independent and unofficial
Prince fan community site
Sat 21st Oct 2017 5:11am
Welcome! Sign up or enter username and password to remember me
Forum jump
Forums > Politics & Religion > Hamza Yusuf calls out Atheists.
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Page 5 of 5 <12345
Reply   New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
Reply #120 posted 10/06/17 3:42pm

Cloudbuster

avatar

IanRG said:

Cloudbuster said:

So, which bullshit patriachy path do you want to take?

God has to be an alpha male, of course. It's the law.

.

Not and stay on topic, I can't. So briefly, where is this law?:

.

Not all religions have a male lead.

.

Yahweh is not male or female, the BS from the patriarchy is a reflection of the times and language. In French and German to this very day all those inanimate objects with a grammatical gender are also not an indication of patriarchy. Even when saying God, the Father Christians should not attribute any gender to this.

.

Jesus is male, this is a given.

.

The Holy Spirit is not male or female and whenever someone tries to attribute a gender, then God here is mostly seen as female, just as incorrectly as attributing a gender to Yahweh.

.

Allah is not male or female.

.

The Prophet is male, this a given.

.

The Buddha has been male and female

.

Brahman is genderless

.

Many other Hindu Gods are androgynous

.

Sure, the practice of religions, especially in the leadership roles, has and is, like so many other aspects of life, sexist.


What about Thor and his massive hammer?

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #121 posted 10/06/17 4:22pm

hausofmoi7

avatar

toejam said:



hausofmoi7 said:


You can be an atheist and also be channeling the God consciousness. You can be a theist and be channeling/serving evil. Whatever energy you tap into and are receptive to is inconsequential to your religious/spiritual belief.

.


Care to elaborate?


.


What is "God consciousness"?


.


Channeling of the higher source into the world through ourselves.
In Islam the belief that to channel God into the world is through "Taqwa" and that through obedience to religious doctrine you can serve God.

The belief of such is found throughout many spiritual belief systems.




You can also be an atheist and have integrity.



.
[Edited 10/6/17 17:49pm]
"It means finding the very human narrative of a man navigating between idealism and pragmatism, faith and politics, non-violence, the pitfalls of acclaim as the perils of rejection" – Lesley Hazleton on the first muslim, the prophet.
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #122 posted 10/06/17 6:28pm

IanRG

Cloudbuster said:

IanRG said:

.

Not and stay on topic, I can't. So briefly, where is this law?:

.

Not all religions have a male lead.

.

Yahweh is not male or female, the BS from the patriarchy is a reflection of the times and language. In French and German to this very day all those inanimate objects with a grammatical gender are also not an indication of patriarchy. Even when saying God, the Father Christians should not attribute any gender to this.

.

Jesus is male, this is a given.

.

The Holy Spirit is not male or female and whenever someone tries to attribute a gender, then God here is mostly seen as female, just as incorrectly as attributing a gender to Yahweh.

.

Allah is not male or female.

.

The Prophet is male, this a given.

.

The Buddha has been male and female

.

Brahman is genderless

.

Many other Hindu Gods are androgynous

.

Sure, the practice of religions, especially in the leadership roles, has and is, like so many other aspects of life, sexist.


What about Thor and his massive hammer?

.

Are we talking Marvel Universe? There is substantial sexism in this as well!

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #123 posted 10/06/17 6:32pm

Cloudbuster

avatar

IanRG said:

Are we talking Marvel Universe? There is substantial sexism in this as well!


Haven't yet ventured there. How much of a marvel is it?

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #124 posted 10/06/17 10:49pm

paisleypark4

avatar

hausofmoi7 said:

toejam said:

.

Care to elaborate?

.

What is "God consciousness"?

.

Channeling of the higher source into the world through ourselves. In Islam the belief that to channel God into the world is through "Taqwa" and that through obedience to religious doctrine you can serve God. The belief of such is found throughout many spiritual belief systems. You can also be an atheist and have integrity. . [Edited 10/6/17 17:49pm]

So you are saying..for example when I accidentally ran into someone with my car, a close friend of mine who just so happened to be a preacher was standing right at the corner and comforted me and the man who I hit...just 'by conincidence' or do things like this only strengthen that there is some type of things that we may not be able to grasp of this 'god conciousness'?

See these are conversations that I can't have with athiests.

Download all the shit hop that you can for your kids, neices, nephews, and their friends also. That will prevent them from going out and buying it and will prevent some shit hop sales. Every little bit helps - Andy
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemus
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #125 posted 10/07/17 6:05pm

Dasein

paisleypark4 said:

hausofmoi7 said:

toejam said: Channeling of the higher source into the world through ourselves. In Islam the belief that to channel God into the world is through "Taqwa" and that through obedience to religious doctrine you can serve God. The belief of such is found throughout many spiritual belief systems. You can also be an atheist and have integrity. . [Edited 10/6/17 17:49pm]

So you are saying..for example when I accidentally ran into someone with my car, a close friend of mine who just so happened to be a preacher was standing right at the corner and comforted me and the man who I hit...just 'by conincidence' or do things like this only strengthen that there is some type of things that we may not be able to grasp of this 'god conciousness'?

See these are conversations that I can't have with athiests.


It would have been a very nice coincidence for Hitler's dad to shoot his load containing Adolf
into the sink the night he impregnated Adolf's mother too, right? In other words: believers
in spiritual metaphysics can't have their cake and eat it too. Either those mysterious forces
which govern or effect temporality, causality, and reality are capricious assholes, or, you must
recognize that there is such a thing as fortunate and unfortunate events which essentially de-
pends upon the participant(s) involved in those events.

Your argument implies that purpose and teleology are intrinsic constituents of reality, yet there
is nothing which reveals this to be the case, at least in physics at this very moment. Think about
it: do you really believe the man you hit with your car was comforted by your framing of what
occurred to him?: "Well, there had to be a reason that I hit you with my car. And, be thankful
that a preacher, instead of a doctor or nurse, was present nearby to offer aid during this emer-
gency."

C'mon, Paisley - what you're saying here is short-sighted spiritual mumbo-jumbo. It's poetic,
and lyrical, but it doesn't make any sense and doesn't take into consideration how others view
the same event you've participated in.





[Edited 10/7/17 18:10pm]

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #126 posted 10/07/17 6:52pm

Dasein

^

Hell, I'd be more impressed if Paisley's narrative included the fact that Paisley hit the man near
a hospital's emergency rooom, or, if the actions that resulted in Paisley hitting the man with
a car actually resulted in Paisley not hitting the man with the car. Otherwise, Paisley striking the
man with a car with a pastor nearby is not enough to justify a "god consciousness" existing in
the world that is regulatory in some form or fashion.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #127 posted 10/08/17 2:27pm

toejam

avatar

hausofmoi7 said:

[God consciousness is] Channeling of the higher source into the world through ourselves. In Islam the belief that to channel God into the world is through "Taqwa" and that through obedience to religious doctrine you can serve God. The belief of such is found throughout many spiritual belief systems. You can also be an atheist and have integrity.

.

Are you suggesting that having integrity is consistent with having "God consciousness"?

.

Atheists don't believe in a "higher source" - at least not a theistic one. Unlike Muslims, atheists don't care to serve God because we don't see that he is there to serve. Personally, I think Allah is a superstition.

.

I guess I'm still lost on what you're saying "God consciousness" is, and what it means to have it... Seems a kind of fuzzy term to me...

.

How is "God consciousness" different, for example, from "regular human consciousness"?

.

[Edited 10/8/17 19:20pm]

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #128 posted 10/09/17 8:57am

paisleypark4

avatar

Dasein said:

^

Hell, I'd be more impressed if Paisley's narrative included the fact that Paisley hit the man near
a hospital's emergency rooom, or, if the actions that resulted in Paisley hitting the man with
a car actually resulted in Paisley not hitting the man with the car. Otherwise, Paisley striking the
man with a car with a pastor nearby is not enough to justify a "god consciousness" existing in
the world that is regulatory in some form or fashion.

I see what you guys mean. That's exactly it "it doesnt make any sense" because you think rationally; which yes I get it. However, in my life if I were to look over odd things that happened in my life as just a cowiky-dink then what's the point of even living. I only provided one example however I have dozens of them.


I'm only accepting the fact that there is wisdom and knowledge beyond what I now as of now and always open to the opprotunity to learn and experience more than what is just served under a microscope. Both exist on the same place. You can't have one without the other. You have to believe science, you have to believe spirituality...TO ME at least. Both have their natural place in the human experience.

We believe things because or conciousness allows us to do such a thing, or else we would just be vegetables.

What's the scientific conundrum that explains how a human being channels their conciousness to create art, science and music? Answer: ......

Download all the shit hop that you can for your kids, neices, nephews, and their friends also. That will prevent them from going out and buying it and will prevent some shit hop sales. Every little bit helps - Andy
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemus
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #129 posted 10/09/17 12:57pm

toejam

avatar

paisleypark4 said:

What's the scientific conundrum that explains how a human being channels their conciousness to create art, science and music? Answer: ......

.

Evolutionary biology can help explain why we have those abilities.

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #130 posted 10/09/17 1:32pm

paisleypark4

avatar

toejam said:

paisleypark4 said:

What's the scientific conundrum that explains how a human being channels their conciousness to create art, science and music? Answer: ......

.

Evolutionary biology can help explain why we have those abilities.

A person like Prince, who brought all of us here to even have this discission was a firm believer in there being more to life than what we only see and he was always a believer of both processes of life. Some of his last studies included astrology and the spiritual practice of the third eye.

If you don't feel a connection with Prince's music outside of scientific biology, then you might never know Prince at all.

Download all the shit hop that you can for your kids, neices, nephews, and their friends also. That will prevent them from going out and buying it and will prevent some shit hop sales. Every little bit helps - Andy
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemus
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #131 posted 10/09/17 2:00pm

toejam

avatar

I think Prince's religious and "spiritual" beliefs were largely superstitious, I hate to say.

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #132 posted 10/09/17 7:18pm

Dasein

toejam said:

I think Prince's religious and "spiritual" beliefs were largely superstitious, I hate to say.


In the five or six years we've been arguing, this is one of the few times I can say I totally
agree with you.

Prince's religious and spiritual beliefs can be attributed, in some part, to his premature death. That
being said, I didn't know him personally and I am sure his religious and spiritual beliefs possibly up-
held him at some points during his life too, including those moments when he was in the throes of
his substance use issues.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #133 posted 10/09/17 7:41pm

Dasein

paisleypark4 said:

Dasein said:

^

Hell, I'd be more impressed if Paisley's narrative included the fact that Paisley hit the man near
a hospital's emergency rooom, or, if the actions that resulted in Paisley hitting the man with
a car actually resulted in Paisley not hitting the man with the car. Otherwise, Paisley striking the
man with a car with a pastor nearby is not enough to justify a "god consciousness" existing in
the world that is regulatory in some form or fashion.

I see what you guys mean. That's exactly it "it doesnt make any sense" because you think rationally; which yes I get it. However, in my life if I were to look over odd things that happened in my life as just a cowiky-dink then what's the point of even living. I only provided one example however I have dozens of them.


I'm only accepting the fact that there is wisdom and knowledge beyond what I now as of now and always open to the opprotunity to learn and experience more than what is just served under a microscope. Both exist on the same place. You can't have one without the other. You have to believe science, you have to believe spirituality...TO ME at least. Both have their natural place in the human experience.

We believe things because or conciousness allows us to do such a thing, or else we would just be vegetables.

What's the scientific conundrum that explains how a human being channels their conciousness to create art, science and music? Answer: ......


Overlooking your use of the word "believe" which can muddy things epistemologically, yes, I do
agree with you here.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #134 posted 10/10/17 7:43am

2freaky4church
1

avatar

Karen Armstrong has a good book on the Bible.

"2freaky is a complete stud." DJ
"2freaky is very down." 2Elijah.
"2freaky convinced me to join Antifa: OnlyNDA
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #135 posted 10/11/17 2:52pm

Dasein

So does Francesca Stavrakopoulou.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Page 5 of 5 <12345
Reply   New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Forums > Politics & Religion > Hamza Yusuf calls out Atheists.