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Reply #270 posted 09/14/18 3:35pm

jjhunsecker

avatar

djThunderfunk said:



jjhunsecker said:




djThunderfunk said:


Are you guys actually getting hung up pretending the red color was used for any other reason than to differentiate my response from jj's coments? Unfuckingbelievable how ridiculous and petty some people can be. Grow the fuck up. lol




You know what...I'm not even going there. Somebody has to be the man in these situations


[Edited 9/14/18 12:29pm]




Says the "man" that piled on the "let's make fun of the use of red" bandwagon. What? You gonna pretend that it wasn't obvious why I used a different color? Right....

Reply #58, Rodeo used the exact same method, highlighting with red, nobody said shit. It's childish to make a big deal out of it and rag me for it, much less jump in when others do.





[Edited 9/14/18 13:50pm]



Hilarious! I addressed this matter, just not in the manner that you wanted me to. And now I won't
[Edited 9/14/18 15:37pm]
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Reply #271 posted 09/14/18 3:48pm

djThunderfunk

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8 days and 269 posts from the OP and where are we?

10 times I've explained the legal ramifications concerning the platforms and their classification as private companies as either a public utility or private publisher, what the rights and responsibilities are in each situation and why they cannot continue to enjoy the benefits of both and the responsibilities of neither. 10 times, plus a couple other posters explained it and I provided Matt Taibbi's explanation.

The only acknowledgement has been a "BFD" and a "So what", and still the argument keeps being made that they are private companies that are free to police content, ignoring the ramifications of the argument regarding their legal classification. Either the "ban Jones" group does not understand the legal issues or are unwilling to discuss them. I assume most of you just don't get it.

I've debunked fake news that Jones accosted Rubio, advocated violence, lost custody of his children, and that traffic to his websites was down.

I've asked twice if Jones is responsible for the actions of his viewers... no response.

I've called out the fatshaming and it continued.

Meanwhile, the thread starter and primary fat-shamer has referred to Jones as:
- "fat fuck", 40 times, plus a few repeats from another poster

- "fat", 22 times + 4 fat jokes

- other expletives, fuck, pussy, piece of shit, etc, a couple dozen times

- referred to someone else as "retards", twice

(full disclosure, NONE of these words are offensive to me personally, I do find the abundance here childish, and acknowledge body-shaming and "retards" are currently socially unacceptable)


And most disturbing of all, expressed a desire to commit violence against Jones 13 times.

I have this crazy idea that discussion of whether or not Jones is responsible for the actions of his listeners could be interesting and insightful. I find the legal status issues facing online platforms fascinating and am intrigued by discussion of how it will all play out. These are relevent discussions that get to the core of this issue.

These angry outbursts however amount to nothing but ugly, reactionary name-calling, much of it socially unacceptable by today's standards. As for the desire for violence... just, wow!

And that's where we are... wink

EDIT to add: I don't think any of the profanity in this thread should be censored or snipped. Jones is a public figure and not a member of this thread and so I see no problem with it. I do think the unhinged abundance says more about the one doing it than anybody else, but that's neither here nor there. I am surprised however that the body-shaming has gone on this much with but a tiny amount of comment, no attacks and no snipping, and I am absolutely shocked that the word retards didn't upset anyone. I'll remember that the next time there's a debate about censoring comedians that use the word. Just sayin'...




[Edited 9/14/18 16:52pm]

We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #272 posted 09/14/18 4:23pm

djThunderfunk

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So on one hand, I find most of these remixes of alex jones rant to be absolutely hysterical, on the other hand, this metal mix kind of creeps me out... SuperFurry will dig this one. lol

We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #273 posted 09/14/18 10:28pm

maplenpg

djThunderfunk said:

8 days and 269 posts from the OP and where are we?

10 times I've explained the legal ramifications concerning the platforms and their classification as private companies as either a public utility or private publisher, what the rights and responsibilities are in each situation and why they cannot continue to enjoy the benefits of both and the responsibilities of neither. 10 times, plus a couple other posters explained it and I provided Matt Taibbi's explanation.

The only acknowledgement has been a "BFD" and a "So what", and still the argument keeps being made that they are private companies that are free to police content, ignoring the ramifications of the argument regarding their legal classification. Either the "ban Jones" group does not understand the legal issues or are unwilling to discuss them. I assume most of you just don't get it.

I've debunked fake news that Jones accosted Rubio, advocated violence, lost custody of his children, and that traffic to his websites was down.

I've asked twice if Jones is responsible for the actions of his viewers... no response.

I've called out the fatshaming and it continued.

Meanwhile, the thread starter and primary fat-shamer has referred to Jones as:
- "fat fuck", 40 times, plus a few repeats from another poster


- "fat", 22 times + 4 fat jokes


- other expletives, fuck, pussy, piece of shit, etc, a couple dozen times


- referred to someone else as "retards", twice

(full disclosure, NONE of these words are offensive to me personally, I do find the abundance here childish, and acknowledge body-shaming and "retards" are currently socially unacceptable)



And most disturbing of all, expressed a desire to commit violence against Jones 13 times.

I have this crazy idea that discussion of whether or not Jones is responsible for the actions of his listeners could be interesting and insightful. I find the legal status issues facing online platforms fascinating and am intrigued by discussion of how it will all play out. These are relevent discussions that get to the core of this issue.

These angry outbursts however amount to nothing but ugly, reactionary name-calling, much of it socially unacceptable by today's standards. As for the desire for violence... just, wow!

And that's where we are... wink

EDIT to add: I don't think any of the profanity in this thread should be censored or snipped. Jones is a public figure and not a member of this thread and so I see no problem with it. I do think the unhinged abundance says more about the one doing it than anybody else, but that's neither here nor there. I am surprised however that the body-shaming has gone on this much with but a tiny amount of comment, no attacks and no snipping, and I am absolutely shocked that the word retards didn't upset anyone. I'll remember that the next time there's a debate about censoring comedians that use the word. Just sayin'...









[Edited 9/14/18 16:52pm]



I really don't have time to answer this fully but you asked if Jones was responsible for the actions of his listeners? My answer would be that if those actions were directly attributed to the bile he spews then yes, in my eyes, he is in some part responsible. For example, the abuse the Sandy Hook parents received was a direct result of his lies. He is responsible in some part. Here in England Tommy Robinson was permanently banned from Twitter for his hate speech against Muslims. Do I have sympathy for him? No; I cannot have sympathy for those who spread lies and hatred. My own opinion is that social media has a long, long way to go yet. I'm in favour of much stricter policing, even if some whine that their freedom of speech is compromised.
It never ceases to amaze me how cruel humans can be against fellow humans and animals, especially when in the pursuit of money and power.
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Reply #274 posted 09/15/18 7:45am

djThunderfunk

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maplenpg said:

I really don't have time to answer this fully but you asked if Jones was responsible for the actions of his listeners? My answer would be that if those actions were directly attributed to the bile he spews then yes, in my eyes, he is in some part responsible. For example, the abuse the Sandy Hook parents received was a direct result of his lies. He is responsible in some part. Here in England Tommy Robinson was permanently banned from Twitter for his hate speech against Muslims. Do I have sympathy for him? No; I cannot have sympathy for those who spread lies and hatred. My own opinion is that social media has a long, long way to go yet. I'm in favour of much stricter policing, even if some whine that their freedom of speech is compromised.


Was "the abuse the Sandy Hook parents received a direct result of his lies"? What exactly did he say that led some to harass them?

BTW, "freedom of speech is compromised" is not an argument being made in this thread. It is a point worth discussing, but not without the discussion of the legal status of the platforms and whether or not they are to be considered a publisher or a utility. The issues are intrinsic to each other.

I'd also be careful attributing responsiblitiy for the actions of the harassers on Jones. What if someone who watches CNN all the time becomes so enraged at "the right" that they harass or hurt someone, is CNN responsible? There are many people in the news media and on social media fearmongering that the trumpclown hates all people of color and will take away their rights and the rights of other marginilized people. What if someone who listens to that all day decides to take action against the trumpclown, are all the people that fed their delusions responsible? Slippery slope...

If Jones actively encouraged the harassment, he's fucked. If all he did was talk about how he didn't believe it and some loon believed him and decided to harass the parents, I would argue that is not on Jones.







[Edited 9/15/18 7:51am]

We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #275 posted 09/15/18 8:21am

2freaky4church
1

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dJ, you are crashing and burning. Pull out now.

"My motherfucker's so cool sheep count him."
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Reply #276 posted 09/15/18 8:27am

KoolEaze

avatar

2freaky4church1 said:

dJ, you are crashing and burning. Pull out now.

Why would you say that ?

I think his thoughts on this thread and the John McCain thread make a lot of sense.

As a regular lurker and poster in this forum I don´t really understand your problem with him, nor the way you´re constantly trying to present him as some sort of "rightwing" follower, which, at least in my opinion, he absolutely isn´t .

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"




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Reply #277 posted 09/15/18 8:58am

2freaky4church
1

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He posts things to poke people.

"My motherfucker's so cool sheep count him."
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Reply #278 posted 09/15/18 9:10am

djThunderfunk

avatar

KoolEaze said:

2freaky4church1 said:

dJ, you are crashing and burning. Pull out now.

Why would you say that ?

I think his thoughts on this thread and the John McCain thread make a lot of sense.

As a regular lurker and poster in this forum I don´t really understand your problem with him, nor the way you´re constantly trying to present him as some sort of "rightwing" follower, which, at least in my opinion, he absolutely isn´t .


Thanks KoolEaze. 2freaky's just trolling and baiting. It's way easier than addressing any of the points I made.


[Edited 9/15/18 9:13am]

We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #279 posted 09/15/18 9:19am

djThunderfunk

avatar

2freaky4church1 said:

He posts things to poke people.


That's bullshit. You post things to stir shit.

If there is any "poking" or trolling going on here, it is by the OP thread starter. The entire thread is bait thread designed to troll the few of us that approach this issue with nuance instead of partisanship and hate for Jones.

From the OP on, almost every post by the one who started this has been vulgar, violent, outbursts designed to "poke" those that disagree, while ignoring the actual issues this country faces in regards to how we will move forward in regards to freedom of speech and digital platforms. He didn't start this thread to have a nuanced discussion, he's baiting and he's trolling. And now so are you.

But you keep on accusing me of trolling and ignoring the real issues, the fat-shaming and the violent outbursts. Anybody that reads through the thread can see through your bullshit.



[Edited 9/15/18 9:27am]

We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #280 posted 09/15/18 1:51pm

herb4

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My red text comment was primarily aimed at superfunnyanimal who tends to use it in a way that implies taht the bigger and redder it is, teh more correct the assertion. I certainly didn't expect people to get in a twist about it but here we are.

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Reply #281 posted 09/15/18 9:38pm

djThunderfunk

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herb4 said:

My red text comment was primarily aimed at superfunnyanimal who tends to use it in a way that implies taht the bigger and redder it is, teh more correct the assertion. I certainly didn't expect people to get in a twist about it but here we are.


Since you posted your comment 13 hours after I used the color, and 4 days since superfurry had used it, naturally, I assumed you were talking to me. But, ok.


We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #282 posted 09/16/18 5:17am

herb4

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2freaky4church1 said:

dJ, you are crashing and burning. Pull out now.


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Reply #283 posted 09/16/18 6:11am

herb4

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And, yes, Jones is culpable on more than a few levels for the Sandy Hook bullshit; the same way that Bill O'Reilly bares some responsibility for Dr. Tiller, Hannity for birtherism and Seth Rich conspiracy stories, plus even Trump himslef for the casual acceptance and implied sympathy for white nationalists, xenophobia and the rise of fascism. I didn't even touch on the assholes that shot up a pizza joint, flew a plane into an IRS office building and shot up a newsroom.

Anti vax conspiracy yahoos are complicit in the rise of easily preventable diseases as well.

None of this is the same as "rock music and/or videogames are responsible for mass shootings, devil worship and cop killing" and conflating those two arguments while framing them as free speech issues is arguing in bad faith and being willfully obtuse.

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Reply #284 posted 09/16/18 6:40am

djThunderfunk

avatar

herb4 said:

And, yes, Jones is culpable on more than a few levels for the Sandy Hook bullshit; the same way that Bill O'Reilly bares some responsibility for Dr. Tiller, Hannity for birtherism and Seth Rich conspiracy stories, plus even Trump himslef for the casual acceptance and implied sympathy for white nationalists, xenophobia and the rise of fascism. I didn't even touch on the assholes that shot up a pizza joint, flew a plane into an IRS office building and shot up a newsroom.

Anti vax conspiracy yahoos are complicit in the rise of easily preventable diseases as well.

None of this is the same as "rock music and/or videogames are responsible for mass shootings, devil worship and cop killing" and conflating those two arguments while framing them as free speech issues is arguing in bad faith and being willfully obtuse.


Ok. What did Alex say that makes him responsible for the actions of those that harasssed the parents?

Did he direct them to harass? Did he suggest it? Is him stating that he didn't believe it happened enough for him to be responsible for someone that heard that statement's actions? Or, would he/did he have to say something more direct to be responsible?

As for the bolded part above, did somebody in this thread say that this is the same as "rock music and/or videogames are responsible for mass shootings, devil worship and cop killing" or conflate "those two arguments while framing them as free speech issues"? You keep saying this is the argument being made but I don't see anybody here making it.

Care to address the actual argument that I am making instead of this strawman?




[Edited 9/16/18 6:49am]

We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #285 posted 09/16/18 7:00am

SuperFurryAnim
al

avatar

I really have a laugh at Rodeo and some people here the "what about the children" type mentality or people that would say what about all the "people that died" on 9-11. Somehow these conspiracy theories were directly involved. Like somehow, Alex Jones is to blame for SandyHook and 9-11. Like somehow Alex Jones abused children over the SandyHook comments.

I think we can all collectively say.
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Reply #286 posted 09/16/18 7:02am

SuperFurryAnim
al

avatar

herb4 said:

My red text comment was primarily aimed at superfunnyanimal who tends to use it in a way that implies taht the bigger and redder it is, teh more correct the assertion. I certainly didn't expect people to get in a twist about it but here we are.

Waaa..I'm just too lazy to go back and read what you posted at me.

I think we can all collectively say.
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Reply #287 posted 09/16/18 7:28am

herb4

avatar

djThunderfunk said:

herb4 said:

And, yes, Jones is culpable on more than a few levels for the Sandy Hook bullshit; the same way that Bill O'Reilly bares some responsibility for Dr. Tiller, Hannity for birtherism and Seth Rich conspiracy stories, plus even Trump himslef for the casual acceptance and implied sympathy for white nationalists, xenophobia and the rise of fascism. I didn't even touch on the assholes that shot up a pizza joint, flew a plane into an IRS office building and shot up a newsroom.

Anti vax conspiracy yahoos are complicit in the rise of easily preventable diseases as well.

None of this is the same as "rock music and/or videogames are responsible for mass shootings, devil worship and cop killing" and conflating those two arguments while framing them as free speech issues is arguing in bad faith and being willfully obtuse.


Ok. What did Alex say that makes him responsible for the actions of those that harasssed the parents?

Did he direct them to harass? Did he suggest it? Is him stating that he didn't believe it happened enough for him to be responsible for someone that heard that statement's actions? Or, would he/did he have to say something more direct to be responsible?

As for the bolded part above, did somebody in this thread say that this is the same as "rock music and/or videogames are responsible for mass shootings, devil worship and cop killing" or conflate "those two arguments while framing them as free speech issues"? You keep saying this is the argument being made but I don't see anybody here making it.

Care to address the actual argument that I am making instead of this strawman?




[Edited 9/16/18 6:49am]


The part you bolded is a common refrain of moral majority types and, yes, the argument you seem to be using is very similar thematically so I threw it in there.

To answer your questions, and I can't beleive I have to do this for you, but OK.

...

“Now is the time to act on the enemy before they do a false flag,” and calling on them to get their “battle rifles” ready" - Alex Jones

...

Two videos contained hate speech against Muslims, and a third contained hate speech against transgender people, sources said. A fourth showed a child who was pushed to the ground by an adult man, under the headline “How to prevent liberalism.” All four of the videos are currently posted on Infowars.

The offending videos do not include Jones’ threatening rant about Robert Mueller, which stirred a controversy earlier this week after it was posted on Facebook. That video does not appear to have been uploaded to YouTube.

"Stop feeling like you don't have power. Stop feeling pathetic and weak. Break out of your television-induced trance. It starts with a war growl. It starts with getting fired up, staring at yourself in the mirror, and showing some teeth..."

"AAAHHH! YAAAHHH! WE KNOW WE'RE UNDER ATTACK! WE KNOW IT! WE'RE BREAKING THE CONDITIONING! YAAAHHH! RAAAHH! WE'RE COMING FOR YA GLOBALIST. COMING FOR YA! COMING FOR YA! WE KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOING! I'm sorry. I just get FIRED UP when I think about what they're doing to us and how I wanna resist them, and how easy they are to defeat."

"Stop being weak! And when you see a threat coming down on you, deal with it!! BECOME A HUMAN AGAIN! STOP BEING WEAK! We have a bunch of criminals coming down on us. God, ugh! Murdering scum. I wanna get humanity awake. I wanna get our forces up. And I wanna bring these people to justice. And you know what I mean. You know what I mean! I wanna unleash humanity, not have a bunch of con artist pot-bellied chicken-neck pieces of garbage running our world!"

“When I think about all the children Hillary Clinton has personally murdered and chopped up and raped, I have zero fear standing up against her,” Jones said in a (now deleted) YouTube video posted on November 4, 2016. “Yeah, you heard me right. Hillary Clinton has personally murdered children. I just can’t hold back the truth anymore.”

The Pizzagate incident, like Jade Helm before it, illustrates Jones’s ability to influence his followers to take action in the real world, no matter how far-fetched or unrealistic his claims might be.


"And I am here to tell you, 1776 WILL COMMENCE AGAIN IF YOU TRY TO TAKE OUR FIREARMS! "

"Okay. Alright. That guy is taking his helmet off. I'm gonna punch him in the throat the minute he tries to get up and do something, and then I'm gonna assault those next three guys. Then they'll probably pull a weapon. I need to take that." I mean, that's what I'm thinking whenever something like that is going on. I can't help it. I'm thinking, "Alright, I'm ready to kill." That's just how I am.

After the shooting incident, Jones issued a rare apology for his outrageous allegations against Alefantis, saying, “I made comments…that in hindsight I regret.” It has been pointed out that Alefantis, as a private citizen, could easily sue Jones for spreading baseless accusations, and Jones’s carefully worded apology may have been an attempt to stave off any future legal action
...

Now, what do you suppose most of that means? If I run around baselessly saying my neighbor rapes kids and some shithead burns their house down over it then, yes, I am complicit. if I claim some black dude raped a white woman and he is subsequently lynched then, yes, I am culpable. Running around telling people to keep their powder dry because "the globalists" are coming for you IS inciting people to violence through fear by telling them they are under attack and defend themselves. It's not even a dog whistle, it's a fucking bullhorn.

Jones isn't under arrest or charged with a crime. He's no martyr. He's not a symbol of media or government oppression. He's not silenced. You seem to be arguing along the lines of "first they came for the podcasters and I did not object because I am not a podcaster" and clutching your pearls over some loudmouth asshole that tells people that Hillary Clinton eats babies and uses the deserved blowback as proof that "they are out to get him". I wonder what tune you'd be singing if one of your kids got shot and crazy people showed up at your home or your job to tell you your child wasn't dead and you are a liar.

Where do you think these idiots GOT THIS IDEA?

Why is this difficult for you?

"But...but...People are using CURSE WORDS and weight shaming! I am deeply offended!" - you


This is a really weird hill for you to die on, man.

[Edited 9/16/18 7:30am]

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Reply #288 posted 09/16/18 7:53am

13cjk13

herb4 said:

djThunderfunk said:


Ok. What did Alex say that makes him responsible for the actions of those that harasssed the parents?

Did he direct them to harass? Did he suggest it? Is him stating that he didn't believe it happened enough for him to be responsible for someone that heard that statement's actions? Or, would he/did he have to say something more direct to be responsible?

As for the bolded part above, did somebody in this thread say that this is the same as "rock music and/or videogames are responsible for mass shootings, devil worship and cop killing" or conflate "those two arguments while framing them as free speech issues"? You keep saying this is the argument being made but I don't see anybody here making it.

Care to address the actual argument that I am making instead of this strawman?




[Edited 9/16/18 6:49am]


The part you bolded is a common refrain of moral majority types and, yes, the argument you seem to be using is very similar thematically so I threw it in there.

To answer your questions, and I can't beleive I have to do this for you, but OK.

...

“Now is the time to act on the enemy before they do a false flag,” and calling on them to get their “battle rifles” ready" - Alex Jones

...

Two videos contained hate speech against Muslims, and a third contained hate speech against transgender people, sources said. A fourth showed a child who was pushed to the ground by an adult man, under the headline “How to prevent liberalism.” All four of the videos are currently posted on Infowars.

The offending videos do not include Jones’ threatening rant about Robert Mueller, which stirred a controversy earlier this week after it was posted on Facebook. That video does not appear to have been uploaded to YouTube.

"Stop feeling like you don't have power. Stop feeling pathetic and weak. Break out of your television-induced trance. It starts with a war growl. It starts with getting fired up, staring at yourself in the mirror, and showing some teeth..."

"AAAHHH! YAAAHHH! WE KNOW WE'RE UNDER ATTACK! WE KNOW IT! WE'RE BREAKING THE CONDITIONING! YAAAHHH! RAAAHH! WE'RE COMING FOR YA GLOBALIST. COMING FOR YA! COMING FOR YA! WE KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOING! I'm sorry. I just get FIRED UP when I think about what they're doing to us and how I wanna resist them, and how easy they are to defeat."

"Stop being weak! And when you see a threat coming down on you, deal with it!! BECOME A HUMAN AGAIN! STOP BEING WEAK! We have a bunch of criminals coming down on us. God, ugh! Murdering scum. I wanna get humanity awake. I wanna get our forces up. And I wanna bring these people to justice. And you know what I mean. You know what I mean! I wanna unleash humanity, not have a bunch of con artist pot-bellied chicken-neck pieces of garbage running our world!"

“When I think about all the children Hillary Clinton has personally murdered and chopped up and raped, I have zero fear standing up against her,” Jones said in a (now deleted) YouTube video posted on November 4, 2016. “Yeah, you heard me right. Hillary Clinton has personally murdered children. I just can’t hold back the truth anymore.”

The Pizzagate incident, like Jade Helm before it, illustrates Jones’s ability to influence his followers to take action in the real world, no matter how far-fetched or unrealistic his claims might be.


"And I am here to tell you, 1776 WILL COMMENCE AGAIN IF YOU TRY TO TAKE OUR FIREARMS! "

"Okay. Alright. That guy is taking his helmet off. I'm gonna punch him in the throat the minute he tries to get up and do something, and then I'm gonna assault those next three guys. Then they'll probably pull a weapon. I need to take that." I mean, that's what I'm thinking whenever something like that is going on. I can't help it. I'm thinking, "Alright, I'm ready to kill." That's just how I am.

After the shooting incident, Jones issued a rare apology for his outrageous allegations against Alefantis, saying, “I made comments…that in hindsight I regret.” It has been pointed out that Alefantis, as a private citizen, could easily sue Jones for spreading baseless accusations, and Jones’s carefully worded apology may have been an attempt to stave off any future legal action
...

Now, what do you suppose most of that means? If I run around baselessly saying my neighbor rapes kids and some shithead burns their house down over it then, yes, I am complicit. if I claim some black dude raped a white woman and he is subsequently lynched then, yes, I am culpable. Running around telling people to keep their powder dry because "the globalists" are coming for you IS inciting people to violence through fear by telling them they are under attack and defend themselves. It's not even a dog whistle, it's a fucking bullhorn.

Jones isn't under arrest or charged with a crime. He's no martyr. He's not a symbol of media or government oppression. He's not silenced. You seem to be arguing along the lines of "first they came for the podcasters and I did not object because I am not a podcaster" and clutching your pearls over some loudmouth asshole that tells people that Hillary Clinton eats babies and uses the deserved blowback as proof that "they are out to get him". I wonder what tune you'd be singing if one of your kids got shot and crazy people showed up at your home or your job to tell you your child wasn't dead and you are a liar.

Where do you think these idiots GOT THIS IDEA?

Why is this difficult for you?

"But...but...People are using CURSE WORDS and weight shaming! I am deeply offended!" - you


This is a really weird hill for you to die on, man.

[Edited 9/16/18 7:30am]

And I thought i couldn't HATE that fat filthy fuck any more than I already do. Wow.

"Our liberty depends on the freedom of the press, and that cannot be limited without being lost".
-Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #289 posted 09/16/18 9:42am

djThunderfunk

avatar

herb4 said:

djThunderfunk said:


Ok. What did Alex say that makes him responsible for the actions of those that harasssed the parents?

Did he direct them to harass? Did he suggest it? Is him stating that he didn't believe it happened enough for him to be responsible for someone that heard that statement's actions? Or, would he/did he have to say something more direct to be responsible?

As for the bolded part above, did somebody in this thread say that this is the same as "rock music and/or videogames are responsible for mass shootings, devil worship and cop killing" or conflate "those two arguments while framing them as free speech issues"? You keep saying this is the argument being made but I don't see anybody here making it.

Care to address the actual argument that I am making instead of this strawman?




[Edited 9/16/18 6:49am]


The part you bolded is a common refrain of moral majority types and, yes, the argument you seem to be using is very similar thematically so I threw it in there.

To answer your questions, and I can't beleive I have to do this for you, but OK.

...

“Now is the time to act on the enemy before they do a false flag,” and calling on them to get their “battle rifles” ready" - Alex Jones

...

Two videos contained hate speech against Muslims, and a third contained hate speech against transgender people, sources said. A fourth showed a child who was pushed to the ground by an adult man, under the headline “How to prevent liberalism.” All four of the videos are currently posted on Infowars.

The offending videos do not include Jones’ threatening rant about Robert Mueller, which stirred a controversy earlier this week after it was posted on Facebook. That video does not appear to have been uploaded to YouTube.

"Stop feeling like you don't have power. Stop feeling pathetic and weak. Break out of your television-induced trance. It starts with a war growl. It starts with getting fired up, staring at yourself in the mirror, and showing some teeth..."

"AAAHHH! YAAAHHH! WE KNOW WE'RE UNDER ATTACK! WE KNOW IT! WE'RE BREAKING THE CONDITIONING! YAAAHHH! RAAAHH! WE'RE COMING FOR YA GLOBALIST. COMING FOR YA! COMING FOR YA! WE KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOING! I'm sorry. I just get FIRED UP when I think about what they're doing to us and how I wanna resist them, and how easy they are to defeat."

"Stop being weak! And when you see a threat coming down on you, deal with it!! BECOME A HUMAN AGAIN! STOP BEING WEAK! We have a bunch of criminals coming down on us. God, ugh! Murdering scum. I wanna get humanity awake. I wanna get our forces up. And I wanna bring these people to justice. And you know what I mean. You know what I mean! I wanna unleash humanity, not have a bunch of con artist pot-bellied chicken-neck pieces of garbage running our world!"

“When I think about all the children Hillary Clinton has personally murdered and chopped up and raped, I have zero fear standing up against her,” Jones said in a (now deleted) YouTube video posted on November 4, 2016. “Yeah, you heard me right. Hillary Clinton has personally murdered children. I just can’t hold back the truth anymore.”

The Pizzagate incident, like Jade Helm before it, illustrates Jones’s ability to influence his followers to take action in the real world, no matter how far-fetched or unrealistic his claims might be.


"And I am here to tell you, 1776 WILL COMMENCE AGAIN IF YOU TRY TO TAKE OUR FIREARMS! "

"Okay. Alright. That guy is taking his helmet off. I'm gonna punch him in the throat the minute he tries to get up and do something, and then I'm gonna assault those next three guys. Then they'll probably pull a weapon. I need to take that." I mean, that's what I'm thinking whenever something like that is going on. I can't help it. I'm thinking, "Alright, I'm ready to kill." That's just how I am.

After the shooting incident, Jones issued a rare apology for his outrageous allegations against Alefantis, saying, “I made comments…that in hindsight I regret.” It has been pointed out that Alefantis, as a private citizen, could easily sue Jones for spreading baseless accusations, and Jones’s carefully worded apology may have been an attempt to stave off any future legal action
...

Now, what do you suppose most of that means? If I run around baselessly saying my neighbor rapes kids and some shithead burns their house down over it then, yes, I am complicit. if I claim some black dude raped a white woman and he is subsequently lynched then, yes, I am culpable. Running around telling people to keep their powder dry because "the globalists" are coming for you IS inciting people to violence through fear by telling them they are under attack and defend themselves. It's not even a dog whistle, it's a fucking bullhorn.

Jones isn't under arrest or charged with a crime. He's no martyr. He's not a symbol of media or government oppression. He's not silenced. You seem to be arguing along the lines of "first they came for the podcasters and I did not object because I am not a podcaster" and clutching your pearls over some loudmouth asshole that tells people that Hillary Clinton eats babies and uses the deserved blowback as proof that "they are out to get him". I wonder what tune you'd be singing if one of your kids got shot and crazy people showed up at your home or your job to tell you your child wasn't dead and you are a liar.

Where do you think these idiots GOT THIS IDEA?

Why is this difficult for you?

"But...but...People are using CURSE WORDS and weight shaming! I am deeply offended!" - you


This is a really weird hill for you to die on, man.

[Edited 9/16/18 7:30am]


Wow! That's a bunch of batshit crazy statements you've quoted here, must have taken awhile. I notice none of them amount to inciting harassment against the parents of Sandy Hook though, not that I'm surprised. That's okay, I can't find a quote of him doing that either, just the accusation.

Since you are going to absolutely lie by falsely QUOTING me as saying I am offended by the curse words and fat-shaming when I specifically did NOT say that but did say "full disclosure, NONE of these words are offensive to me personally, I do find the abundance here childish, and acknowledge body-shaming and "retards" are currently socially unacceptable" and "I don't think any of the profanity in this thread should be censored or snipped". Somehow you've translated "none of these words are offensive to me personally" as "I am deeply offended"? GTFOOHWTBSYFR!!

Why is it so difficult for YOU to address what I actually say instead of mischaracterizing, misquoting, lying and continuing to strawman the discussion? Clearly you don't understand the issues regarding the rights and responsiblities involved in how we classify digital platforms, don't have any evidence of Jones inciting harassment against the Sandy Hook parents and are willing to outright lie about what I have said. Maybe if you choose to have an honest discussion we can continue.

"hill to die on"? falloff What? I'm dead to you now? lol lol lol









[Edited 9/16/18 10:00am]

We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #290 posted 09/16/18 10:59am

herb4

avatar

I addressed everything you wrote and thought I was rather clear. I even pre-emptively rebutted your first point. Sorry you didn't like it. I feel the quotes speak for themselves and I explained why they're at best irresponsible and at worst incendiary and dangerous. Not on me if you can't see it or extract meaning from obvious dogwhistles.

And "A hill to die on" is an expression.

It’s a war metaphor, like “making your stand” or “drawing a line in the sand.” It means “do you really want to insist on your point of view about this?”

Apparently you do.

YOU: "Why won't anyone address my questions and statements?!?"

THREAD: *people repeatedly address your statements and add some thoughts of their own*

YOU: "Why are you saying this or that? I didn't even mention those things!"

THREAD: Damn, dude. That's kind of fucked up logic"

YOU: Cursing invalidates and weakens your argument .

No it does not. Also fuck Alex Jones and anyone defending him.

Moving forward, I'll make sure to ONLY stick to your line of rhetoric and allow YOU EXCLUSIVELY to frame the terms of the debate, making sure to limit my thoughts and ideas on the issue no matter how relevant to the discussion they might be.

So Alex Jones and people like him essentially have to explicitely say "Hey, listeners, go run over someone with a car, shoot up a pizza joint and kill a journalist" in order for you to cede any incitement to violence? Good to know. Still not sure why this minor semantic difference is the breaking point for you but at least you've been clear about it. I think it's a moronic distinction, myself, but others may disagree. There's no "slippery slope" at work here surrounding freedom of speech no matter how much you infer that there is.

Oh, and here, lemme help you out.





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Reply #291 posted 09/16/18 11:57am

maplenpg

djThunderfunk said:

herb4 said:


The part you bolded is a common refrain of moral majority types and, yes, the argument you seem to be using is very similar thematically so I threw it in there.

To answer your questions, and I can't beleive I have to do this for you, but OK.

...

“Now is the time to act on the enemy before they do a false flag,” and calling on them to get their “battle rifles” ready" - Alex Jones

...

Two videos contained hate speech against Muslims, and a third contained hate speech against transgender people, sources said. A fourth showed a child who was pushed to the ground by an adult man, under the headline “How to prevent liberalism.” All four of the videos are currently posted on Infowars.

The offending videos do not include Jones’ threatening rant about Robert Mueller, which stirred a controversy earlier this week after it was posted on Facebook. That video does not appear to have been uploaded to YouTube.

"Stop feeling like you don't have power. Stop feeling pathetic and weak. Break out of your television-induced trance. It starts with a war growl. It starts with getting fired up, staring at yourself in the mirror, and showing some teeth..."

"AAAHHH! YAAAHHH! WE KNOW WE'RE UNDER ATTACK! WE KNOW IT! WE'RE BREAKING THE CONDITIONING! YAAAHHH! RAAAHH! WE'RE COMING FOR YA GLOBALIST. COMING FOR YA! COMING FOR YA! WE KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOING! I'm sorry. I just get FIRED UP when I think about what they're doing to us and how I wanna resist them, and how easy they are to defeat."

"Stop being weak! And when you see a threat coming down on you, deal with it!! BECOME A HUMAN AGAIN! STOP BEING WEAK! We have a bunch of criminals coming down on us. God, ugh! Murdering scum. I wanna get humanity awake. I wanna get our forces up. And I wanna bring these people to justice. And you know what I mean. You know what I mean! I wanna unleash humanity, not have a bunch of con artist pot-bellied chicken-neck pieces of garbage running our world!"

“When I think about all the children Hillary Clinton has personally murdered and chopped up and raped, I have zero fear standing up against her,” Jones said in a (now deleted) YouTube video posted on November 4, 2016. “Yeah, you heard me right. Hillary Clinton has personally murdered children. I just can’t hold back the truth anymore.”

The Pizzagate incident, like Jade Helm before it, illustrates Jones’s ability to influence his followers to take action in the real world, no matter how far-fetched or unrealistic his claims might be.


"And I am here to tell you, 1776 WILL COMMENCE AGAIN IF YOU TRY TO TAKE OUR FIREARMS! "

"Okay. Alright. That guy is taking his helmet off. I'm gonna punch him in the throat the minute he tries to get up and do something, and then I'm gonna assault those next three guys. Then they'll probably pull a weapon. I need to take that." I mean, that's what I'm thinking whenever something like that is going on. I can't help it. I'm thinking, "Alright, I'm ready to kill." That's just how I am.

After the shooting incident, Jones issued a rare apology for his outrageous allegations against Alefantis, saying, “I made comments…that in hindsight I regret.” It has been pointed out that Alefantis, as a private citizen, could easily sue Jones for spreading baseless accusations, and Jones’s carefully worded apology may have been an attempt to stave off any future legal action
...

Now, what do you suppose most of that means? If I run around baselessly saying my neighbor rapes kids and some shithead burns their house down over it then, yes, I am complicit. if I claim some black dude raped a white woman and he is subsequently lynched then, yes, I am culpable. Running around telling people to keep their powder dry because "the globalists" are coming for you IS inciting people to violence through fear by telling them they are under attack and defend themselves. It's not even a dog whistle, it's a fucking bullhorn.

Jones isn't under arrest or charged with a crime. He's no martyr. He's not a symbol of media or government oppression. He's not silenced. You seem to be arguing along the lines of "first they came for the podcasters and I did not object because I am not a podcaster" and clutching your pearls over some loudmouth asshole that tells people that Hillary Clinton eats babies and uses the deserved blowback as proof that "they are out to get him". I wonder what tune you'd be singing if one of your kids got shot and crazy people showed up at your home or your job to tell you your child wasn't dead and you are a liar.

Where do you think these idiots GOT THIS IDEA?

Why is this difficult for you?

"But...but...People are using CURSE WORDS and weight shaming! I am deeply offended!" - you


This is a really weird hill for you to die on, man.

[Edited 9/16/18 7:30am]


Wow! That's a bunch of batshit crazy statements you've quoted here, must have taken awhile. I notice none of them amount to inciting harassment against the parents of Sandy Hook though, not that I'm surprised. That's okay, I can't find a quote of him doing that either, just the accusation.

Since you are going to absolutely lie by falsely QUOTING me as saying I am offended by the curse words and fat-shaming when I specifically did NOT say that but did say "full disclosure, NONE of these words are offensive to me personally, I do find the abundance here childish, and acknowledge body-shaming and "retards" are currently socially unacceptable" and "I don't think any of the profanity in this thread should be censored or snipped". Somehow you've translated "none of these words are offensive to me personally" as "I am deeply offended"? GTFOOHWTBSYFR!!

Why is it so difficult for YOU to address what I actually say instead of mischaracterizing, misquoting, lying and continuing to strawman the discussion? Clearly you don't understand the issues regarding the rights and responsiblities involved in how we classify digital platforms, don't have any evidence of Jones inciting harassment against the Sandy Hook parents and are willing to outright lie about what I have said. Maybe if you choose to have an honest discussion we can continue.

"hill to die on"? falloff What? I'm dead to you now? lol lol lol









[Edited 9/16/18 10:00am]

Harassment of Sandy Hook families

According to Jones, the school shooting was a hoax, and the corpses of the children were in fact child actors playing roles. The families of the murdered children, according to Jones, were complicit in this liberal anti-gun plot, and he has helpfully published their personal details, according to an affidavit since filed by one of the families. Millions of visitors to Jones's Infowars website have gobbled up this unspeakable lie, and some have made it their mission to track down and harass the families.



Lucy Richards was one of them.



Richards was sent to prison last summer after pleading guilty to making death threats against the family of Noah Pozner, a six-year-old cut down by mass murderer Adam Lanza's bullets at Sandy Hook. The judge who sentenced her told her the family's sad reality was the only reality, and that she was not entitled to her "alternative facts," a phrase famously invented by Trump shill Kellyanne​ Conway to defend her boss's presidential lies.



But Richards was only one of many in Jones's posse of gullible idiots. Together, they have hounded the Pozner family relentlessly, tracking them down every time they relocate to escape the harassment. The family now reportedly lives in a high-security community hundreds of kilometres from the cemetery where their little boy is buried. They no longer visit his grave, for fear of attracting more nasty attention.



Source: https://www.cbc.ca/news/o...-1.4776763




9 families have filed lawsuits against Jones as well. But I guess you'll excuse the piece of piss yet again.

[Edited 9/16/18 11:59am]

[Edited 9/16/18 12:00pm]

It never ceases to amaze me how cruel humans can be against fellow humans and animals, especially when in the pursuit of money and power.
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Reply #292 posted 09/16/18 12:04pm

herb4

avatar

"Yeah, but Jones didn't explicitly tell or ask them to do that so he is not culpable. He just gave out their addresses and put the idea in people's heads that this was all a false flag so that's entirely cool" - some idiot probably soon

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Reply #293 posted 09/16/18 12:11pm

herb4

avatar

just lol

Creator of Pepe the Frog gets trial date in case against Alex Jones for copyright infringement

Furie has said he sued because he’s “dismayed by Pepe’s association with white supremacy, anti-Semitism, and the alt-right,” including unauthorized use of the image by President Donald Trump and his supporters, including Alex Jones.







https://www.splcenter.org...alex-jones

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Reply #294 posted 09/16/18 12:11pm

13cjk13

herb4 said:

I addressed everything you wrote and thought I was rather clear. I even pre-emptively rebutted your first point. Sorry you didn't like it. I feel the quotes speak for themselves and I explained why they're at best irresponsible and at worst incendiary and dangerous. Not on me if you can't see it or extract meaning from obvious dogwhistles.

And "A hill to die on" is an expression.

It’s a war metaphor, like “making your stand” or “drawing a line in the sand.” It means “do you really want to insist on your point of view about this?”

Apparently you do.

YOU: "Why won't anyone address my questions and statements?!?"

THREAD: *people repeatedly address your statements and add some thoughts of their own*

YOU: "Why are you saying this or that? I didn't even mention those things!"

THREAD: Damn, dude. That's kind of fucked up logic"

YOU: Cursing invalidates and weakens your argument .

No it does not. Also fuck Alex Jones and anyone defending him.

Moving forward, I'll make sure to ONLY stick to your line of rhetoric and allow YOU EXCLUSIVELY to frame the terms of the debate, making sure to limit my thoughts and ideas on the issue no matter how relevant to the discussion they might be.

So Alex Jones and people like him essentially have to explicitely say "Hey, listeners, go run over someone with a car, shoot up a pizza joint and kill a journalist" in order for you to cede any incitement to violence? Good to know. Still not sure why this minor semantic difference is the breaking point for you but at least you've been clear about it. I think it's a moronic distinction, myself, but others may disagree. There's no "slippery slope" at work here surrounding freedom of speech no matter how much you infer that there is.

Oh, and here, lemme help you out.





clapping clapping

"Our liberty depends on the freedom of the press, and that cannot be limited without being lost".
-Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #295 posted 09/16/18 1:07pm

djThunderfunk

avatar

herb4 said:

I addressed everything you wrote and thought I was rather clear. I even pre-emptively rebutted your first point. Sorry you didn't like it. I feel the quotes speak for themselves and I explained why they're at best irresponsible and at worst incendiary and dangerous. Not on me if you can't see it or extract meaning from obvious dogwhistles.

None of your quotes are examples of Jones inciting people to harass Sandy Hook parents. None. They're on unrelated topics.

And "A hill to die on" is an expression.

It’s a war metaphor, like “making your stand” or “drawing a line in the sand.” It means “do you really want to insist on your point of view about this?”

Apparently you do.

lol

YOU: "Why won't anyone address my questions and statements?!?"

THREAD: *people repeatedly address your statements and add some thoughts of their own*

Show me where anybody has addressed the issue the tech companies face. Show me anybody even expressed understanding of the issue. All I see is "private companies" & "terms of service", nothing about the rights and responsiblities issues, nothing about the differences between a utility and a publisher and how so far they've enjoyed the benefit of both and the responsibilities of neither. Just "what don't you get?" & "they're PRIVATE companies".

YOU: "Why are you saying this or that? I didn't even mention those things!"

THREAD: Damn, dude. That's kind of fucked up logic"

It's "fucked up" to point out that the strawman logic being used against me does not represent what I've said? LOL! Right on, buddy!!


Guess it's also "fucked up" to object when someone flat out lies, about what I said and doubles down continuing to do so? To whit:


YOU: Cursing invalidates and weakens your argument .

No it does not. Also fuck Alex Jones and anyone defending him.

Still lying about what I said about the cursing? Unfuckingbelievable! You know all of it is still here for anybody to read, right?

Moving forward, I'll make sure to ONLY stick to your line of rhetoric and allow YOU EXCLUSIVELY to frame the terms of the debate, making sure to limit my thoughts and ideas on the issue no matter how relevant to the discussion they might be.

Right. Pointing out you're ignoring arguments is the same as demanding how you can argue. Sure, whatevs dude.

So Alex Jones and people like him essentially have to explicitely say "Hey, listeners, go run over someone with a car, shoot up a pizza joint and kill a journalist" in order for you to cede any incitement to violence? Good to know. Still not sure why this minor semantic difference is the breaking point for you but at least you've been clear about it. I think it's a moronic distinction, myself, but others may disagree. There's no "slippery slope" at work here surrounding freedom of speech no matter how much you infer that there is.

I don't know what he said that made him responsible for the people that harassed the parents. I'm still waiting to find that out. So far, I haven't seen it in the media or in any of your quotes.

Oh, and here, lemme help you out.



Here is an example of inciting harassment:

Maxine Waters: "If you see anybody from that cabinet in a restaurant, in a department store, at a gasoline station, you get out and you create a crowd and you push back on them and you tell them that they're not welcome anymore, anywhere."



We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #296 posted 09/16/18 1:16pm

djThunderfunk

avatar

maplenpg said:

Harassment of Sandy Hook families

According to Jones, the school shooting was a hoax, and the corpses of the children were in fact child actors playing roles. The families of the murdered children, according to Jones, were complicit in this liberal anti-gun plot, and he has helpfully published their personal details,
according to an affidavit since filed by one of the families.

If Alex Jones "published their personal details" (I assume that means phone #'s, address, that kind of thing?) then he is FUCKED. I wonder why the media isn't showing that if it's true.

Millions of visitors to Jones's Infowars website have gobbled up this unspeakable lie, and some have made it their mission to track down and harass the families.



Lucy Richards was one of them.



Richards was sent to prison last summer after pleading guilty to making death threats against the family of Noah Pozner, a six-year-old cut down by mass murderer Adam Lanza's bullets at Sandy Hook. The judge who sentenced her told her the family's sad reality was the only reality, and that she was not entitled to her "alternative facts," a phrase famously invented by Trump shill Kellyanne​ Conway to defend her boss's presidential lies.



But Richards was only one of many in Jones's posse of gullible idiots. Together, they have hounded the Pozner family relentlessly, tracking them down every time they relocate to escape the harassment. The family now reportedly lives in a high-security community hundreds of kilometres from the cemetery where their little boy is buried. They no longer visit his grave, for fear of attracting more nasty attention.



Source: https://www.cbc.ca/news/o...-1.4776763




9 families have filed lawsuits against Jones as well. But I guess you'll excuse the piece of piss yet again.


The only thing I see in your entire post that Jones could be responsible for, IF TRUE, is the claim that he "published their personal details". The fact that he didn't believe the story is not evidence that he incited harassers.


WTH is a "piece of piss"? That's a new one! lol How does that even work?

We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #297 posted 09/16/18 1:19pm

djThunderfunk

avatar

herb4 said:

"Yeah, but Jones didn't explicitly tell or ask them to do that so he is not culpable. He just gave out their addresses and put the idea in people's heads that this was all a false flag so that's entirely cool" - some idiot probably soon


If he gave out addresses, that's not "cool". Putting "the idea in people's heads that this was all a false flag" does not make him responsible for their actions.


We were HERE, where were you?

4 those that knew the number and didn't call... fk all y'all!
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Reply #298 posted 09/16/18 3:55pm

herb4

avatar

djThunderfunk said:

herb4 said:

"Yeah, but Jones didn't explicitly tell or ask them to do that so he is not culpable. He just gave out their addresses and put the idea in people's heads that this was all a false flag so that's entirely cool" - some idiot probably soon


If he gave out addresses, that's not "cool". Putting "the idea in people's heads that this was all a false flag" does not make him responsible for their actions.



Called it. WTF are you even defending here? Whatever it is, it's a real bad look for you here and thankfully everyone can read it for themselves, including the shit you said and the stuff you're claiming no one has cited .

So if some radio host (or, say, you; some poster on an internet forum) falsely calls me a murdering child molestor and gives out my home address and place of employment, you're not culpable or complicit if some asshole comes and burns down my house? Seriously? That's your argument?

Jesus Christ, dude, I don't knwo waht else to say. I give up. You win the internet. Good job

You're really really bad at this but from an attrition standpoint you're amazing.

[Edited 9/16/18 15:59pm]

[Edited 9/16/18 16:01pm]

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Reply #299 posted 09/16/18 3:59pm

RodeoSchro

avatar

^Tl;dr.

Fat fuck Alex Jones still banned; still hasn’t sued.

Even though that fat fuck has not - and will not - sue, various people waste a lot of time on spurious “FREE SPEACH!!!1!1!!” arguments.

Hilarious!
Second Funkiest White Man in America

P&R's paladin
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