jaawwnn said:

I got the impression from Susannah and Eric that they never thought it terms of Revolution / Flesh / Madhouse, but more the fact that they did 'things' and Prince packaged and or robbed for projects.

We, as fans, like to compartametise things, but at the time of recording, Prince would just say, 'this is the new direction', but it could change one week to the next.

SquirrelMeat said:

I got the impression from Susannah and Eric that they never thought it terms of Revolution / Flesh / Madhouse, but more the fact that they did 'things' and Prince packaged and or robbed for projects.

We, as fans, like to compartametise things, but at the time of recording, Prince would just say, 'this is the new direction', but it could change one week to the next.

Of course yeah, that'd be one of the reasons so many people are calling for re-releases to be done by sessions rather than by known tracklists.

In my head the Revolution don't break up and Prince also gets to do his own pure funk stuff with Camille so it's basically fan fiction.

jaawwnn said:

jaypotton said:

(was Camille ever offered officially to Warners?)

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<insert Bart van Hemel...sponse>

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Yes, it was, it even got it's own catalog number (1-25543) and, as you can see in the link, test pressings were even made. (to me, it is the ultimate Prince collectors record, more so than the original Black Album or Get Off maxi)

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I would have loved for Dream Factory and Camille to have been released. The Flesh I've never taken to, imho Madhouse 8 (with the exception of the boring Six) is better in every conceivable way.

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Still, as it was, 1987 was magical in what he released, Sign Of The Times, Madhouse 8 and 16, Jill Jones and the Black Album. (albeit an extremely limited edition) Wether it was due to Wendy & Lisa no longer being there or something else I don't know, but after 1987 the magic was gone. Lovesexy and onward still had good music, but it never got that special again and quality control suffered a lot.

mediumdry said:

The way I understand what Susannah and Eric told Squirrelmeat, this had nothing to do with the previous Flesh project, more something like Prince planning to release DF as "The Flesh" instead of "Prince And The Revolution", and a solo (non-Revolution) album as "Camille" instead of "Prince" at about the same time. If my interpretation is right, I wonder whether WB would have been satisfied with releasing 2 records, including a double album, neither using the marketable "Prince" trademark.

The Madhouse concept hadn't yet been conceived at this early stage but the fact that Camille was later to be released as "Camille" and TBA without any credit at all seems to indicate that Prince was eager to try and release solo material without using the name "Prince" in 86-87.

I hope someone from P's camp can eventually clarify this.

This may also have had to do with the troubles he had with The Time and later The Family. He wanted alternate names to release albums as, but since he couldn't rely on others to be the front person, he had to take on that role himself. And having as much music flowing out of him as he had, at that time, it makes sense that he wanted alternate ways to release music, since "Prince" or "Prince and the Revolution" was reined in by WB to roughly 1 album per year.

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Pure speculation, of course, but a possible explanation for all the different guises/names he was contemplating during this time.

databank said:

The way I understand what Susannah and Eric told Squirrelmeat, this had nothing to do with the previous Flesh project, more something like Prince planning to release DF as "The Flesh" instead of "Prince And The Revolution", and a solo (non-Revolution) album as "Camille" instead of "Prince" at about the same time. If my interpretation is right, I wonder whether WB would have been satisfied with releasing 2 records, including a double album, neither using the marketable "Prince" trademark.

The Madhouse concept hadn't yet been conceived at this early stage but the fact that Camille was later to be released as "Camille" and TBA without any credit at all seems to indicate that Prince was eager to try and release solo material without using the name "Prince" in 86-87.

I hope someone from P's camp can eventually clarify this.

Maybe Prince felt that the name "The Revolution" no longer represented the band that know included Eric Leeds, Atlanta Bliss, Miko Weaver, Wally/Brooks/Jerome. Sheila E was part of a number of the sessions around this time. Levi Seacer Jr as well. Jonathan Melvoin sat in on a few sessions and so on.

Maybe Prince saw the future bands as a fluctuating groups of associates?

james said:

I haven't read all the books with details of dates and album configurations, but I always assumed Dream Factory / Crystal Ball were put together AFTER The Revolution split up! Incredible really that these albums were ready to release, but just didn't happen. The Revolution must have been more than a little annoyed at the time (you'd assume!)

no that was the Crystal Ball, which WB wouldn't allow and he had to pair down to SOTT

jaawwnn said:

paulludvig said:

What about Madhouse?

Yeah I was wondering where to fit that in. I suppose really they're just the next step after The Flesh, albums 2 and 3. They're different enough from each other themselves as it is. Sure there's the Jill Jones album as well. 1987 was quite a year!

but not really a good year for the Jill Jones album

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the 1987 Dream Factory years would still have had Sheila E(protege), the Flesh(Madhouse) Jill Jones, probably would have gotten a Camille album
(and probably the Coco Boys (Cat would have still most likely joined the Revolution as dancer)
.
the 1987 SOTT years we lost Sheila E(protege), got Madhouse, Jill Jones

mediumdry said:

This may also have had to do with the troubles he had with The Time and later The Family. He wanted alternate names to release albums as, but since he couldn't rely on others to be the front person, he had to take on that role himself. And having as much music flowing out of him as he had, at that time, it makes sense that he wanted alternate ways to release music, since "Prince" or "Prince and the Revolution" was reined in by WB to roughly 1 album per year.

.

Pure speculation, of course, but a possible explanation for all the different guises/names he was contemplating during this time.

With the Time, he had faithful people to do the work. They definately did the work.
With the Family, he had probably too much happening, and not really planning well with them like he did with the promotion of the Time & Vanity 6. The Family should have been in France with him doing shows at local clubs and dance spots (as well as be in the film)

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He had so much happening 1984-1986 but he couldn't bring everything together

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I knew 1/2 way into the SOTT year, that it wasn't going to last long. 1987-1988 was a wonderful period, but I knew they wouldn't be around long.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Susannah Melvoin on designing the Dream Factory album cover: Prince and I used to draw together. He was actually a really great artist. I was really into it, too. I would always have a pad and I was always drawing. I've been drawing since I was a kid. We would sit down and we would draw together. One particular night he couldn't come up with an album cover (for Dream Factory). I came up with a couple of different ones. One of them was actually a dramatized version of myself, opening up a door into this dream world, with images that were based on some of the songs. I remember that there was a lot of white space, because, I couldn't fill up the background with color... Everything was kind of drawn onto white paper. But, the doors were very ornate and I'm opening the door into the Dream Factory. The second album cover didn't have me on it. It just had the name Dream Factory, with some things hanging off the words. I used to do murals in the house where Prince lived, incredible, crazy murals that he would ask me to paint. We were always into doing stuff like that.

Very cool insight, thanks.

PurpleYoda3121 said:

So this would have been the official one? At least it's better than that godawful photoshopped image of Prince, Wendy, and Lisa with the sunflowers and clouds that's used for the cover on a lot of bootlegs.

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I know Susannah claims that this would've been the cover as Prince liked it – but I don't believe it would've been approved by Warners. In fact, I don't really believe it would've been approved by Prince either – he might have just said to Susannah "oh I like that one!" but that doesn't mean he made a decision on it, or that he would've tried to defend such an amateurish design during an argument with Warners.

I like Susannah's outfit on the drawing though. Wondering whether that was a dress code for Prince's women inside the house

MiceElfAgin said:

PurpleYoda3121 said:

So this would have been the official one? At least it's better than that godawful photoshopped image of Prince, Wendy, and Lisa with the sunflowers and clouds that's used for the cover on a lot of bootlegs.

.
I know Susannah claims that this would've been the cover as Prince liked it – but I don't believe it would've been approved by Warners. In fact, I don't really believe it would've been approved by Prince either – he might have just said to Susannah "oh I like that one!" but that doesn't mean he made a decision on it, or that he would've tried to defend such an amateurish design during an argument with Warners.

I like Susannah's outfit on the drawing though. Wondering whether that was a dress code for Prince's women inside the house

We will never know

You know, this is gonna seem strange but I've JUST downloaded DF as a whole yesterday because of this post! I never thought to before because I had heard everything on it and had a DF playlist anyway, but boy, I was dead wrong! What a great record! It just goes to show that track order and presentation means alot....btw, I think this artwork is rather whimsical and suits this album perfectly!

mediumdry said:

see this as the first mockup of around the world in a day. Now imagine a graphic designer making something more "acceptable" out of it. Personally, I think it's cute, but seems drawn by a child. It beats a number of those covers put out later designed by Parke though. (those were just awful)

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Something weird though, the man in the moon is not smiling!

[Edited 4/23/17 11:54am]

How would that be possible if Around the World In A Day came out in 1985 and Susannah says she did this in 1986?

I was drawing an analogy. The first mockup of the Around The World In A Day cover was also not what I'd call "professional". The end result was quite nice though!

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Same way, I think The Dream Factory cover would be great, based on this as the original idea.

it sucks..next

TheKid94 said:

I may be alone in this but I actually love it!

I love it too

luvsexy4all said:

it sucks..next

well Prince is gone and time is short, probably not much more

OldFriends4Sale said:

TheKid94 said:

I may be alone in this but I actually love it!

I love it too

I've been listening to All My Dreams a lot lately, and this drawing is the perfections representation of this song. I don't know that I would want a whole lot of changes, maybe some drawings of the band...

if only the album was actually released!

JudasLChrist said:

Are those Nintendo 64 controllers?

TheKid94 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I love it too

I've been listening to All My Dreams a lot lately, and this drawing is the perfections representation of this song. I don't know that I would want a whole lot of changes, maybe some drawings of the band...

if only the album was actually released!

Yes, I wonder what a completed package would be like altogether, up to this point the artistry of the full package was wonderful.

databank said:

The way I understand what Susannah and Eric told Squirrelmeat, this had nothing to do with the previous Flesh project, more something like Prince planning to release DF as "The Flesh" instead of "Prince And The Revolution", and a solo (non-Revolution) album as "Camille" instead of "Prince" at about the same time. If my interpretation is right, I wonder whether WB would have been satisfied with releasing 2 records, including a double album, neither using the marketable "Prince" trademark.

The Madhouse concept hadn't yet been conceived at this early stage but the fact that Camille was later to be released as "Camille" and TBA without any credit at all seems to indicate that Prince was eager to try and release solo material without using the name "Prince" in 86-87.

I hope someone from P's camp can eventually clarify this.

The reality is, despite me standing in front of those involved, and asking the questions us 'factphiles' want to here, I got washy answers. I don't think they were playing a game, I think no one knew the plan except Prince.

I'd love to come on here and say 'The flesh' was, or Camille 'was', but I'd be twisting the truth, and these thing need to be documented and don't need fan's twisting it.

I genuinely think everyone is telling the truth, but variations of the truth exist.

What is true is that Prince asked for a cover to be designed for a 'Dream Factory' album by 'The Flesh'. What his idea of the band or track makeup may take many years to unfold. I find that quite exciting!

SquirrelMeat said:

databank said:

The way I understand what Susannah and Eric told Squirrelmeat, this had nothing to do with the previous Flesh project, more something like Prince planning to release DF as "The Flesh" instead of "Prince And The Revolution", and a solo (non-Revolution) album as "Camille" instead of "Prince" at about the same time. If my interpretation is right, I wonder whether WB would have been satisfied with releasing 2 records, including a double album, neither using the marketable "Prince" trademark.

The Madhouse concept hadn't yet been conceived at this early stage but the fact that Camille was later to be released as "Camille" and TBA without any credit at all seems to indicate that Prince was eager to try and release solo material without using the name "Prince" in 86-87.

I hope someone from P's camp can eventually clarify this.

The reality is, despite me standing in front of those involved, and asking the questions us 'factphiles' want to here, I got washy answers. I don't think they were playing a game, I think no one knew the plan except Prince.

I'd love to come on here and say 'The flesh' was, or Camille 'was', but I'd be twisting the truth, and these thing need to be documented and don't need fan's twisting it.

I genuinely think everyone is telling the truth, but variations of the truth exist.

What is true is that Prince asked for a cover to be designed for a 'Dream Factory' album by 'The Flesh'. What his idea of the band or track makeup may take many years to unfold. I find that quite exciting!

She said she had two other pieces she did as well. I like it. I wish someone documented a flow of what was happening from many different parts of the puprle time continuum.
And as excited as I am about stuff unfolding. We might also find that it doesn't happen?

mrfog said:

I really like this artwork. To me it's kind of halfway between something Joni Mitchell might have on a cover and a Funkadelic sleeve. I think it suits the music it would have contained. As for the artwork seeming naively rendered or amateurish, 1999 has a very handmade looking cover too, but it's still perfect for that album...

I too thought it looked like the 1999 artwork, like the female expression of the male

Housequake just posted an alternative version of the artwork by Susannah on their facebook page...

https://www.facebook.com/housequake/photos/a.361699067247157.84706.140811109335955/1312088388874882/?type=3&theater