JoeTyler said:

IstenSzek said:

that is just sad. sad.sad.sad.

yeah, sad, but it doesn't explain why Prince has never released a DVD of his own 00's tours...specially the 21 Nights tour...

[Edited 7/12/12 8:29am]

i will tell you why. No one wants to work w/ him what Prince would pay for editing & producing a concert dvd. Everyone left because they said, "My life is too short & I have a family to support, there is nothing for me" THat is where they will ALL go eventually.

Trickology said:

JoeTyler said:

yeah, sad, but it doesn't explain why Prince has never released a DVD of his own 00's tours...specially the 21 Nights tour...

[Edited 7/12/12 8:29am]

i will tell you why. No one wants to work w/ him what Prince would pay for editing & producing a concert dvd. Everyone left because they said, "My life is too short & I have a family to support, there is nothing for me" THat is where they will ALL go eventually.

Exactly Trickology. I don't know that everyone understands how CHEAP Prince is when it comes to paying people to do things for him. That is IF he pays them. It is worse now than it has ever been.

But when it comes time for Prince to be paid, it is a whole other story. Hence why the Montreux DVD never got released and countless other things that have not happened because Prince wants a ridiculous amount of money.

JoeTyler said:

IstenSzek said:

that is just sad. sad.sad.sad.

yeah, sad, but it doesn't explain why Prince has never released a DVD of his own 00's tours...specially the 21 Nights tour...

[Edited 7/12/12 8:29am]

I am not sure. At one point i thought the reason is he wants the people to see him live, not on dvd at home. But this seems such a strange thing..i mean he is the ultimate live performer and friends show me shows from depeche mode, beyonce, george michael on blue ray and it is such a great experience...and Prince has nothing !!!

Except that quite boring Rave un2 the year 2000...which doesn`t capture the live feeling very well....it is a shame....

He should release Sign O the times, Livesexy, some old concerts drom 1999, Purple rain and all the new tours like W2 america, Musicology on blue ray...

He is really loosing so much reputation, which is really sad...

Reading all the comments from us, his fans, is a disaster for an artist...

And it is unfair to his talents and the music he created....

i think from the claude nobs statement it is pretty clear why there are no other live prince dvd's.

it's because prince has the stuff filmed or in some instances venues or organisations film shows

(probably to a much higher standard than prince does himself anyway) and there really isn't an

amazing distance between having the stuff taped and edited and then getting it out on a dvd.

small indi bands get it done (with better results than prince's Aladin dvd, for instance) and yet

prince doesn't release anything. not even the montreux footage which was obviously shot with

care and the sound and video are simply amazing.

it all comes down to money. like nobs says. prince wants a shitload of cash upfront for his dvd

or his cd (read the 20Ten album promo interviews and later anti itunes ravings). if he doesn't

get the number he had in his mind, the project is filed away and forgotten about.

in recent years there have been more tour dvd's and documentaries or one off live gigs that he

put away in the vault, despite them being completed into a pretty late stage, than there have

been albums he canned.

it's a shame. but oh well.

i can't believe no one on this site has made a gif of prince shooting himself in the foot yet

The real irony is, of course, that Prince's apparent greed is preventing some mindblowing live stuff reaching the masses; by the same token the bootlegs are released (e.g. Montreux) , freed up, and us hardcore fans pay nothing while Prince gets fuck all. Karma indeed.

It's sad that for a legend of his stature that there's no DVDs because of his stubbornness to get paid up front. Sadly we may see DVDs of him if, God forbid, he goes on his final tour in the sky somewhere.

Red said:

I think… Prince IS readying his own publishing company. An artist owning their own publishing company isn’t as rare as you may think these days, and will eventually become the norm for popular artists that can afford it. In the long run, hiring trustworthy and capable staff (good entertainment lawyer, accountants, administrators) and sidestepping the middle man publisher to control 100% of your own work makes much more than cents.

I think the recent years of Prince defaulting on agreements (tax bills, concert performances, etc.) and judgments against him to pay large sums of money -- all call into question the capabilities of his staff, and even more importantly Prince's own abilities as a manager of his own affairs. To put it bluntly, Prince excels at what Prince excels = making music and performing. When it comes to business he has a very very spotty record.

There is very little in his history that inspires confidence in his ability to administer his own publishing.

IstenSzek said:

linus4000 said:

I think he should concentrate on his music again and not how to maximize his income, which it seems is his main concern since the last years.

Claude Nobs ( founder and producer of the montreux jazz festival) said recently, that they wanted to release Prince`s performance of 2009 at the jazz festival, but Prince wanted way too much

money! This performance was great and it`s a shame that the public won`t see it officially....

http://www.zeit.de/2012/26/Montreux-Festival-Claude-Nobs/seite-2

that is just sad. sad.sad.sad.

WHY???

Prince could have thought through this a bit more, and released it! That would have been awesome! I wondered what he was charging for it?

He doesn't even need all the money! Now I am pissed!!!!

Cause Montreux he was KILLER!!!!

Now he killed his own 'Killing'

Prince finds a way to make us all..sad. lol

NuPwrSoul said:

Red said:

I think… Prince IS readying his own publishing company. An artist owning their own publishing company isn’t as rare as you may think these days, and will eventually become the norm for popular artists that can afford it. In the long run, hiring trustworthy and capable staff (good entertainment lawyer, accountants, administrators) and sidestepping the middle man publisher to control 100% of your own work makes much more than cents.

I think the recent years of Prince defaulting on agreements (tax bills, concert performances, etc.) and judgments against him to pay large sums of money -- all call into question the capabilities of his staff, and even more importantly Prince's own abilities as a manager of his own affairs. To put it bluntly, Prince excels at what Prince excels = making music and performing. When it comes to business he has a very very spotty record.

There is very little in his history that inspires confidence in his ability to administer his own publishing.

I understand doubt of P's business ethics - but maybe, just maybe - none of us know the real deals behind the scenes. It is all conjecture unless you standin 'side the man. I'm not defending all of his moves, he might not either LOL. Some have been dayum brilliant, but some people just can't seem to move on and let the man plan his long term. Talk about bitterness. U know he's been working towards this for almost 20 years - since 1994 basically. I'm certain that once he has his ducks lined up - you'll be quackin fresh DVD's of ALL of it. You'll pay for it - but isn't that what publishing and merchandising is all about. There's a meaning to his madness and I think he's miles ahead of others on the idea of maintaining copyright and how to get paid for his work. Artists of all kinds - musicians, visual artists, film stars... should pay attention. I think he unerstands the future of copyright all too well.

The only way any artist in today's music industry makes money is through touring. Would a DVD of an amazing show affect ticket sales? It probably would. As much as I would want to see a new live DVD I can understand why nothing has been released.

[Edited 7/13/12 2:03am]

Red said:

NuPwrSoul said:

I think the recent years of Prince defaulting on agreements (tax bills, concert performances, etc.) and judgments against him to pay large sums of money -- all call into question the capabilities of his staff, and even more importantly Prince's own abilities as a manager of his own affairs. To put it bluntly, Prince excels at what Prince excels = making music and performing. When it comes to business he has a very very spotty record.

There is very little in his history that inspires confidence in his ability to administer his own publishing.

I understand doubt of P's business ethics - but maybe, just maybe - none of us know the real deals behind the scenes. It is all conjecture unless you standin 'side the man. I'm not defending all of his moves, he might not either LOL. Some have been dayum brilliant, but some people just can't seem to move on and let the man plan his long term. Talk about bitterness. U know he's been working towards this for almost 20 years - since 1994 basically. I'm certain that once he has his ducks lined up - you'll be quackin fresh DVD's of ALL of it. You'll pay for it - but isn't that what publishing and merchandising is all about. There's a meaning to his madness and I think he's miles ahead of others on the idea of maintaining copyright and how to get paid for his work. Artists of all kinds - musicians, visual artists, film stars... should pay attention. I think he unerstands the future of copyright all too well.

That`s what i thought all the years. That he has a plan. I do think that his fight for more power for artists is right and that artists in general should have more control over their work.

But now it just seems to absorb his whole energy and time. In interviews it`s only about this and more money for him. Number one on the bank....

The general public is forgetting about him as an active artist. They love his older work. but they don`t get a chance to hear a fantastic performance like Montreux, which could really have an impact on music lovers. I was listening to Frank Oceans new album and it touched me and people all over the world are talking bout it and buying the record. It`s not very commercial, just great music. I miss Prince`s ability to just release a great album, great singles without all this madness of releasing it like Lotusflower just in the US or 20TEN only in Europe...

What happened to him as an artist who wants the world to hear his music?

[Edited 7/13/12 3:04am]

Watty said:

The only way any artist in today's music industry makes money is through touring. Would a DVD of an amazing show affect ticket sales? It probably would. As much as I would want to see a new live DVD I can understand why nothing has been released.

[Edited 7/13/12 2:03am]

but surely that can't be the only reason we don't see a dvd release?

prince's shows are not that heavy on the theatrics or visuals anymore at this point, so it's not

like a dvd gives away the set up of a tour. and he changes his setlist around quite a bit and a

show is never quite like any of the ones before. often times a setlist changes dramatically if a

tour goes on long enough. etc etc.

plus, people like madonna release documents of every tour they do. it doesn't seem to affect

their ticketsales at all. if anything dvds are just a promotional tool for future performances.

IstenSzek said:

Watty said:

The only way any artist in today's music industry makes money is through touring. Would a DVD of an amazing show affect ticket sales? It probably would. As much as I would want to see a new live DVD I can understand why nothing has been released.

[Edited 7/13/12 2:03am]

but surely that can't be the only reason we don't see a dvd release?

prince's shows are not that heavy on the theatrics or visuals anymore at this point, so it's not

like a dvd gives away the set up of a tour. and he changes his setlist around quite a bit and a

show is never quite like any of the ones before. often times a setlist changes dramatically if a

tour goes on long enough. etc etc.

plus, people like madonna release documents of every tour they do. it doesn't seem to affect

their ticketsales at all. if anything dvds are just a promotional tool for future performances.

Yes. People are showing the performances on dvd and they get curious to see the performer. Is`s very effective promotion for a live tour, imo.

Watty said:

The only way any artist in today's music industry makes money is through touring. Would a DVD of an amazing show affect ticket sales? It probably would. As much as I would want to see a new live DVD I can understand why nothing has been released.

[Edited 7/13/12 2:03am]

but ...u dumbasses we got the montreux FREE...maybe thats what he wanted....

Sir Prince, Way 2 go! Can't wait to see what you cr8 in this everlasting now.

IstenSzek said:

i can't believe no one on this site has made a gif of prince shooting himself in the foot yet

Not an animated gif but here's a jpg of it:

unique said:

Watty said:

The only way any artist in today's music industry makes money is through touring. Would a DVD of an amazing show affect ticket sales? It probably would. As much as I would want to see a new live DVD I can understand why nothing has been released.

[Edited 7/13/12 2:03am]

that's my interpretation of things with him regarding not releasing live performances. live performances are his bread and butter now, he doesn't get much from albums or dvds comparitively. a live dvd will usually sell less than an album

True. I read up on whats going on in the recording industry. The record co's are obviously not making the $$$ selling cds, so they have found ways to make more on the publishing end of music through various streams (movie, tv, film, streaming, itunes..etc) stuff like itunes breaks down 30% itunes, 35% musician, %35 record co. So why get in bed with a record company? to distribute a piece of plastic that will be obsolite in retail stores in 5 years??? Then get cut from profits related to digital downlands or even digital royalties. One of the majors made 4 billion away from these other streams from the dying cd sales.

I believe even the gripe DefLep had with record co related to publishing. They made more from the 2 rerecordings so far, which seemed small at 16,000 downloads vs. what they were offered in relation to what they collect from itunes! Which does seem small. They make way more from playing shows but I think it's the principal for them.

Publishing is now the bread and butter for the record companies. So just like when Prince found a way to make $25 million on Emancipation/Crystal Ball we will have to see what he is thinking but he is usually ahead of the tide. When I read Prince is looking for "fresh new ideas for all his music!" I believe he maybe onto some new ways.

[Edited 7/13/12 7:57am]

Red said:

NuPwrSoul said:

I think the recent years of Prince defaulting on agreements (tax bills, concert performances, etc.) and judgments against him to pay large sums of money -- all call into question the capabilities of his staff, and even more importantly Prince's own abilities as a manager of his own affairs. To put it bluntly, Prince excels at what Prince excels = making music and performing. When it comes to business he has a very very spotty record.

There is very little in his history that inspires confidence in his ability to administer his own publishing.

I understand doubt of P's business ethics - but maybe, just maybe - none of us know the real deals behind the scenes. It is all conjecture unless you standin 'side the man. I'm not defending all of his moves, he might not either LOL. Some have been dayum brilliant, but some people just can't seem to move on and let the man plan his long term. Talk about bitterness. U know he's been working towards this for almost 20 years - since 1994 basically. I'm certain that once he has his ducks lined up - you'll be quackin fresh DVD's of ALL of it. You'll pay for it - but isn't that what publishing and merchandising is all about. There's a meaning to his madness and I think he's miles ahead of others on the idea of maintaining copyright and how to get paid for his work. Artists of all kinds - musicians, visual artists, film stars... should pay attention. I think he unerstands the future of copyright all too well.

I differentiate business decisions from administration. When it comes to decisions, I think Prince has demonstrated some very creative, ingenious ways of responding to (and forecasting) changes in the music industry. Those don't raise any doubts in my mind.

What I am referring to, however, is adminstration. Which has to do with management, staff, and yes, paying bills. These are the rudimentary things of running a business. Prince has a very poor track record of the nuts and bolts things. Publishing administration requires nuts and bolts... attention to detail, long term, and filing paperwork, etc. It's not the kind of thing Prince should get bogged down in, not the least of which because he isn't particularly good at it. Nor do I excpect him to be.

Prince makes a good visionary. But when it comes to implementing those visions, he needs help. That isn't a dig on him. That's usually how it works with creative people. Let them focus on the creative process. And find others who are really good at the nuts and bolts of the other aspects do their job.

luvsexy4all said:

but ...u dumbasses we got the montreux FREE...maybe thats what he wanted....

If you believe this I have a Graffiti Bridge I'd like to sell you.

The reason it was not released is because Prince demanded a ridiculous amount of money yet you think he is happy that bootleggers put it out and he got nothing for it? OK LOL.

NuPwrSoul said:

Red said:

I understand doubt of P's business ethics - but maybe, just maybe - none of us know the real deals behind the scenes. It is all conjecture unless you standin 'side the man. I'm not defending all of his moves, he might not either LOL. Some have been dayum brilliant, but some people just can't seem to move on and let the man plan his long term. Talk about bitterness. U know he's been working towards this for almost 20 years - since 1994 basically. I'm certain that once he has his ducks lined up - you'll be quackin fresh DVD's of ALL of it. You'll pay for it - but isn't that what publishing and merchandising is all about. There's a meaning to his madness and I think he's miles ahead of others on the idea of maintaining copyright and how to get paid for his work. Artists of all kinds - musicians, visual artists, film stars... should pay attention. I think he unerstands the future of copyright all too well.

I differentiate business decisions from administration. When it comes to decisions, I think Prince has demonstrated some very creative, ingenious ways of responding to (and forecasting) changes in the music industry. Those don't raise any doubts in my mind.

What I am referring to, however, is adminstration. Which has to do with management, staff, and yes, paying bills. These are the rudimentary things of running a business. Prince has a very poor track record of the nuts and bolts things. Publishing administration requires nuts and bolts... attention to detail, long term, and filing paperwork, etc. It's not the kind of thing Prince should get bogged down in, not the least of which because he isn't particularly good at it. Nor do I excpect him to be.

Prince makes a good visionary. But when it comes to implementing those visions, he needs help. That isn't a dig on him. That's usually how it works with creative people. Let them focus on the creative process. And find others who are really good at the nuts and bolts of the other aspects do their job.

"differentiate business decisions from administration" - so do most people - and as my earlier comment said - trustworthy accountants, lawyers and aministrators (plural). They're out there - he just has to find, trust and learn delegation. He hasn't called me yet

TheEnglishGent said:

IstenSzek said:

i can't believe no one on this site has made a gif of prince shooting himself in the foot yet

Not an animated gif but here's a jpg of it:

linus4000 said:

IstenSzek said:

but surely that can't be the only reason we don't see a dvd release?

prince's shows are not that heavy on the theatrics or visuals anymore at this point, so it's not

like a dvd gives away the set up of a tour. and he changes his setlist around quite a bit and a

show is never quite like any of the ones before. often times a setlist changes dramatically if a

tour goes on long enough. etc etc.

plus, people like madonna release documents of every tour they do. it doesn't seem to affect

their ticketsales at all. if anything dvds are just a promotional tool for future performances.

Yes. People are showing the performances on dvd and they get curious to see the performer. Is`s very effective promotion for a live tour, imo.

Works for me.

THe Argentenian concert of Madonna was broadcasted on tv last year. I was impressed and that made me want to go see her when she was here.

If I would had the money for a ticket, that is

Paisleyprk said:

Bring back the NPGMC!! That way, he can put up what he wants and we will buy it!!

MAKE IT SO!!!

dJJ said:

linus4000 said:

Yes. People are showing the performances on dvd and they get curious to see the performer. Is`s very effective promotion for a live tour, imo.

Works for me.

THe Argentenian concert of Madonna was broadcasted on tv last year. I was impressed and that made me want to go see her when she was here.

If I would had the money for a ticket, that is

imo Artists should always do a live broadcast of their last concert in a country if it sells out (or gets close).

NuPwrSoul said:

Emancipation89 said:

I wonder if there's any music publishing company out there that would love to work with Prince. I mean he doesn't allow his music for commercials or TV shows such as American Idol(there was one time I heard his tune on DWTS though), and he's not exactly a fan of others covering his music either. When do they ever get to make $$$???

Even if Prince doesn't authorize any licenses, his catalog is still lucrative. Royalties alone on sales & radio play still net anywhere from $8-$10 million a year (the last figure I remember seeing a few years back). Even if it's not as much anymore, publishers have mechanisms in place for collecting license fees/royalties that doesn't require them any extra work per artist if that artist doesn't have any special licensing. That's easy money for them because they're already doing it for so many other artists. (Which makes it unlikely that Prince will take this task upon himself.)

Of course, a publisher interested in maximizing the value of the catalog under its administration will actively seek out licensing opportunities in television, film, video games, ring tones, etc.; but we all know Prince has rarely agreed to those kinds of opportunities.

Still, even with the most restrictive usage, his catalog still represents a goldmine for any publisher he'd go to. He's probably shopping around to find the one giving him the best rate/fee structure.

...I see, thanks.

hjd said:

he has a MANAGER!!!!!?????

That was my reaction too.

Eileen said:

hjd said:

he has a MANAGER!!!!!?????

That was my reaction too.

If you go to her Twitter page it says "Manager to singer Prince." I think the "to" is very significant here, as it better represents how Prince views his managers should be: like assistants. No one is the manager *of* Prince.