the time, there is the apocrophyl tale that he laid down in his studio and realized how bad it was but knowing it was too late to do anything about it. My own theory was that he saw morris steal PR with a character he actually coached morris to do, it was an alter ego for Prince and so he thought he could do that too and do it better, taking his sidekick along with him. He was funny but Morris delivery was different, prince's "funny" was always because he was so fucking queer (not meaning in the sexual sense, in the bizarre sense).



I was front and center on its release date very pregnant which may or may not have influenced what i saw. I could see it wasn't going to get the same rave as PR, it was campy and silly and not an underdog story who wins in the end, it's an itty bitty Valentino which dies for love in the end, which i want to add had me very weepy and mad leaving the theater so not a ton of re-sees like i did with PR which made you rejoice in the end definitely not something people are into. But personally over the decades ive preferred it over PR. shrug I never saw it as great cinema but i never saw it as horrific or anywhere near the worst movie ever made, just average campy and silly comfort movie.
Time keeps on slipping into the future...


This moment is all there is...
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Reply #44 posted 01/26/19 3:58pm

PeteSilas

violetcrush said:

PeteSilas said:

I mentioned "timing" before, purple rain wasn't that good, from my personal perspective it was perfect, some of the things that are common to many adolescents (being a misfit for one) but the biggest was having this largely mysterious, bizarre man who we'd been kinda watching with interest for years, who hardly spoke so when he did, it was rivetting, that was a big part of that movie's success, his mystique. then he tries the morris character and it doesn't really work, i preferred the isolated, lean, hungry genius over the silly manwhore.

Right, for the fans, his look and that role were a complete 180 from his character in PR. Of course, we know he was trying to distance himself from that project and expand artistically, but the public wasn't ready for that switch. I think overall UTCM was too over-the-top, and as most of the critics said, just not believable as a legitimate storyline.

what i wonder is what the hell made him deviate from "the dawn" that was always so cryptically mentioned as what we always thought would be a Purple Rain sequel. why would he not do that? why, why why? yes, i know he had reservations and fears of the bigness and the artistic stagnation of Purple Rain but most likely, it wouldn't have been as big anyway and it probably would have been better than UTCM and GB if it was done right. I dunno, the people who say he was a druggie all along have plenty of ammo with his silly choices (not that I agree with that).

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Reply #45 posted 01/26/19 4:12pm

violetcrush

PeteSilas said:

violetcrush said:

Right, for the fans, his look and that role were a complete 180 from his character in PR. Of course, we know he was trying to distance himself from that project and expand artistically, but the public wasn't ready for that switch. I think overall UTCM was too over-the-top, and as most of the critics said, just not believable as a legitimate storyline.

what i wonder is what the hell made him deviate from "the dawn" that was always so cryptically mentioned as what we always thought would be a Purple Rain sequel. why would he not do that? why, why why? yes, i know he had reservations and fears of the bigness and the artistic stagnation of Purple Rain but most likely, it wouldn't have been as big anyway and it probably would have been better than UTCM and GB if it was done right. I dunno, the people who say he was a druggie all along have plenty of ammo with his silly choices (not that I agree with that).

I think he was just "done" with the whole PR thing. He wanted to move on to other stories, sounds and styles. He had started planning for that film and reoording the music in early '83, so by 1985 he was ready to move on. Interestingly, he ended up going back to it for GB, because WB would not support the film unless he incorporated the PR "sequel" story into the film. Of course, by that time it was way past its expiration date.

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Reply #46 posted 01/26/19 4:16pm

PeteSilas

violetcrush said:

PeteSilas said:

what i wonder is what the hell made him deviate from "the dawn" that was always so cryptically mentioned as what we always thought would be a Purple Rain sequel. why would he not do that? why, why why? yes, i know he had reservations and fears of the bigness and the artistic stagnation of Purple Rain but most likely, it wouldn't have been as big anyway and it probably would have been better than UTCM and GB if it was done right. I dunno, the people who say he was a druggie all along have plenty of ammo with his silly choices (not that I agree with that).

I think he was just "done" with the whole PR thing. He wanted to move on to other stories, sounds and styles. He had started planning for that film and reoording the music in early '83, so by 1985 he was ready to move on. Interestingly, he ended up going back to it for GB, because WB would not support the film unless he incorporated the PR "sequel" story into the film. Of course, by that time it was way past its expiration date.

i get that but that exhaustion was only temporary, does anyone remember how he was actually so sick of the entire thing that he said that the florida show was the last he'd ever do? that obviously wasn't true, he just needed a break from the inconvievable stress of superstardom. a sequel wouldn't have done that well anyways. he couldn't have done it musically though, the styles of music he was going into would have been a valid point, he had left behind the pr/1999 sound for the most part. admirable but i'm sure he regretted not milking the shit out of pr later, especially during his waning days of album sales when he needed a lot more than the long forgotten sales of Purple Rain to get him through.

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Reply #47 posted 01/26/19 4:57pm

violetcrush

PeteSilas said:



violetcrush said:




PeteSilas said:



what i wonder is what the hell made him deviate from "the dawn" that was always so cryptically mentioned as what we always thought would be a Purple Rain sequel. why would he not do that? why, why why? yes, i know he had reservations and fears of the bigness and the artistic stagnation of Purple Rain but most likely, it wouldn't have been as big anyway and it probably would have been better than UTCM and GB if it was done right. I dunno, the people who say he was a druggie all along have plenty of ammo with his silly choices (not that I agree with that).




I think he was just "done" with the whole PR thing. He wanted to move on to other stories, sounds and styles. He had started planning for that film and reoording the music in early '83, so by 1985 he was ready to move on. Interestingly, he ended up going back to it for GB, because WB would not support the film unless he incorporated the PR "sequel" story into the film. Of course, by that time it was way past its expiration date.



i get that but that exhaustion was only temporary, does anyone remember how he was actually so sick of the entire thing that he said that the florida show was the last he'd ever do? that obviously wasn't true, he just needed a break from the inconvievable stress of superstardom. a sequel wouldn't have done that well anyways. he couldn't have done it musically though, the styles of music he was going into would have been a valid point, he had left behind the pr/1999 sound for the most part. admirable but i'm sure he regretted not milking the shit out of pr later, especially during his waning days of album sales when he needed a lot more than the long forgotten sales of Purple Rain to get him through.


Nah, he was done with the whole thing. Remember, he was recording for ATWIAD while still touring for PR. The album was done by Spring '85
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Reply #48 posted 01/26/19 5:41pm

SoulAlive

violetcrush said:

"His comedy scenes with Benton play like bad improv sketches, with Prince coming off like a second-rate Morris Day and Benton like a loutish buffoon. Coated with thick makeup, a spit-curl positioned over his left eye, Prince often appears more prissy than paramour. He's so full of twitchy, self-conscious gestures that you never feel any jolt of sexual tension--it's as if he studied the art of movie seduction by watching old Paul Lynde movies."

*

Ouch!! No wonder Prince had an emotional breakdown after the film was done confused

It's interesting that,in so many of the reviews,the critics focus heavily on Prince's look.My local newspaper's review said that "Prince has never been more androgynous and prissy" than he is in this film eek

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Reply #49 posted 01/26/19 6:19pm

onlyforaminute

avatar

SoulAlive said:



violetcrush said:



"His comedy scenes with Benton play like bad improv sketches, with Prince coming off like a second-rate Morris Day and Benton like a loutish buffoon. Coated with thick makeup, a spit-curl positioned over his left eye, Prince often appears more prissy than paramour. He's so full of twitchy, self-conscious gestures that you never feel any jolt of sexual tension--it's as if he studied the art of movie seduction by watching old Paul Lynde movies."





*





Ouch!! No wonder Prince had an emotional breakdown after the film was done confused











It's interesting that,in so many of the reviews,the critics focus heavily on Prince's look.My local newspaper's review said that "Prince has never been more androgynous and prissy" than he is in this film eek




I could see how some of that could make people cringe and squirm it was the 80s, certain behaviors were still unacceptable.
Time keeps on slipping into the future...


This moment is all there is...
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Reply #50 posted 01/26/19 6:21pm

violetcrush

SoulAlive said:

violetcrush said:

"His comedy scenes with Benton play like bad improv sketches, with Prince coming off like a second-rate Morris Day and Benton like a loutish buffoon. Coated with thick makeup, a spit-curl positioned over his left eye, Prince often appears more prissy than paramour. He's so full of twitchy, self-conscious gestures that you never feel any jolt of sexual tension--it's as if he studied the art of movie seduction by watching old Paul Lynde movies."

*

Ouch!! No wonder Prince had an emotional breakdown after the film was done confused

It's interesting that,in so many of the reviews,the critics focus heavily on Prince's look.My local newspaper's review said that "Prince has never been more androgynous and prissy" than he is in this film eek

Yes, he got a lot of flac for that look. I think the cropped shirts, short slicked back hair and the heels were just too much for people to absorb at that time. He had the heels in PR, but I think they were sitll more masculine and his look was much more masculine. He looked "pretty" in UTCM.

*

The best part of that film was the Girls & Boys and Mountains videos biggrin

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Reply #51 posted 01/26/19 6:22pm

violetcrush

Oh lawd....I really think I'm gonna have to watch it tonight. See what y'all have done here??!! lol

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Reply #52 posted 01/26/19 6:41pm

onlyforaminute

avatar

violetcrush said:



SoulAlive said:




violetcrush said:



"His comedy scenes with Benton play like bad improv sketches, with Prince coming off like a second-rate Morris Day and Benton like a loutish buffoon. Coated with thick makeup, a spit-curl positioned over his left eye, Prince often appears more prissy than paramour. He's so full of twitchy, self-conscious gestures that you never feel any jolt of sexual tension--it's as if he studied the art of movie seduction by watching old Paul Lynde movies."





*





Ouch!! No wonder Prince had an emotional breakdown after the film was done confused











It's interesting that,in so many of the reviews,the critics focus heavily on Prince's look.My local newspaper's review said that "Prince has never been more androgynous and prissy" than he is in this film eek




Yes, he got a lot of flac for that look. I think the cropped shirts, short slicked back hair and the heels were just too much for people to absorb at that time. He had the heels in PR, but I think they were sitll more masculine and his look was much more masculine. He looked "pretty" in UTCM.


*


The best part of that film was the Girls & Boys and Mountains videos biggrin




I think the masculinity thing played heavily in its reception. Who could relate to it? Not saying it wss the only issue it wasn't, still.
Time keeps on slipping into the future...


This moment is all there is...
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Reply #53 posted 01/26/19 6:43pm

Germanegro

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idea2 This article dug up by Bonatoc is the analysis that "Under the Cherry Moon" deserves--critics be damned.

>

Replace the French Riviera setting with say, Miami, and replace main actors Prince and Jerome Benton with, say, an age-equivalent Elvis Presley and Frankie Avalon or Mickey Rooney, and you then have a respectable pop-culture-cinema gem. I think that "race factor" was one part of the audience inability to connect to the tale. The story was a romantic dramedy--ethnic prejudices be damned!

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Replace actor Kristin Scott Thomas with Madonna, and you would have probably had a star-vehicle film to attract at least a few million more eyeballs to the movie's premiere--Prince's ego be damned.

>

The film was cinematographaly sound with humor drawn throughout--sometimes ham-handedlly, and these 2 factors, plus the Prince-cult fanfare, to me make the film a charm.

>

(mike-drop)

peace oral

bonatoc said:

SoulAlive said:

No,it really isn't smile


Yessidiz, Christofferdammit!


NEW POSITION: A DEFENSE OF "UNDER THE CHERRY MOON"

by Peter Sobczynski

May 4, 2016





In the wake of the shocking death of musical icon Prince last month, his landmark 1984 film debut “Purple Rain” reappeared in movie theaters across the country. Like many of his fans, I took a couple of hours to watch it on the big screen, where it belongs. (In all honesty, I also went because I was seeing “Mother’s Day” later that day, figured that seeing it might help towards evening out my psychic scales.)




Watching it again, I’m still convinced that it is either one of the best terrible movies ever made or one of the worst great movies of all time. In many ways, it is kind of an awful film that takes a narrative that might have seemed thin for a later vehicle and added dime-store psychology and an attitude towards women that even back then was retrograde at best (including such infamous moments as a woman being tossed into a trash dumpster for a laugh and the bit in which Apollonia Kotero is told to purify herself in the waters of Lake Minnetonka); it’s borderline disturbed at worst.




At the same time, “Purple Rain” was made with a great style and energy. And unlike many rock stars who tried to make the transition to the big screen (only to find that whatever charisma they displayed on stage in front of thousands of screaming fans did not translate to standing before a movie camera), Prince himself turned out to be a mesmerizing screen presence, even when he was just standing there, performing the songs from the spectacular soundtrack.




There is some great stuff in “Purple Rain,” of course, and in the annals of rock movie history, it deserves its place of prominence. But it’s most significant legacy of the film, at least from a cinematic standpoint, it is that film’s massive success ensured that Prince, if he so desired, could do basically anything he wanted, no matter how outlandish, for a follow-up and he could get it financed by people hoping that he would give them “Purple Rain 2”—either literally or metaphorically.




Of course, as anyone who was following Prince even back then, he was never one for repeating himself or doing the expected. Taking advantage of the power he possessed at this time in Hollywood, he used it to produce and make his directorial debut with “Under the Cherry Moon” (1986), one of the strangest and craziest movies of its time. It’s a film so utterly defiant of what one might have rightfully expected from a Prince vehicle that even his loyal fans stayed away in droves and it immediately went down in the annals of screen history as a disaster that more or less killed Prince’s viability as a screen icon.




The hell of it is that once one gets past the fact that it does not resemble “Purple Rain 2” in even the slightest, it reveals itself to be an offbeat gem that may one day go down as the MTV era equivalent of Marcel L’Herbier’s infamous 1924 silent epic “L’inhumaine”—an unabashed vanity project that both revels in and transcends its solipsistic underpinnings in ways that are alternately perplexing and endearing, an endeavor further bolstered by a stunning visual style and a central performance that, for better or worse, you cannot take your eyes off of for a second, not that you ever have a chance to do so.




Under-the-Cherry-Moon-PS-2016-2.jpg




In “Under the Cherry Moon,” Prince and fellow “Purple Rain” refugee Jerome Benton play Christopher Tracy and Tricky, a pair of friends from Miami who have relocated to the French Riviera and earn their living as gigolos insinuating themselves into the bedrooms and pocketbooks of the countless rich women they come across. One day, the newspapers announce the imminent arrival of Mary Sharon (Kristin Scott Thomas, in her screen debut), a long woman with serious daddy issues about her often-absent billionaire father (and considering that her father is played by the always-terrifying Steven Berkoff, can you blame her?) and a $50 million dollar trust fund that she has just come into. This is the proverbial big fish that the Christopher and Tricky have been waiting for—the one where the ultimate prize is matrimony—and they both set off to win both her heart and her millions.




However, Mary is not quite as naïve as some might think, and fails to fall for their usual business at first. Eventually, Christopher’s bizarre seduction techniques (which have to be seen to be believed) win her over and she falls in love with him. Unexpectedly, Christopher finds himself falling in love with her as well and not just because of the money, a development that does not sit well with Tricky and leads to the inevitable scene in which he says exactly the wrong things at exactly the wrong time with exactly the wrong people present.




To further complicate matters, Mary’s father arrives, gets a load of the situation and is determined to get Christopher out of the picture once and for all and if a payoff does not work, he is more than willing to go to more extreme measures to get the task done. Oh yeah—while a number of Prince songs (including the smash hit “Kiss”) can be intermittently heard on the soundtrack and Christopher does work as a piano player, he doesn’t actually perform a song on-screen until nearly the halfway point when he kicks in with an ecstatic rendition of “Girls and Boys.” After that, his only other on-screen performance comes during the end credits when (Spoiler Alert!) he reunites with the Revolution in Heaven to jam out on “Mountains.”

Man, that must have been one hell of a pitch meeting.




If one applies normal critical standard to “Under the Cherry Moon,” it could easily be dismissed as little more than a vanity project gone horribly wrong. The screenplay by Becky Johnston, who would go on to write the scripts for “The Prince of Tides” and “Seven Years in Tibet,” plods along aimlessly and is laden with clichés so hoary that they seem to have been excavated from a museum. The performances are all over the place, ranging from the barely-there underacting by Kristin Scott Thomas (who was a replacement for Prince’s then-girlfriend Susannah Melvoin, originally cast in the part—a rumor that Madonna was considered for the part as sends the mind reeling) to the scenery-chewing histrionics of Berkoff (who was also a replacement when the originally cast Terrence Stamp quit early in the production).




The romantic chemistry between the two leads is practically nonexistent, which works in the early scenes when Mary is keeping Christopher at arms length, but not so much in the later scenes when they are supposed to be in love. Frankly, there is more genuine chemistry between Christopher and his cohort Tricky throughout, which adds an intriguing layer to the proceedings (and there is the insinuation that they have engaged in threesomes with their sexy landlord in order to beat paying the rent), it has the effect of making Mary seem like the beard than the object of desire.




And yet, if you can get past those flaws—and I admit that may be a chore for some—“Under the Cherry Moon” proves to be an utterly fascinating film thanks to the multiple contributions on both sides of the camera by Prince. As he demonstrated in “Purple Rain,” he is not a good actor in the conventional sense, but as a screen presence, he is undeniably captivating. Unlike a lot of music stars, he is able to rethink his mystique into cinematic terms in ways that are strangely compelling.




The difference here is that this time around, he gets a chance to show off a sly sense of humor that was largely absent in the generally self-serious “Purple Rain.” Throughout the film, he demonstrates crack comic timing that manifests itself in everything from his wild way with dialogue (as soon as you hear it, you will be imitating his unique method of saying “Garçon!”) to his cheerful willingness to engage in overt mugging for the camera, which somehow fits his character perfectly.




Even better are the scenes featuring him and Jerome Benton (who stole scenes in “Purple Rain” as Morris Day’s aide-de-camp), in which the two go at it like a classic comedy duo romping through some of their most beloved bits—in some alternate version of Hollywood, Prince and Benton continued the act and went on to become the modern-day Martin & Lewis in a series of classic comedies. (If you doubt this, then go to YouTube and look up the phrase “wrecka stow” and prepare to be delighted.)

Under-the-Cherry-Moon-PS-2016-3.png



As a director, Prince (who took over the reins from Mary Lambert early in the production) proved to be just as fascinating behind the camera as in front of it. Yes, there are the kind of clumsily-staged and oddly-paced scenes that are the hallmarks of most first-time filmmakers, but the film as a whole is so ambitious that those hiccups can easily be ignored.




At a time when most filmmakers were trying to approximate the look and style of music video, Prince, in conjunction with German-born cinematographer Michael Ballhaus(just beginning a Hollywood career that would see him shot such films as “Broadcast News,” “Bram Stoker’s Dracula” and a number of Martin Scorsese classics including “The Last Temptation of Christ,” “Goodfellas” and “The Departed”) and legendary production designer Richard Sylbert, created a film that, while set in the present day, was a deliberate evocation of old-time Hollywood glamour that also served as an ideal demonstration of the eternal glories of black-and-white filmmaking.




However, the throwback visuals are more than just a stylistic ploy. By taking a film that looks and feels as if Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers will be popping up for a musical number and then placing someone like Prince—a creature who would never have been admitted into the star pantheon of that era for any number of reasons—in the middle of it all, it offers up a subtextual tension that plays nicely with the more overt conflict between the outside Christopher and the closed world of money and privilege in which Mary resides, even if she herself does not completely embody it.




The music was perversely released on vinyl with the title “Parade” rather than the name of the film it was featured in. The blend of funk, rock and dance sounds mixed together with both American and European sensibilities was underrated at the time (although a hit by any normal standards, “Parade” did not come close to the sales of “Purple Rain,’” and the electrifying “Kiss” was the only big single off of it) but it plays beautifully today.




Oddly, the music was de-emphasized in the film—Thomas gets to perform an on-screen musical number before Prince does—and it is only when you listen to the full album that you can fully realize how strong the songs are. (This is most evident with “Sometimes It Snows In April,” which in the film underscores one of the most awkward moments but comes to full emotional life when heard on its own.) The lack of full-scale musical numbers is especially strange when you consider that this is a movie practically begging to burst out into full-scale production numbers throughout. Like the film, the soundtrack is a strange and lovely meditation of life, love and death that is shot through with a lot of humor and which finds Prince pursuing his own distinct personal vision, no matter what the possible commercial repercussions might have been.




As it turned out, those repercussions would prove to be somewhat severe because when “Under the Cherry Moon” premiered, it was largely lambasted by critics (though a few critics, including J. Hoberman, were brave enough to defend it); when audiences discovered that it was a Prince film that was in black-and-white, that he didn’t sing much and that wasn’t “Purple Rain 2,” they stayed away. To be fair, even if the film had been a more conventional outing, there is a good chance that it still would have failed, as while “Purple Rain” was released at a time when the Hollywood/MTV crossover was at its zenith, this one happened to come at a time when the marketplace was glutted with films starring rock stars who were being rejected by even their most ardent fans—it came out a couple of weeks after David Bowie turned up in the Jim Henson fantasy “Labyrinth” and a few weeks before the infamous Madonna bomb “Shanghai Surprise.”




After its failure, Prince seemed to lose interest in the filmmaking process, possibly because he found it difficult to reconcile his one-man-band approach to creating music with the filmmaking process in which hundreds of pairs of hands are required to create even the most singular of visions. In 1987, he directed “Sign ‘O’ the Times,” a concert film tying in with the double album of the same name that caught him at one of his peaks as a live performer but which remains frustratingly unavailable, at least in America.




In 1990, he finally gave everyone the “Purple Rain” sequel they had been clamoring for, but the result, “Graffiti Bridge” (1990), was so silly—though it did contain a killer soundtrack that alone makes it worth watching at least once—that it seemed as if he was trying to kill off his movie career for good. If that was the case, mission accomplished because unless he has a surprise or two in his fabled vault, he never directed a feature film again, though he would do the occasional soundtrack work, most famously for the first “Batman” movie, and turned in a memorable, though admittedly head-scratching, appearance on the sitcom “New Girl.”




Even though I consider it to be the better film, I know that “Under the Cherry Moon” will never threaten “Purple Rain”s placement in the pop culture firmament. And yet, if “Purple Rain” is the “Citizen Kane” of Prince movies—the instant classic that will always be celebrated—then “Under the Cherry Moon” is the “Touch of Evil”—a far more disreputable film that is so delightfully deranged that you stare at it in amazement that such a thing could have possibly emerged from a Hollywood studio.




It plays better now than it did when it came out. With Prince’s untimely death sending both ardent fans and newcomers to his vast and fascinating oeuvre, hopefully some will take a chance and give it another shot and discover for themselves just how good it really is.




Maybe some brave soul will even go so far as to book it as a midnight show so that fans can come together at last to see what they missed out on 30 years earlier. Either way, they will come out of it amused, dazzled and with an immediate desire to purchase the soundtrack if they do not already have it. If you do watch it, make sure that you have a wrecka stow handy.

[Edited 1/25/19 19:36pm]

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Reply #54 posted 01/26/19 6:55pm

violetcrush

^^^^ I don't think Madonna would have been the right fit for the female lead. She was too "street" for that part. Not sure if she could have pulled off the "uptight, educated rich girl" thing in 1986. I think Kristin got that part down, but as the critics said, there was zero chemistry between her and Prince, and that was the focal point of the story. Prince was not a good enough actor to fake that romantic connection, and she was too inexperienced with acting at that point.

*

The writing needed to be better too.

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Reply #55 posted 01/26/19 7:26pm

Germanegro

avatar

^^^Yeah, but do gigilos need chemistry (lol)? All they need is a smile, their sexiness, and to hit it! The romance section of the tale was a bit off-the-mark improv, but it really didn't last too long in the story. I think that people who were expecting, say, Billy Dee Williams up in this piece were just looking up the wrong alley. Re. Madonna's acting skills--okay, but she was a big-name pop talent that probably would have drawn more initial views than an unknown Thomas could have.

(grammar edit)

[Edited 1/26/19 19:31pm]

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Reply #56 posted 01/26/19 7:35pm

onlyforaminute

avatar

Germanegro said:

^^^Yeah, but do gigilos need chemistry (lol)? All they need is a smile, their sexiness, and to hit it! The romance section of the tale was a bit off-the-mark improv, but it really didn't last too long in the story. I think that people who were expecting, say, Billy Dee Williams up in this piece were just looking up the wrong alley. Re. Madonna's acting skills--okay, but she was a big-name pop talent that probably would have drawn more initial views than an unknown Thomas could not.




That look probably would have been better received, thats an image people are familiar with. Not many 5'2 3 4 romantic figures dressed in lace up on the big screen. And have the nerve to mention Liberace of all people.
Time keeps on slipping into the future...


This moment is all there is...
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Reply #57 posted 01/26/19 7:41pm

Germanegro

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:idea:Try Annie Lennox in place of Madonna, perhaps, if she is in the right timeline? The point being that another well-known name set in the cast would have been a bigger draw to the house, if Prince's ego would have allowed it. Writing? Eh. Like people loved Purple Rain for the scintilating dialoge--It's dramatic arc was okay, though.

violetcrush said:

^^^^ I don't think Madonna would have been the right fit for the female lead. She was too "street" for that part. Not sure if she could have pulled off the "uptight, educated rich girl" thing in 1986. I think Kristin got that part down, but as the critics said, there was zero chemistry between her and Prince, and that was the focal point of the story. Prince was not a good enough actor to fake that romantic connection, and she was too inexperienced with acting at that point.

*

The writing needed to be better too.

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Reply #58 posted 01/26/19 7:41pm

violetcrush

Germanegro said:

^^^Yeah, but do gigilos need chemistry (lol)? All they need is a smile, their sexiness, and to hit it! The romance section of the tale was a bit off-the-mark improv, but it really didn't last too long in the story. I think that people who were expecting, say, Billy Dee Williams up in this piece were just looking up the wrong alley. Re. Madonna's acting skills--okay, but she was a big-name pop talent that probably would have drawn more initial views than an unknown Thomas could have.

(grammar edit)

[Edited 1/26/19 19:31pm]

No, I mean the plot of the story was that the rich girl and gigolo unexpectedly fall for each other. That was the center of the story. However, there was zippo romantic or sexual tension between Prince and Kristin. It was just awkward and not believable at all.

*

Madonna many have drawn more initial viewers, but I think all other things being the same it still would have flopped. Remember, she had some major flops too - anybody recall Desperately Seeking Susan? Or, Shanghai Surprise? That one was released about 2 months after UTCM and was as big of a flop biggrin

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Reply #59 posted 01/26/19 8:14pm

calhounlovejoy

I loved it.
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