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Thread started 03/09/06 10:31am

SlamGlam

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Roe V Wade for MEN

http://www.nbc17.com/news...etail.html


Father's Rights? Men Want Right To Turn Down Fatherhood
Group Wants Same Rights As Women



NEW YORK -- A group of men's rights activists will file a lawsuit Thursday aimed at giving men a chance to opt out of financial responsibility for raising a child.

The group argues that women have more options than they do in the event of an unintended pregnancy.

The gist of the argument: If a pregnant woman can choose among abortion, adoption or raising a child, a man involved in an unintended pregnancy should have the choice of declining the financial responsibilities of fatherhood.

The National Center for Men has nicknamed the lawsuit Roe v. Wade for Men.

They plan to file the lawsuit in U.S. District Court in Michigan on behalf of a 25-year-old Saginaw man ordered to pay child support for his ex-girlfriend's daughter. The man contends that his ex knew he didn't want to have a child with her and assured him repeatedly that -- because of a physical condition -- she could not get pregnant.

The suit also addresses the issue of male reproductive rights. They believe that lack of such rights violates the U.S. Constitution's equal protection clause.

The activists involved hope to spark discussion even if they lose.

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Reply #1 posted 03/09/06 10:37am

SupaFunkyOrgan
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Women who trap men or try and hold on to them through a pregancy are evil. I support this all the way.

2009: Mermaids and Dolphins...
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Reply #2 posted 03/09/06 10:46am

SlamGlam

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Women who trap men or try and hold on to them through a pregancy are evil. I support this all the way.



how do you trap a guy into making you pregnant? even if she lied about being on the pill or being infertal he still put his 7" in the computer.

as far as his repoductive rights go... men only have the choice over what goes in or out of their body... what happens as a result of nature after it leaves him is out of his hands. actions have consaquences and resposobilites come with some of them.

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Reply #3 posted 03/09/06 10:51am

SupaFunkyOrgan
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SlamGlam said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Women who trap men or try and hold on to them through a pregancy are evil. I support this all the way.



how do you trap a guy into making you pregnant? even if she lied about being on the pill or being infertal he still put his 7" in the computer.

as far as his repoductive rights go... men only have the choice over what goes in or out of their body... what happens as a result of nature after it leaves him is out of his hands. actions have consaquences and resposobilites come with some of them.


In all matters of life it's not right to lie to another person. If a car dealership lies to you about the quailty of the car they sell you, you have recourse. If you buy a house from someone and they lie about the condition of the house you have recourse.

Just because there is a reaction to the action does not make it right for the man to be manipulated. And if we are going to dismiss women lying, cheating and caniving to get pregnant against their partners will then we shouldn't bitch when women are lied, cheated and canived against.

As for responsibility, if a woman is knowingly trying to trap a man through a pregancy she should be on her fuckin own.

[Edited 3/9/06 10:52am]
[Edited 3/9/06 10:53am]

2009: Mermaids and Dolphins...
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Reply #4 posted 03/09/06 10:54am

SlamGlam

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you are just wrong on this case. if you have sex with a woman there is a risk she might get pregnant. that is a risk the GUY takes.

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Reply #5 posted 03/09/06 10:56am

morningsong

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lurking couch coke

Never again, not I.
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Reply #6 posted 03/09/06 10:56am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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SlamGlam said:

you are just wrong on this case. if you have sex with a woman there is a risk she might get pregnant. that is a risk the GUY takes.


And it's a risk the woman takes as well. If someone does not want to be a parent and they take the necessary means not to become one, if a woman is lying and caniving to get pregnant, regardless of whether or not the mans action resulted in preganncy that was not his intent and he should not be enslaved and abused by this woman.

And just because someone gets pregnant does not mean they have to carry it to term. That is what abortion is for nod

.
[Edited 3/9/06 10:58am]

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Reply #7 posted 03/09/06 11:02am

SlamGlam

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

And it's a risk the woman takes as well. If someone does not want to be a parent and they take the necessary means not to become one, if a woman is lying and caniving to get pregnant, regardless of whether or not the mans action resulted in preganncy that was not his intent and he should not be enslaved and abused by this woman.


yeah but the risk is offset by the LAW that says the other parent has to pay child support. And you KNOW that some woman pay it to men. and it has ZERO to do with the intent. please think about that... you can not mean that.

it seems that you do not belive in consaquences or resposobility at any level.

And just because someone gets pregnant does not mean they have to carry it to term. That is what abortion is for nod


yeah but it is called pro-CHOICE because it is HER choice and her's alone

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Reply #8 posted 03/09/06 11:04am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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SlamGlam said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

And it's a risk the woman takes as well. If someone does not want to be a parent and they take the necessary means not to become one, if a woman is lying and caniving to get pregnant, regardless of whether or not the mans action resulted in preganncy that was not his intent and he should not be enslaved and abused by this woman.


yeah but the risk is offset by the LAW that says the other parent has to pay child support. And you KNOW that some woman pay it to men. and it has ZERO to do with the intent. please think about that... you can not mean that.

it seems that you do not belive in consaquences or resposobility at any level.

And just because someone gets pregnant does not mean they have to carry it to term. That is what abortion is for nod


yeah but it is called pro-CHOICE because it is HER choice and her's alone


Abortion is responsibility. Get over yourself. It's irresponsible to bring life into the world that you will not or cannot properly care for.

If a woman canives and lies to get pregnant, she should be on her own.

2009: Mermaids and Dolphins...
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Reply #9 posted 03/09/06 11:11am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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SlamGlam said:


it seems that you do not belive in consaquences or resposobility at any level.


I work, I pay my bills, I even help my sister take care of her children...something their own father doesn't do. Don't talk down to me about my level of responsibility.

2009: Mermaids and Dolphins...
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Reply #10 posted 03/09/06 11:18am

PANDURITO

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I'm with Supa on this nod

You owe me $5. I caught the big fish....again lol
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Reply #11 posted 03/09/06 11:31am

ehuffnsd

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i have to agree with supa

it is necessary to help others, not only in our prayers, but in our daily lives. If we find we cannot help others, the least we can do is to desist from harming them.
Dalai Lama
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Reply #12 posted 03/09/06 11:33am

SlamGlam

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

SlamGlam said:


it seems that you do not belive in consaquences or resposobility at any level.


I work, I pay my bills, I even help my sister take care of her children...something their own father doesn't do. Don't talk down to me about my level of responsibility.



well if the father did how much better off would their child be? it is still crap. the man's rights only cover what is in his body. JUST like a woman. once it is out the choice window is closed. It MAY be unfair but it is MUCH MUCH More unfair to the child.

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Reply #13 posted 03/09/06 11:36am

ehuffnsd

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SlamGlam said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:



I work, I pay my bills, I even help my sister take care of her children...something their own father doesn't do. Don't talk down to me about my level of responsibility.



well if the father did how much better off would their child be? it is still crap. the man's rights only cover what is in his body. JUST like a woman. once it is out the choice window is closed. It MAY be unfair but it is MUCH MUCH More unfair to the child.



it's best for the child to be raised in an unhealthy enivornment where both parents are bitter and or fighting and causing stress for the kid? the constant struggle to keep some kind normalcy loses and the child ends up fucked up?

it is necessary to help others, not only in our prayers, but in our daily lives. If we find we cannot help others, the least we can do is to desist from harming them.
Dalai Lama
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Reply #14 posted 03/09/06 11:37am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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ehuffnsd said:

SlamGlam said:




well if the father did how much better off would their child be? it is still crap. the man's rights only cover what is in his body. JUST like a woman. once it is out the choice window is closed. It MAY be unfair but it is MUCH MUCH More unfair to the child.



it's best for the child to be raised in an unhealthy enivornment where both parents are bitter and or fighting and causing stress for the kid? the constant struggle to keep some kind normalcy loses and the child ends up fucked up?


Societies problems do not just appear out of nowhere.....

2009: Mermaids and Dolphins...
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Reply #15 posted 03/09/06 11:39am

ehuffnsd

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

ehuffnsd said:




it's best for the child to be raised in an unhealthy enivornment where both parents are bitter and or fighting and causing stress for the kid? the constant struggle to keep some kind normalcy loses and the child ends up fucked up?


Societies problems do not just appear out of nowhere.....


yes they do... it's gays and evolution that has caused it.

it is necessary to help others, not only in our prayers, but in our daily lives. If we find we cannot help others, the least we can do is to desist from harming them.
Dalai Lama
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Reply #16 posted 03/09/06 11:44am

SlamGlam

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it all is summed up by the idea "my body my choice" the man has the right to not make a baby by keeping his sperm in his body or at least away from a woman's eggs. Once he waves that right it is gone. just like if a woman gets pregnant and waves the right to have an abortion until the baby is born; it is too late the window is closed. at that point the woman can say "i do not want the baby" and then the father can say "i will take it" and then force the mother to pay child support.

it is as far as it can be given how babies are formed.

now the case of a frozen enbryo: both have equal say in what happens to them. the man can stop her or anyone else from using them. just like the woman can stop him from having them put into another woman. it is all as fair as it can be.

both have rights once it is out it is too late.

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Reply #17 posted 03/09/06 11:53am

SlamGlam

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:



Abortion is responsibility. Get over yourself. It's irresponsible to bring life into the world that you will not or cannot properly care for.


i did not intined to say it was not. i guess it is... what i meant was the father's resposobility. ask your sister how she feels about this? That IF she could get the child support and still not have to see him and there were no other changes to the situation.. just the money... would she take it?



If a woman canives and lies to get pregnant, she should be on her own.


for one: lets keep in mind that in this case that 'her lies' are what he said...but so what she lied? is that a legal defence?

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Reply #18 posted 03/09/06 11:54am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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SlamGlam said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:



I work, I pay my bills, I even help my sister take care of her children...something their own father doesn't do. Don't talk down to me about my level of responsibility.



well if the father did how much better off would their child be? it is still crap. the man's rights only cover what is in his body. JUST like a woman. once it is out the choice window is closed. It MAY be unfair but it is MUCH MUCH More unfair to the child.


Resentful and bitter fathers aren't fair for children either.

2009: Mermaids and Dolphins...
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Reply #19 posted 03/09/06 11:56am

HiinEnkelte

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Women who trap men or try and hold on to them through a pregancy are evil. I support this all the way.


why does it need to be "a trap" for you to sympathise or show any support?

why couldn't it be the case that they used contraceptives, they failed, and he doesn't want any liability for the child that she chooses to birth from her body?
[Edited 3/9/06 11:57am]

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Reply #20 posted 03/09/06 11:56am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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SlamGlam said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:



Abortion is responsibility. Get over yourself. It's irresponsible to bring life into the world that you will not or cannot properly care for.


i did not intined to say it was not. i guess it is... what i meant was the father's resposobility. ask your sister how she feels about this? That IF she could get the child support and still not have to see him and there were no other changes to the situation.. just the money... would she take it?



If a woman canives and lies to get pregnant, she should be on her own.


for one: lets keep in mind that in this case that 'her lies' are what he said...but so what she lied? is that a legal defence?


So what she lied? Why shouldn't that be a legal defense? It is for myriads of other laws in this land. It's called fraud.

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Reply #21 posted 03/09/06 11:58am

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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HiinEnkelte said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

Women who trap men or try and hold on to them through a pregancy are evil. I support this all the way.


why does it need to be "a trap" for you to sympathise or show any support?

why couldn't it be the case that they used contraceptives, they failed, and he doesn't want any liability for the child that she chooses to birth from her body?


If she chooses to continue the pregnancy despite all evidence that point to the fact that they didn't want children and that is why they used contraceptives, since it is her choice on whether or not to continue the pregnancy then no, I do not agree that a man should not have a choice in that situation. She knows he doesn't want to be a father but she holds the cards and therefore should shoulder the responsibility on her own. nod

.
[Edited 3/9/06 11:59am]

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Reply #22 posted 03/09/06 12:01pm

SlamGlam

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

SlamGlam said:



for one: lets keep in mind that in this case that 'her lies' are what he said...but so what she lied? is that a legal defence?


So what she lied? Why shouldn't that be a legal defense? It is for myriads of other laws in this land. It's called fraud.



And i KNOW where you are comming from on this. i see it... i am just not convinced. first the man has to prove to a judge that she lied. if he can do that... i would have sympathy for him then.

but do you think that a guy should just be able to OPT out of child support becasue he changed his mind?

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Reply #23 posted 03/09/06 12:02pm

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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SlamGlam said:

SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:



So what she lied? Why shouldn't that be a legal defense? It is for myriads of other laws in this land. It's called fraud.



And i KNOW where you are comming from on this. i see it... i am just not convinced. first the man has to prove to a judge that she lied. if he can do that... i would have sympathy for him then.

but do you think that a guy should just be able to OPT out of child support becasue he changed his mind?


For me it really depends on the situation.

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Reply #24 posted 03/09/06 12:20pm

SlamGlam

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:


For me it really depends on the situation.



so if there is some CLEAR case of the woman trying to trap or trick him into thinking pregnancy was not a risk you would side with the male?

but if he was just a player that just did not want to take resposobility would you give him the opt out option?

(remember that if a woman has a baby and then decides not to keep it the father can take the baby and make her pay child support... should she be able to then opt out?)

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Reply #25 posted 03/09/06 12:25pm

HiinEnkelte

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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said:

HiinEnkelte said:



why does it need to be "a trap" for you to sympathise or show any support?

why couldn't it be the case that they used contraceptives, they failed, and he doesn't want any liability for the child that she chooses to birth from her body?


If she chooses to continue the pregnancy despite all evidence that point to the fact that they didn't want children and that is why they used contraceptives, since it is her choice on whether or not to continue the pregnancy then no, I do not agree that a man should not have a choice in that situation. She knows he doesn't want to be a father but she holds the cards and therefore should shoulder the responsibility on her own. nod



why does he need evidence for not wanting the child beforehand? why can't he just change his mind? where's his freedom to choose? i mean he's not even killing the clump of cells in her, he's just living out exactly what the liberated women today sing out, that it is not his anyway. i mean if she freely wnat him to be part of her cellular clump then great, if not then he shouldn't be forced to be liable in name or act in anyway. i mean how horrible is that? for a person to be forced to be part of a child's life?? no child deserves that, and who knows, maybe it's even better and more merciful to kill any child rather than have that child forced into a situation with an unwilling parent.

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Chains We Can Bereave In

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Reply #26 posted 03/09/06 12:28pm

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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HiinEnkelte said:

and who knows, maybe it's even better and more merciful to kill any child rather than have that child forced into a situation with an unwilling parent.


Actually, you are right nod

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Reply #27 posted 03/09/06 12:36pm

SlamGlam

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HiinEnkelte said:



why does he need evidence for not wanting the child beforehand? why can't he just change his mind? .



his choice only covers what is IN his body not what is out of it. so he choose to release his seed... his right to choose is over. just like once the baby is born the mother no longer has the choice. like i said: she could say "i do not want the baby" and then the father could take it and force her to pay support.

it is all as fair as nature will allow. is seems like some men just do not want to pay for their choices.

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Reply #28 posted 03/09/06 12:41pm

CptMorgan

The laws are so slanted toward women on this it is ridiculous. I am paying child support for a kid that is not mine the mother finally admits that it is not mine. But I still have to pay arrears child support to the tune of $30,000. All a woman has to do in CA is file a claim; if you are out of state when she does all she has t do is say she does not know where you are. The state does even try to find you. When you move back to the state and try to get your drivers license they hit you for back child support plus interest.

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Reply #29 posted 03/09/06 12:43pm

SupaFunkyOrgan
grinderSexy

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CptMorgan said:

The laws are so slanted toward women on this it is ridiculous. I am paying child support for a kid that is not mine the mother finally admits that it is not mine. But I still have to pay arrears child support to the tune of $30,000. All a woman has to do in CA is file a claim; if you are out of state when she does all she has t do is say she does not know where you are. The state does even try to find you. When you move back to the state and try to get your drivers license they hit you for back child support plus interest.

THIS IS THE KIND OF SHIT I'M TALKING ABOUT! No matter the innocence of the child and no matter the interest of the child, men should not be raped by the women and the state in that child's interest. That lying bitch should have to pay back all the child support and support the kid on her OWN.

Men should have recourse against this kind of fraud.

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