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Thread started 11/07/18 9:32am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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I'm a liberal professor, and my liberal students terrify me

As a moderate, that's the closests I come to identifying, I agree with a lot of the guys assertions. When 'freedom of speech' is not really free or when we swing too far one way how progressive are we...

https://www.vox.com/2015/...sor-afraid

By Edward Schlosser Jun 3, 2015, 8:00am EDT

I'm a professor at a midsize state school. I have been teaching college classes for nine years now. I have won (minor) teaching awards, studied pedagogy extensively, and almost always score highly on my student evaluations. I am not a world-class teacher by any means, but I am conscientious; I attempt to put teaching ahead of research, and I take a healthy emotional stake in the well-being and growth of my students.

Things have changed since I started teaching. The vibe is different. I wish there were a less blunt way to put this, but my students sometimes scare me — particularly the liberal ones.

Not, like, in a person-by-person sense, but students in general. The student-teacher dynamic has been reenvisioned along a line that's simultaneously consumerist and hyper-protective, giving each and every student the ability to claim Grievous Harm in nearly any circumstance, after any affront, and a teacher's formal ability to respond to these claims is limited at best.

.

update * these are just the headings to paragraphs of thought by the author in the article

.

What it was like before

Now boat-rocking isn't just dangerous — it's suicidal

IT'S NOT JUST THAT STUDENTS REFUSE TO COUNTENANCE UNCOMFORTABLE IDEAS — THEY REFUSE TO ENGAGE THEM, PERIOD.

The real problem: a simplistic, unworkable, and ultimately stifling conception of social justice

When feelings become more important than issues

We destroy ourselves when identity becomes our sole focus

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #1 posted 11/07/18 9:43am

jaawwnn

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2015 was a good few years ago, there were quite a few articles like this at the time and also quite a few responses. I'd want an update on how things are working right now and also info on what kind of demographics we're talking about.

[Edited 11/7/18 9:48am]

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Reply #2 posted 11/07/18 9:46am

Camileyun

The consequences of teaching kids what to think, not how to think, Core Curriculum, lazy parents and an education system dominated by progressives. Solutions? Home school and abolish the Department of Education. Schools should only be run at the local level. Anytime the feds get involved, the result is usually negative. We are paying tens of thousands of dollars per semester to have kids indoctrinated.

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Reply #3 posted 11/07/18 9:50am

jaawwnn

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Abolish the Department of Education? Will you abolish the US army and replace it with local armies as well? Maybe abolish your entire Union?

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Reply #4 posted 11/07/18 9:54am

NorthC

^That doesn't sound like a very good idea. There needs to be some form of unity in education otherwise any parent or private school could teach their children whatever they want. A Christian school could teach that the bible is always right and evolution never happened.
I may disagree with everything you say, but I will defend your right to say it.
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Reply #5 posted 11/07/18 9:56am

NorthC

OldFriends4Sale said:


As a moderate, that's the closests I come to identifying, I agree with a lot of the guys assertions. When 'freedom of speech' is not really free or when we swing too far one way how progressive are we...




https://www.vox.com/2015/6/3/8706323/college-professor-afraid


By Edward Schlosser Jun 3, 2015, 8:00am EDT



I'm a professor at a midsize state school. I have been teaching college classes for nine years now. I have won (minor) teaching awards, studied pedagogy extensively, and almost always score highly on my student evaluations. I am not a world-class teacher by any means, but I am conscientious; I attempt to put teaching ahead of research, and I take a healthy emotional stake in the well-being and growth of my students.


Things have changed since I started teaching. The vibe is different. I wish there were a less blunt way to put this, but my students sometimes scare me — particularly the liberal ones.


Not, like, in a person-by-person sense, but students in general. The student-teacher dynamic has been reenvisioned along a line that's simultaneously consumerist and hyper-protective, giving each and every student the ability to claim Grievous Harm in nearly any circumstance, after any affront, and a teacher's formal ability to respond to these claims is limited at best.



What it was like before


Now boat-rocking isn't just dangerous — it's suicidal


IT'S NOT JUST THAT STUDENTS REFUSE TO COUNTENANCE UNCOMFORTABLE IDEAS — THEY REFUSE TO ENGAGE THEM, PERIOD.


The real problem: a simplistic, unworkable, and ultimately stifling conception of social justice


When feelings become more important than issues


We destroy ourselves when identity becomes our sole focus














For some reason, the link to the article isn't clickable, but the link to the writer is.
I may disagree with everything you say, but I will defend your right to say it.
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Reply #6 posted 11/07/18 9:58am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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NorthC said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

As a moderate, that's the closests I come to identifying, I agree with a lot of the guys assertions. When 'freedom of speech' is not really free or when we swing too far one way how progressive are we...

https://www.vox.com/2015/6/3/8706323/college-professor-afraid

By Edward Schlosser Jun 3, 2015, 8:00am EDT

I'm a professor at a midsize state school. I have been teaching college classes for nine years now. I have won (minor) teaching awards, studied pedagogy extensively, and almost always score highly on my student evaluations. I am not a world-class teacher by any means, but I am conscientious; I attempt to put teaching ahead of research, and I take a healthy emotional stake in the well-being and growth of my students.

Things have changed since I started teaching. The vibe is different. I wish there were a less blunt way to put this, but my students sometimes scare me — particularly the liberal ones.

Not, like, in a person-by-person sense, but students in general. The student-teacher dynamic has been reenvisioned along a line that's simultaneously consumerist and hyper-protective, giving each and every student the ability to claim Grievous Harm in nearly any circumstance, after any affront, and a teacher's formal ability to respond to these claims is limited at best.

What it was like before

Now boat-rocking isn't just dangerous — it's suicidal

IT'S NOT JUST THAT STUDENTS REFUSE TO COUNTENANCE UNCOMFORTABLE IDEAS — THEY REFUSE TO ENGAGE THEM, PERIOD.

The real problem: a simplistic, unworkable, and ultimately stifling conception of social justice

When feelings become more important than issues

We destroy ourselves when identity becomes our sole focus

For some reason, the link to the article isn't clickable, but the link to the writer is.

I didn't add the

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #7 posted 11/07/18 10:02am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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Camileyun said:

The consequences of teaching kids what to think, not how to think, Core Curriculum, lazy parents and an education system dominated by progressives. Solutions? Home school and abolish the Department of Education. Schools should only be run at the local level. Anytime the feds get involved, the result is usually negative. We are paying tens of thousands of dollars per semester to have kids indoctrinated.

Perhaps they are smart enough to see through conservative bullshit. They SHOULD be unresponsive when being told the sky is green.

2010: Healing the Wounds of the Past.... http://prince.org/msg/8/325740
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Reply #8 posted 11/07/18 10:04am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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moderator

I feel it in society and discussions. People are so easily offended now, they feel before thinking and it's affecting how we discuss subjects.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #9 posted 11/07/18 10:08am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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OldFriends4Sale said:

I feel it in society and discussions. People are so easily offended now, they feel before thinking and it's affecting how we discuss subjects.

I know this doesn't apply only to liberals. Right wing victimhood is real.

2010: Healing the Wounds of the Past.... http://prince.org/msg/8/325740
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Reply #10 posted 11/07/18 10:11am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I feel it in society and discussions. People are so easily offended now, they feel before thinking and it's affecting how we discuss subjects.

I know this doesn't apply only to liberals. Right wing victimhood is real.

right, it seems to be taking over our discourse, and maybe social media is helping this along swiftly.

.

Victimhood of either and all is very real today.

.

People don't want to discuss and listen and connect. Just be right, about opinions. Offended, because what the person said 'made them feel some kind of way'. Maybe you feel some kind of way because the information is challenging you. Which is a good thing.

.

I definately know, picking our battles is a must. And debates that just go round n round are a waste of time. People need to learn how to just back out of some things too.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #11 posted 11/07/18 10:40am

NorthC

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:



Camileyun said:


The consequences of teaching kids what to think, not how to think, Core Curriculum, lazy parents and an education system dominated by progressives. Solutions? Home school and abolish the Department of Education. Schools should only be run at the local level. Anytime the feds get involved, the result is usually negative. We are paying tens of thousands of dollars per semester to have kids indoctrinated.



Perhaps they are smart enough to see through conservative bullshit. They SHOULD be unresponsive when being told the sky is green.


Being conservative is NOT the same as telling lies.
I may disagree with everything you say, but I will defend your right to say it.
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Reply #12 posted 11/07/18 10:42am

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Camileyun said:

The consequences of teaching kids what to think, not how to think, Core Curriculum, lazy parents and an education system dominated by progressives. Solutions? Home school and abolish the Department of Education. Schools should only be run at the local level. Anytime the feds get involved, the result is usually negative. We are paying tens of thousands of dollars per semester to have kids indoctrinated.

Perhaps they are smart enough to see through conservative bullshit. They SHOULD be unresponsive when being told the sky is green.

liberals got some bullshit too now lol

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #13 posted 11/07/18 11:13am

Camileyun

NorthC said:

^That doesn't sound like a very good idea. There needs to be some form of unity in education otherwise any parent or private school could teach their children whatever they want. A Christian school could teach that the bible is always right and evolution never happened.

So you prefer to let the government decide what to teach the children? The Department of Education is a bloated, unnecessary $68 billion dollar annual waste of money run by bureaucrats. They do not determine curricula nor do they determine educational standards...that is left to the state and local districts. The DOE was established in 1980 under Pres. Carter. And since that time, test scores have plummeted, inner city schools are a disaster for the most part, and the result is outlined in the article above.

Education is beyond the scope of the government and not authorized, by us, under the US Constitution. It is political overreach into the private sector to take command of any part of formal education. Education was historically dealt with at the local level because different localities had differing educational needs. How did people fair without the DOE? Amazingly well. If you look at the typical 8th grade graduation test from the late 1800s (prior to progressive involvement), I doubt ANY of us would pass it today. It's shocking how much better educated people were.

It is scary to me how some people believe in the Nanny State, where they think the government, that is to work FOR us is actually there to take care of us. This is why they don't teach history as they should. How else do you learn from the past? You don't...and that's the progressive plan. The less intrusive the government, the better.

Here's a good article on the subject. If you are not religious, just skip over those references. But the rest has some very valid points.

https://www.catholicamericanthinker.com/public-education.html

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Reply #14 posted 11/07/18 11:22am

DiminutiveRock
er

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Camileyun said:

The consequences of teaching kids what to think, not how to think, Core Curriculum, lazy parents and an education system dominated by progressives. Solutions? Home school and abolish the Department of Education. Schools should only be run at the local level. Anytime the feds get involved, the result is usually negative. We are paying tens of thousands of dollars per semester to have kids indoctrinated.

Perhaps they are smart enough to see through conservative bullshit. They SHOULD be unresponsive when being told the sky is green.

Exactly.


For instance, the big "invasion" of 1000 people heading towards a country of 300 million. An "INVASION" is what it it being called by 45 and the conservative media - and the sheep listening to those two entities are repeating it as if it is truth. I would venture to say those people are not smart enough to know that the sky is not green.

"'Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.'' - Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #15 posted 11/07/18 11:23am

DiminutiveRock
er

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Camileyun said:

NorthC said:

^That doesn't sound like a very good idea. There needs to be some form of unity in education otherwise any parent or private school could teach their children whatever they want. A Christian school could teach that the bible is always right and evolution never happened.

So you prefer to let the government decide what to teach the children? The Department of Education is a bloated, unnecessary $68 billion dollar annual waste of money run by bureaucrats. They do not determine curricula nor do they determine educational standards...that is left to the state and local districts. The DOE was established in 1980 under Pres. Carter. And since that time, test scores have plummeted, inner city schools are a disaster for the most part, and the result is outlined in the article above.

Education is beyond the scope of the government and not authorized, by us, under the US Constitution. It is political overreach into the private sector to take command of any part of formal education. Education was historically dealt with at the local level because different localities had differing educational needs. How did people fair without the DOE? Amazingly well. If you look at the typical 8th grade graduation test from the late 1800s (prior to progressive involvement), I doubt ANY of us would pass it today. It's shocking how much better educated people were.

It is scary to me how some people believe in the Nanny State, where they think the government, that is to work FOR us is actually there to take care of us. This is why they don't teach history as they should. How else do you learn from the past? You don't...and that's the progressive plan. The less intrusive the government, the better.

Here's a good article on the subject. If you are not religious, just skip over those references. But the rest has some very valid points.

https://www.catholicamericanthinker.com/public-education.html


hmmm your posts ring familiar. Why not come back as your old name?

"'Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.'' - Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #16 posted 11/07/18 12:04pm

Camileyun

DiminutiveRocker said:

Camileyun said:

So you prefer to let the government decide what to teach the children? The Department of Education is a bloated, unnecessary $68 billion dollar annual waste of money run by bureaucrats. They do not determine curricula nor do they determine educational standards...that is left to the state and local districts. The DOE was established in 1980 under Pres. Carter. And since that time, test scores have plummeted, inner city schools are a disaster for the most part, and the result is outlined in the article above.

Education is beyond the scope of the government and not authorized, by us, under the US Constitution. It is political overreach into the private sector to take command of any part of formal education. Education was historically dealt with at the local level because different localities had differing educational needs. How did people fair without the DOE? Amazingly well. If you look at the typical 8th grade graduation test from the late 1800s (prior to progressive involvement), I doubt ANY of us would pass it today. It's shocking how much better educated people were.

It is scary to me how some people believe in the Nanny State, where they think the government, that is to work FOR us is actually there to take care of us. This is why they don't teach history as they should. How else do you learn from the past? You don't...and that's the progressive plan. The less intrusive the government, the better.

Here's a good article on the subject. If you are not religious, just skip over those references. But the rest has some very valid points.

https://www.catholicamericanthinker.com/public-education.html


hmmm your posts ring familiar. Why not come back as your old name?

Don't have one...now back on topic.

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Reply #17 posted 11/07/18 12:24pm

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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Camileyun said:

DiminutiveRocker said:


hmmm your posts ring familiar. Why not come back as your old name?

Don't have one...now back on topic.

just admit it lol

2010: Healing the Wounds of the Past.... http://prince.org/msg/8/325740
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Reply #18 posted 11/07/18 12:30pm

Camileyun

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Camileyun said:

Don't have one...now back on topic.

just admit it lol

Geez, not this again. lol Tell me who you want me to be, and I'll admit it (not sure why it matters to so many, but, whatever). Why do people come back here with a different name, unless they were kicked off? wink

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Reply #19 posted 11/07/18 12:41pm

2freaky4church
1

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Anacdotal bullshit.

"My motherfucker's so cool sheep count him."
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Reply #20 posted 11/07/18 12:43pm

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

avatar

Camileyun said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

just admit it lol

Geez, not this again. lol Tell me who you want me to be, and I'll admit it (not sure why it matters to so many, but, whatever). Why do people come back here with a different name, unless they were kicked off? wink

the "wink" says it all wink

lol

2010: Healing the Wounds of the Past.... http://prince.org/msg/8/325740
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Reply #21 posted 11/07/18 12:50pm

Camileyun

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Camileyun said:

Geez, not this again. lol Tell me who you want me to be, and I'll admit it (not sure why it matters to so many, but, whatever). Why do people come back here with a different name, unless they were kicked off? wink

the "wink" says it all wink

lol

Ahhh, but does it? wink

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Reply #22 posted 11/07/18 12:52pm

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Camileyun said:

Geez, not this again. lol Tell me who you want me to be, and I'll admit it (not sure why it matters to so many, but, whatever). Why do people come back here with a different name, unless they were kicked off? wink

the "wink" says it all wink

lol


lol nod

"'Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.'' - Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #23 posted 11/07/18 3:18pm

peggyon

I am a centrist Democrat and have a university degree. I feel that universities have for some time been influenced by the liberal/progessive mind-set to a large extent.

I have a daughter at Columbia U. and she feels many of these beliefs have been taken way too far. I agree.

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Reply #24 posted 11/07/18 3:23pm

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

peggyon said:

I am a centrist Democrat and have a university degree. I feel that universities have for some time been influenced by the liberal/progessive mind-set to a large extent.

I have a daughter at Columbia U. and she feels many of these beliefs have been taken way too far. I agree.


Specifically - which beliefs?

"'Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.'' - Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #25 posted 11/07/18 4:19pm

peggyon

DiminutiveRocker said:

peggyon said:

I am a centrist Democrat and have a university degree. I feel that universities have for some time been influenced by the liberal/progessive mind-set to a large extent.

I have a daughter at Columbia U. and she feels many of these beliefs have been taken way too far. I agree.


Specifically - which beliefs?

Essentially overly liberal beliefs. I lived in Berkeley, CA for years (until last year), and I noted that many potential conservative speakers at UC Berkeley were often either highly contested or banned. Or, they had to pay for security/extra police for the predictable unrest that would occur after their talks. Charles Murray was one such person.

My daughter has mentioned that some claim to be so "sensitive" they state they suffer from "micro-agressions" from those who do not align with their world-view.

They are missing out on alternative views and I cannot imagine how this is preparing them for the messy, real world.

[Edited 11/7/18 16:41pm]

[Edited 11/7/18 16:43pm]

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Reply #26 posted 11/07/18 8:36pm

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

peggyon said:

DiminutiveRocker said:


Specifically - which beliefs?

Essentially overly liberal beliefs. I lived in Berkeley, CA for years (until last year), and I noted that many potential conservative speakers at UC Berkeley were often either highly contested or banned. Or, they had to pay for security/extra police for the predictable unrest that would occur after their talks. Charles Murray was one such person.

My daughter has mentioned that some claim to be so "sensitive" they state they suffer from "micro-agressions" from those who do not align with their world-view.

They are missing out on alternative views and I cannot imagine how this is preparing them for the messy, real world.

[Edited 11/7/18 16:41pm]

[Edited 11/7/18 16:43pm]


Not allowing a conservative speaker is one such "overly liberal belief." Are there more? Is this display of overly liberal beliefs pervasive in only one place - or is this everywhere? Beyond speaking at a university, can conservative views of people such as Charles Murray be accessed via another medium - and if so, how will 'they' be missing out on alternative views?




[Edited 11/7/18 21:36pm]

"'Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.'' - Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #27 posted 11/07/18 9:31pm

MoBettaBliss

OldFriends4Sale said:

I feel it in society and discussions. People are so easily offended now, they feel before thinking and it's affecting how we discuss subjects.



yep

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Reply #28 posted 11/08/18 2:06am

NorthC

It's happening in Holland too. Recently Jordan Peterson was invited to speak at the university of Amsterdam and a group of people at the university protested. They didn't want him banned (that would be like censorship and they knew it), so they requested an extra speaker, basically someone standing next to Peterson and say "no, no, it's not true" at everything Peterson said. As if the students are unable to make up their own minds.
They didn't get their way. Peterson came as planned.
I may disagree with everything you say, but I will defend your right to say it.
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Reply #29 posted 11/08/18 6:08am

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

peggyon said:

I am a centrist Democrat and have a university degree. I feel that universities have for some time been influenced by the liberal/progessive mind-set to a large extent.

I have a daughter at Columbia U. and she feels many of these beliefs have been taken way too far. I agree.

This is the "snowflake generation"

Feelings need to be validated over facts and information.

.

We see it in this P&R forum. Which is expressed in the forum heading.

People get upset quickly if you talk about 'them' ie their race, political label, religion, nation etc

even if you're presenting factual information.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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